A Greater Dar al-Islam and an Ever Shrinking Dar al-Harb / a resurgent Islam TL

Maybe the Pope strikes a deal with a Muslim warlord and declares them the Western Roman Emperor in exchange for protection against the Lombards and Byzantines and giving them control over a large chunk of Italy. Just to really troll the Byzantines.
 
I've already decided that the Byzantines will not reach the modern era, but the questions I'm still working on are: when do they get conquered; who are they conquered by; and to what extent do their conquerors claim Roman continuity? I don't want a copy of the Ottomans, but beyond that I'm still thinking.
Depends, Ummayd might have claimed than their Caliphate would become the Muslim Rome(conquering the second, just the first one remaind), Abbasaid might be mixed, for them would finish the Rashidun work as they beat the Sassaniads and now the beat the Rum...

Maybe the Pope strikes a deal with a Muslim warlord and declares them the Western Roman Emperor in exchange for protection against the Lombards and Byzantines and giving them control over a large chunk of Italy. Just to really troll the Byzantines.
That would be so funny if happen..maybe Poland Goes Orthodox?
 
That would be so funny if happen..maybe Poland Goes Orthodox?

This is well before the Great Schism, ther might not be an Orthodox-Catholic divide at all. Perhaps seeing the Pope subordinate himself to a heathen, the rest of Christendom break away. Thus the Pope, becomes defined as the head of Christian Church under Islamic rule, while independent Christian realms maintain their own church hierarchy.
 
Flavius Josephus Abderraman Firius, Vali of Andalusia, Restitutor Occidentalis, has a good ring to it. It would be bad politics to assume the title of Roman Emperor if you're technically on paper a subordinate of the Caliphate.
 
Flavius Josephus Abderraman Firius, Vali of Andalusia, Restitutor Occidentalis, has a good ring to it. It would be bad politics to assume the title of Roman Emperor if you're technically on paper a subordinate of the Caliphate.
I'm playing with the idea of Charlemagne becoming Muslim (presumably by being sent as a hostage to al-Andalus) but I think that might be too much memes.
 
I'm playing with the idea of Charlemagne becoming Muslim (presumably by being sent as a hostage to al-Andalus) but I think that might be too much memes.

Could be a Lombard noble who's exiled to Al-Andalus and converts.


I once conquered Frankia in CK2 as the Caliphate when I got an exiled Charlemagne to convert to Islam, landed him in Greece (I'd already taken the Byzantines) and pressed his claims.
 
I'm playing with the idea of Charlemagne becoming Muslim (presumably by being sent as a hostage to al-Andalus) but I think that might be too much memes.
Must be one of the child of the Pippin family them...are not the Merogivean still alive? would be the mother of all ironies if we got a Muslim Clovis finally getting back his kingdom from the Pippins

This is well before the Great Schism, ther might not be an Orthodox-Catholic divide at all. Perhaps seeing the Pope subordinate himself to a heathen, the rest of Christendom break away. Thus the Pope, becomes defined as the head of Christian Church under Islamic rule, while independent Christian realms maintain their own church hierarchy.
Nicea already happened, The Pope Superiority and the other archbishop challenged it already happened, iconoclasm is happening, meaning both are already very divergent and different faiths, plus the mutual excommunication in 1000's was just a formality
 
Last edited:
Nicea already happened, The Pope Superiority and the other archbishop challenged it already happened, iconoclasm is happening, meaning both are already very divergent and different faiths, plus the mutual excommunication in 1000's was just a formality
I agree, though in this timeline, with Latin Christianity on the rocks, a reconciliation could certainly happen.
Though I'm not saying it will mind you.
 
I agree, though in this timeline, with Latin Christianity on the rocks, a reconciliation could certainly happen.
Though I'm not saying it will mind you.
Umm could be a path if allow the TL but again don't ignore how both branch didn't like the other that much.... still waiting to see what happen first both in Anatolia and Italian Peninsulas
 
PART 1 - The Frankish Civil War and its Consequences
The Frankish Civil War and its Consequences

The intermittent civil war between Neustria, Austrasia, and Bavaria had been ongoing since the death of Charles Martel in 737 CE. The sons of the former mayor of the palace had established themselves in the constituent realms of the former Frankish empire: Pippin as King of Neustria; Carloman as King of the Franks (in Austrasia); and Grifo spirited away to Bavaria where he was the first to be declared King of the Franks. As the war drew on, the young Grifo proved himself to be an adequate commander but an even better politician. When his great-uncle Duke Odilo died in 748 CE Grifo was in a position to establish himself as regent over the succeeding young Duke Tassilo. Bavaria may not have been as worthy a prize as the eventual goal of Austrasia and Neustria, but it served Grifo’s interests for the time being. The war had unsurprisingly focused the belligerents’ attention away from their neighbours; the Frisians and Saxons regularly raided Austrasia, while the dukes of Alemannia were imposing their hegemony over the Thuringians. It was also during this period when Christianisation was making progress among the Bavarians, Alemannians, and Thuringians, though not without some resistance.

In 750 CE Grifo negotiated an alliance with the Duke of Alemannia, the purpose of which was to carry out an offensive into Austrasia. The two states had prepared their armies by the following year and invaded Alsace. The town of Strasbourg was conquered in a reasonable amount of time, but Grifo’s Alemannian allies sacked the town against his wishes. Distrust therefore set in between the two armies which would soon have dire consequences for Grifo. Afterwards the two armies marched toward the Austrasian capital of Metz. Carloman had been campaigning near Reims, but retreated with all speed back to Metz when he heard of the siege of Strasbourg. Rather than take his chances with an unpredictable siege, Carloman marched his army out to meet Grifo on the field. The two sides were evenly marched but Carloman had the advantage of surprise over Grifo’s forces, who had expected to settle in for a siege. Then the unthinkable happened; the Alemannians retreated. Their desire for plunder was stronger than their desire to lose men in a Frankish civil war. Without the Alemannian support, Grifo’s army were overwhelmed and routed. Grifo himself fled straight into the clutches of the Alemannians, whereupon they captured him and turned him over to Carloman in return for the recognition of Alemannia’s independence. The now sole King of the Franks agreed and Grifo spent the short remainder of his life imprisoned. The Alemannians plundered Alsace as they left while Bavaria had no further role in the Frankish civil war.

battle-of-fontenoy-en-puisaye-in-841.jpg

A later (anachronistic) depiction of battle between the Neustrians and Austrasians

Once Austrasia’s eastern borders were finally safe, Carloman could finally focus all of his energy on the campaign for Reims. In response Pippin approached King Hunald of Aquitaine to request a defensive pact against Carloman. Hunald was apprehensive though because a Frankish civil war diverted attention away from his realm, yet one of the contenders winning without his intervention could potentially see a return to old Francia’s expansionist policy. Furthermore Aquitaine’s non-aggression treaty with al-Andalus was still in effect, which gave Hunald an idea: instead of using his own soldiers, he would hire Muslim mercenaries. Negotiations with Neustria were stalled while Hunald dispatched an embassy bearing his proposal to al-Andalus. Governor Yusuf ibn Abd al-Rahman al-Fihri was at that time on his Italian expedition, so the Aquitanian embassy were granted an audience with his aging deputy Abd al-Malik ibn Katan al-Fihri. The deputy, always on the lookout for lucrative opportunities, gladly agreed to the deal and promised to furnish Hunald with a contingent of Berber cavalry when he was ready to go to war. Most of the money al-Andalus received was subtly embezzled by Abd al-Malik. King Hunald resumed his negotiations with Pippin in 752 CE and promised to send them aid.

The Berber cavalry, drawn from the immigrant Barghawata tribes, arrived in Aquitaine by the end of the year and were sent on to Neustria along with guides and interpreters. Pippin was less than amused with Hunald’s reinforcements and briefly considered dismissing them before his commanders reminded him of how their own cavalry arm was lacking. The Berbers’ prowess was tested at a small battle near Tertry against an Austrasian raiding party; the Austrasian archers were run off by the Muslim mercenaries, allowing the Neustrian infantry to advance on their counterparts without any losses, thus winning the battle. Most of the retreating Austrasians were pursued and easily killed by the Berbers, yet Pippin was still unconvinced and so ordered the Berbers to plunder their way towards Alsace. The main Neustrian army marched to Reims and fortified their position there, expecting Carloman to muster his forces for a siege. Carloman did not disappoint his brother and besieged the city with the largest army he had yet commanded. The Neustrian king may have made a miscalculation, for the siege carried on for months without the Austrasians appearing to falter. In late 753 CE however the Austrasians’ supply situation began to deteriorate, though this was unknown to Pippin at the time. The areas from which Carloman’s soldiers foraged were being raided by an enemy force; fields of crops were burned, while livestock was driven off. Even more worrying were the attacks on the Austrasian supply convoys travelling to and from Metz. Ever superstitious, soldiers in the Austrasian army shared stories of black devils materialising during the night and disappearing before dawn. In hindsight it was obvious that the Berbers had returned.

Realising that his brother’s mercenaries were more troublesome than he first realised, Carloman detached a cavalry force from his besieging army to track down and eliminate the Berbers. The Austrasian horsemen returned not long afterwards having sustained moderate casualties. The second party was led by Carloman himself. In a dramatic turn of events the Austrasians were ambushed, like their preceding party, and many horsemen slain; Carloman was captured. The Neustrian troops attached to the Berber mercenary army sent messages to Pippin and the Austrasian besiegers declaring that Carloman had been defeated and taken prisoner. The commanders of the besieging army agreed to a truce with Reims in order to negotiate the release of their king. Pippin hastily moved to join his mercenaries so he could parley with his brother in person. The Neustrian king’s demands were relatively lenient: Carloman would forfeit his claim to all of Francia, thereby remaining king of Austrasia, renounce his claim to Reims and the surrounding area, and pay a yearly tribute to Neustria. The king of Austrasia allegedly spat in his brother’s face and refused to accede to his demands. Pippin would go on to ask his brother three more times over as many days to accept the terms; Carloman refused each time. With a heavy heart Pippin knew he had no choice but to punish his brother. He refused to murder his kin however and instead ordered his Berber mercenaries to blind Carloman and escort him to al-Andalus where he was to be kept a prisoner. Afterwards Pippin declared Carloman’s son, Drogo, to be the new king of Austrasia and presented him with the same peace terms. Though furious at his father’s exile, Drogo accepted the demands and so brought the long Frankish civil war to an end in 754 CE.

The Berber mercenaries dutifully carried out their orders and brought Carloman to Qurtuba, where he was treated as an honoured guest. The former Frankish king became something of a curiosity at the Andalusian court. He never gave up his desire to retake Francia and loudly declaimed so to anyone who broached the subject. The governor and other members of the Islamic ruling elite regularly conversed with him on the topic of European and Christian politics. As a guest of the governor, Carloman had free run of most of the city and cultivated ties with the Christian community and clergy, which he often put to use by interceding on their behalf with the Muslim authorities. On the other hand, Abd al-Malik ibn Katan al-Fihri was sacked and unceremoniously stripped of his wealth by governor Yusuf ibn Abd al-Rahman al-Fihri. Part of the wealth was redistributed amongst the commanders of the Berber expedition, while some were granted governorships of their own. The majority of the mercenaries returned to their land in the northern border region with Asturias.
 
Last edited:
Depend what you Consider as Europe? seems they can't pull the 'europe ends at pyrennes' now...so could be pausable later on
I was thinking in places like France, Italy and Germany. One idea that I've had for a timeline where Islam was more prevalent in Medieval Europe was for Amazigh mercenaries to take part in a Norman invasion of England and are then resettled to help repopulate in the aftermath of the Harrying of the North.
 
PART 1 - The New Governor of al-Andalus
The New Governor of al-Andalus

After twenty years of ruling as the governor of al-Andalus Yusuf ibn Abd al-Rahman al-Fihri died of natural causes in 761 CE. Of his sons al-Qasim was the only one present at Qurtuba. The young man declared himself the new governor and distributed what were, in effect, bribes to the local Arab nobility to gain their support. His brothers, spread throughout the province, were understandably angry at the turn of events but were shrewd enough to realise that a civil war would provide an opening for the Abbasids to assert greater control. One by one they travelled to Qurtuba to affirm their allegiance to the new governor. Al-Qasim ibn Yusuf al-Fihri was advised to send a delegation to the caliphal court with all haste to confirm his status as governor. Though he was no great politician like his father, al-Qasim was intelligent enough to know when to heed sound advice. Once again the ambassadors plied the caliph, this time al-Mansur, with gifts and proclaimed loyalty to the Abbasid dynasty; the delegation returned with investiture documents confirming Fihrid governorship of al-Andalus. As an experienced military man rather than a politician, al-Qasim was keen to begin his rule with the conquest of Aquitaine. His brothers dissuaded him however, and turned his attention instead towards Islam’s weak position in Italia; the governor demurred to his brothers’ judgement. In recent years the Lombards had expelled Roman authority from northern Italia, with the exception of the Duchy of Rome which was undergoing a power struggle between the clerical Patriarch of Rome [AKA the Pope] and the appointed Duke of Rome.

Governor al-Qasim oversaw the mustering of the army himself: Barghawata Berbers from the north, and Arabs and muwalladun[1] from the area around Qurtuba, were gathered at Balansiyya. The island of Corsica was the first target of the expedition. Officially it was part of the Roman Empire but it had been conquered by the Lombards during Liutprand’s reign. Part of the Andalusian army was transported by ship to the Corsican town of Adiacium [Ajaccio] where they defeated the small Lombard garrison. The expeditionary force marched across the northern section of the island but faced no further resistance. Meanwhile the large remainder of the army redeployed to Nicaea and waited for the return of the Corsican expedition. Once the army, commanded by al-Qasim himself, was reunited it marched to Savona in early 762 CE and from there to lay siege to Taurinum [Turin]. Capturing the city would protect the mountain passes leading to Burgundy and allow reinforcements to be brought from there. During the siege scouting parties composed of Berber cavalry were sent east to keep watch on King Desiderius’ movements. The Lombard king was raising an army between the cities of Papia [Pavia] and Mediolanum [Milan]. To draw the attention of the mustering army the Berber scouts raided the region to the south, between Dertona [Tortona] and Placentia [Piacenza], which included the sacking of the famous Abbey of Bobium [Bobbio]. The action successfully lured Lombard cavalry away from the main army, after which they were lead on a fruitless pursuit of the Berbers through Liguria; the Lombards sustained significant casualties during this escapade. In the meantime the Andalusian army had breached Taurinum and sacked the city, after which they installed a garrison.

King Desiderius dispatched part of his army westward to Taurinum while he waited for reinforcements from Spoletum and Beneventum. Reinforcements were not forthcoming however. The two duchies had recently revolted against northern authority; even though the revolt had been defeated, Desiderius’ power was not yet solidified. The death of his ally Duke Gisulf of Spoletum resulted in a conflict between pro-northern and anti-northern factions, while the deposed Duke Liutprand of Beneventum returned and accepted the abdication of his son Arechis. Desiderius had sorely underestimated the size of the Andalusian army, as the Lombard detachment was easily defeated near Asta [Asti]. After hearing the news of his subordinates’ defeat Desiderius withdrew his army to Mediolanum and waited for the inevitable siege. Al-Qasim ibn Yusuf refused to oblige however and instead besieged Dertona, while Berber horsemen plundered the countryside around Papia. Lombard commanders attempted to persuade their king to take the fight to the Muslims, but Desiderius was adamant that breaking the invaders at a siege of Mediolanum was the best plan. Following the conquest of Dertona, the Andalusians moved on to Placentia and began their siege there. After that it was Cremona and from there Brixia [Brescia]. By 764 CE Bergamus [Bergamo] had also fell and the Lombard army were trapped in Mediolanum. During the encirclement various Lombard commanders had broken their orders and attempted to break through the encroaching blockade before it could be completed. They were all failures though and only succeeded in draining the defenders of manpower. At this point a coup among the Lombard nobles occurred in which Desiderius and his son and co-king Adalgis were killed. In their place was appointed Duke Peter of Friuli, who had been among the commanders advocating an aggressive policy.

The Lombard army, commanded by the new king Peter, marched towards Bergamus to engage the Andalusian army. Rather than meet the enemy in open battle however, most of the Andalusian army took a defensive position in the foothills near Bergamus while a small force delayed the Lombards at the Adda River. Though they were bloodied from the skirmish the Lombards pressed on into the hills. The battle was a decisive defeat for the Lombards: their cavalry were lured further into the mountains by the Berbers, while many of the infantry were fatally vulnerable to the Andalusian archers during the steep advance. King Peter and some of his compatriots fought to the end, while many others fled in a disorganised mass to the south and east. After the battle Peter stoically awaited his expected execution, yet al-Qasim was impressed by his courage in battle and willingness to fight for his country. The Andalusian governor therefore extended an offer to Peter: convert to Islam and help conquer the rest of the Lombard kingdom, and he would be allowed to continue ruling over his lands. Peter accepted and from then on was known as Abdallah Butrus ibn Muniq al-Rumi;[2] the other captured commanders were given the same offer and many also accepted. With organised Lombard resistance broken at Bergamus and the Andalusian army accompanied by the addition of new Lombard soldiers and nobles, the rest of the Italian campaign was relatively straightforward. Most cities surrendered at the sight of the former king among the invading army, though the territories of the former Roman Exarchate of Ravenna provided more resistance. By 770 CE all of the former Lombard territory north of the duchies of Rome and Spoletum were under Islamic control.

As he was never one for the apparent complexity and lack of excitement in actually governing, al-Qasim ibn Yusuf al-Fihri left the reorganisation of Italia to his brother Muhammad while he began to plot his next conquest. Muhammad honoured his brother’s promise to the converted nobles, appointing them as governors of their pre-conquest territories. The rest of Italia was divided between Arab and Berber nobles, most of whom belonged to prominent families since the conquest of al-Andalus while some were newly promoted commanders from the recent campaign. Muslim garrisons were established in cities across the new territory with the largest being at Auximum [Osimo], Mediolanum, Ravenna, and Clusium [Chiusi]. Despite the jubilation among the Muslims over the great conquest the more shrewd administrators and nobles were worried. It could be argued that the size of Italia warranted a whole new province within the Abbasid Caliphate; the central government in Baghdad would certainly make the argument and thus reduce the power of the Fihrids. Muhammad was able to delay the crisis for some time by maintaining the relatively small provincial divisions and by discouraging the development of a regional identity by insisting that Italia was an integral part of the wilaya of al-Andalus.

[1] Native converts. With the considerably less Arab immigration ITTL the muwalladun are more prominent than OTL, but still treated as inferior to the Arabs and Berbers.
[2] Peter was given the nisba al-Rumi because the Muslims considered Italy to still be part of the Roman Empire (unsurprising considering it’s where Rome is) and therefore the people there were still Romans regardless of whether they actually were or not.
 
Why hasn't Pippin annexed the kingdom of Austrasia and reunified the Frankish kingdom?
The Austrasian nobility were still loyal to Drogo (who was 24 at the end of the war and therefore not an easily manipulable child) and Pippin only just won the war, so going on a new offensive soon afterwards would be a bad idea for him.
 
Top