A Green And Pleasant Land

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: Before 1900' started by VVD0D95, Jun 28, 2019.

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  1. Threadmarks: Chapter 1: Alexander's Marriages

    VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    A Green and Pleasant Land



    Chapter 1: Alexander’s Marriages



    December, 1283


    Alexander, King of Scots, of the mighty Dunkeld dynasty looked at his ministers and he wanted to scream. He was one of only two members of the Dunkeld dynasty left alive. His eldest and only surviving son Alexander, Lord of Mann being the other. It was a sharp contrast to how things had been at the beginning of the decade, where he’d had not only Alexander, but also his son David and his daughter Margaret. Something that had more than made up for the loss of his beloved wife Margaret. Now, it was just him and his eldest. That needed to change. He knew what would happen if he and his son died without heirs, there would be chaos and war.

    He cleared his throat and began. “My son requires a bride. He is nineteen summers old now, and thus is of the right age to marry. I had asked for you all to come with appropriate candidates in mind and I will hear your choices now.”

    John Comyn, Lord of Badenoch and a man Alexander had come to trust spoke first. “Sire, it seems prudent to me that given our trade links with the Low Countries that we arrange a marriage between our Prince and a member of said region. Personally, I would recommend Margaret of Flanders, daughter of Guy, Count of Flanders. She might be young but she comes from an illustrious and fertile family.”

    Alexander looked at Comyn, and asked. “When you say she is young, how young exactly is she?” He did not want a child for his son, he remembered what his own marriage had been like as a child and the thought of doing that to his own son repelled him.

    “She has only recently turned to eleven, Sire.” Comyn said. “But she is by all accounts a healthy and beautiful child.”

    Alexander shook his head. “No, I shall not have that. We need heirs immediately, not in five years’ time.”

    James Stewart, High Steward and another man that Alexander trusted spoke. “Sire, I have a suggestion if I might?”

    “Go ahead.” Alexander commanded.

    “Sire, Berwick is flourishing, but at present there seems to be tension between England and France, we cannot afford to lose out on the valuable trade routes that England provides, therefore I would recommend a marriage between the Prince and Elizabeth of England, the daughter of King Edward.” James Stewart said.

    Alexander considered it, he knew his brother by marriage was a good man and good relations between their two nations was important, but still, there was something about another English marriage that did not sit too well with him. “She is also another child, I will say it again, that I do not want another child bride to be wed to the heir of Scotland. We need a bride who will be able to have children as soon as possible.”

    “What of Marie of Brittany, then Sire?” Thomas Durward asked. Durward was the son of the man who had mentored Alexander when he was a child, he had displayed a head for numbers and therefore instead of executing him, Alexander had kept him on.

    “How old is she?” Alexander asked. Brittany had potential, the Duke was close to Edward, but was not completely in his thrall, furthermore, Brittany was thriving right now, trade links with them would not go amiss.

    “She is fifteen, Sire, but she is ready for consummation, according to my friends in the court of the Duke.” Durward said.

    Alexander mulled that over, Brittany was wealthy, and if the girl was ready for marriage, that could make things ever more interesting. However, before he could say anything, John Comyn spoke. “Sire, whilst Brittany might provide an interesting marriage, the girl is still young and therefore given to the frailties of childbirth at such a young age. Might I recommend someone slightly older and more likely to survive?”

    “Who did you have in mind?” Alexander asked.

    “Princess Sancha of Portugal, Sire.” Comyn said. “Her father was one of the wealthiest men in all of Christendom, and Portugal has its own independent trade routes which would not make us reliant on England.”

    Alexander thought on that. “Her mother was quite fertile was she not?” He remembered being quite impressed by the number of children the woman had managed to give birth to who had survived.

    “Yes, Sire. And her brother has also had a lot of children with his wife.” Comyn said.

    Alexander mulled it over and then replied. “Then Portugal it is, send word to our ambassador there, tell him to approach the matter with delicacy.”
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2019
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  2. procrastinating2much Well-Known Member

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    Looks great! Can’t wait to see how it plays out!
     
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  3. VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    Glad you like it
     
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  4. Ivan Lupo Well-Known Member

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    Watched for sure. I know ostensibly this is about Scotland and Alexander's dynasty, but my boy Longshanks and his girl Eleanor don't seem to figure in very many TLs like this, so I definitely need to check this out even if they're side characters.
     
  5. VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    You won’t be disappointed I can promise that
     
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  6. Tyler96 Well-Known Member

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    So you've started this one up.

    Interesting to see where it goes.
     
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  7. kasumigenx Well-Known Member

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    Eleanor is already the Queen of Aragon, she just needs to meet her groom in person.
     
  8. VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    Something which will likely not happen given the circumstances
     
  9. kasumigenx Well-Known Member

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    But she had a Proxy marriage and she was not able to meet her husband before he died, this marriage would only be stopped if one of the parties cancelled the engagement before the Proxy marriage.
     
  10. VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    And there's nothing to suggest the marriage will go ahead compared to otl, especially as his family is still under papal censure etc
     
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  11. Threadmarks: Chapter 2: Denis The Wise

    VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    Chapter 2: Denis The Wise



    February, 1284



    Denis sighed, another lot of letters that would need to be edited and re-written. Sometimes he wondered if the members of his chancery did this deliberately, if they were in league with the Church in trying to undermine his authority. He always dismissed that thought as ridiculous though, knowing that if he pursued that line of thought madness lay. He looked through the documents and then at his ministers.

    “Why is it that the letters redrawing the boundaries of the nobles’ lands and the lands of the crown are not here?” He asked.

    John, Lord of Lusa and his main clerk looked nervous. “Sire, the letters had to be redrafted again.”

    “And why was I not told of this?” Denis demanded, fighting to keep his voice calm.

    “Sire, it was not thought worthwhile disturbing you from your other works. It was only a minor change that was needed.” Lusa responded.

    “And what was this change?” Denis demanded. He wanted to know whether they were deliberately changing what he had written down or whether he had made some error in the spelling.

    “It was a phrase, Sire.” Lusa responded. “The phrase was about the boundaries, it made it seem as though the boundaries were fluid, we are changing it to make sure that the phrase confirms the presence everlasting of the boundaries.”

    Denis did not trust Lusa, but he was content enough to concede. “Very well, though I shall want to see the letters before they are sent out.”

    “Yes, Your Majesty.” Lusa said bowing his head.

    Denis then picked up another series of documents and read through them. “I see that the Count of Barcelos has finally acknowledged that he was in the wrong to withhold the payments.” Barcelos was such an aggravating person, a man who knew when he was right and when he was wrong, but who often thought he was right more than he was wrong.

    “Yes, Sire.” Lusa said. “We managed to convince the Count that there was no need for him to shift and change as much as he had in the past.”

    “Good, we shall need his services before the year has begun properly.” Denis said.

    “Sire?” Lusa sputtered.

    “Yes?” Denis asked raising an eyebrow.

    “Are you sure that is a wise idea? Barcelos is a radical man who veers from side to side.” Lusa said.

    “And that is exactly why we want him here. The more radical he is, the more he will ensure that his fellows fall into line.” Denis replied. Before Lusa could respond, Denis looked at the herald at the door and gestured for him to let their guest come in. The doors opened and the herald announced.

    “Malise, Earl of Strathearn.” The man who entered was big, broad and red of hair. He looked like some sort of giant. Denis rose and nodded to the man, thankful that the man knew Latin.

    “Lord Strathearn,” Denis said. “I hear you have come with a proposal from your King.”

    “Yes Sire,” the man answered gruffly. “I have come to present an offer of marriage from His Majesty King Alexander.”

    Denis raised an eyebrow. Scotland was a distant Kingdom and one he had never before considered as worthwhile, but if there was a chance of making one of his family a Queen he would never not listen. “Go on.” He ordered.

    “Sire, my King wishes to offer the hand of his son, Alexander, Prince of Scotland to your sister Her Highness, Sancha, Princess of Portugal. He believes that such a marriage would bring benefits to both our Kingdoms.” Strathearn replied.

    Denis considered this. Scotland was out of the way, a small Kingdom on an island dominated by England. However, as he thought about that, he thought on something his father had said long ago. If they could bring Scotland out of that axis involving England and Castile, then perhaps they could have a very helpful trading partner and a place where they could place their goods without the tariffs. He looked at Strathearn and said. “I believe that such a marriage would be beneficial to both our Kingdoms. Tell your King I consent to this marriage.” He looked back at Lusa and indicated the man should draw up a treaty.

    Strathearn looked delighted. “Thank you, Sire, I shall tell my King at once.” With that the man bowed and left the room.

    Denis turned to Lusa and said. “Make it so that the King of Scotland must accept a free trade agreement. That will give us countless riches.”

    “Yes, Sire.” Lusa said.
     
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  12. chateauroux Well-Known Member

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    Really enjoying this! Please keep it coming!
     
  13. VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    Cheers glad you’re liking it :)

    Any suggestions or comments for what you’d like to see are appreciated :£
     
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  14. chateauroux Well-Known Member

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    A more powerful and influential Scotland would be interesting - and the resulting effect on its relationship with England. Also it would be nice for Margaret the maid of Norway to have a long and interesting life!
     
  15. VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    Oh Margaret will for sure
     
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  16. VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    Does anyone happen to know what Alphonso earl of Chester fell ill with?
     
  17. Ivan Lupo Well-Known Member

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    Nobody really knows, but it appears he fell ill after or during a travel to somewhere near Wales in order to be closer to where his parents were, as Edward was still handling business there and Eleanor likely still recovering from her pregnancy with her son Edward. About to get married within months to Margaret of Holland too, they were working on completing the Alphonso Psalter before abandoning it, which they ended up finishing when Elizabeth of Rhuddlan eventually married John of Holland.
     
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  18. VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    Hmm alright, it seems an easily butterfliable thing.
     
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  19. Ivan Lupo Well-Known Member

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    Very easily. I believe I read in Sara Cockerill's "The Shadow Queen" that Edward and Eleanor had high hopes for Alphonso and that his tutors were insisting he was a little genius in the making. Which isn't that surprising considering Eleanor, her half-brother Alfonso X, and her father San Fernando were all very intelligent and well-educated. Alphonso's education would have been top-notch and it's likely he would have been multilingual, certainly English, French, and Latin, and possibly even Castilian. His survival is deeply intriguing.
     
  20. VVD0D95 Lemmy is God.

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    Should I go through with that for this then?
     
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