A Britain of Panthers and Lions: House of Oldenburg Britain
- Thread starter VVD0D95
- Start date
Indeed. With the Austrian Hasburgs looking to the Turks, that relieves a major opponent to France. Without a full blown alliance being formed by other, smaller states nothing will much be able to intimidate Louis. Until that happens, it would only be out of the goodness of his heart that Louis wouldn't use this chance to throw his weight around and gain a few choice bits.
VVD0D95
Banned
Intriguing, one would think that the moment Louis starts acting out though, that leopold would look to deal with him and reclaim lands Louis took during the six years war
Except wasn't it just the chapter before this one that had Leopold looking to form an alliance with Russia against the Ottomans? The last war Leopold tried to do the two-front war thing and it didn't turn out to well. While the Turks were beaten back, France largely seemed to emerge victorious in the west. Although Leopold did manage to put his candidate on the throne of the PLC. That could mean aid could arrive from there, but being king didn't exactly guarantee the Polish nobles would support those wars. Especially if it is against France, not a country the PLC has overlapping fields of interest with.
VVD0D95
Banned
Indeed it was, leopold has conflicting interests here. Does he protect the Rhine and do his duty as emperor, or go for the Turk and protect Hungary
I might be wrong here, but by this point the title of Emperor was already mostly ceremonial and honorary. It had little legal power that translated into practical power. Any power the Hasburgs had in the HRE was from their power, period. So if you make Leopold choose between his patrimony where he gets his riches, soldiers, and support, or the Rhenish states that have obstinately guarded their power and wealth from the Emperor for centuries...He'd choose the former, IMO.
Which would he prefer to get flak from? The Rhenish states where he has little power, or Hungary where he is king and is positioned to become the heart of Hasburg power?
Not saying he won't interfere with Louis' schemes, but if he finds his resources stretched it becomes a matter of what he prioritizes as more important.
Chapter 72: Anne, Queen of Plots
VVD0D95
Banned
Chapter 72: Anne, Queen Of Plots
Windsor was nice during the spring, the air was filled with pleasantness and there was not a hint of the odour that sometimes affected Whitehall. Another benefit was that George did not have wheeze and splutter as he sometimes did whilst they were at Whitehall. There were days when Anne considered moving her official residence to Hampton Court, where George did much better, but he would always tell her not to be foolish. That Whitehall was the symbol of her power, and authority and that she’d be an idiot to give it up. She disagreed with him, but complied nonetheless. Now, they walked down the pathway of the gardens of this old castle and talked.
“You know, I do think Sunderland will likely die before he retires.” Anne said. Sunderland, was approaching sixty and showed no signs of slowing down.
George laughed, he was in a much better mood now than he had been during their time at Whitehall before Easter. “That does not surprise me. The man works and works. He has lived an entire career serving the family, I do not think he knows anything else.”
Anne didn’t laugh, instead she said. “I do not think this will be a good thing. I think he must take some time off. Shrewsbury has already had to pick up some of the slack for him in regards to handling France and Spain. You know he forgot to mention that Princess Maria Antonia and her husband and children were heading to Madrid. Such a thing is important. Of course, his son Robert is someone who seems to aspire to high office, but does not hold the necessary skills to make that work. Whereas his other son Charles could be quite the politician.”
George raised an eyebrow. “You want another Spencer sitting in the cabinet? I thought you’d had your fill with Robert Spencer senior.”
Anne smirked at that, she had complained unceasingly about Spencer initially, seeing him as far too old fashioned and nowhere near enough flexible to meet with her needs. “My opinion on the man has changed somewhat. I know what value he brings, plus I am not quite convinced that Shrewsbury has quite abandoned his whiggish ways and the way Devonshire set him for.” That was true, Shrewsbury reminded her of a snake, someone willing to change with the tide.
“Will you promote him to the Southern Department when Sunderland dies?” George asked as blunt as ever.
“I don’t think I have a choice.” Anne replied, as they turned right and down into her favourite part of the gardens. “Shrewsbury has the most experience in dealing with the states of Europe. Drummond thinks he does, but he is more valuable as Secretary for Scotland, John is a soldier not a politician and Godolphin is good with numbers. Truth be told, if Middleton had some sense I might put him back into his position, but he continues to demand something or the other.”
Charles Middleton was a man who’d served under her uncle and her father, and whilst he was capable, he was also incredibly aggravating demanding pay well beyond his services. George did not like him one bit, as shown by the frown he wore. “What is the man wanting now?”
“A higher salary and a palace. He wants a palace.” Anne replied as if that sorted everything.
Her husband laughed. “I think the Board of Admiralty deserve one palace, indeed, I think perhaps setting them up in Dover would be for the best.”
Anne looked at her husband then, something about the way he’d said that made her think it had come from someone other than him. “I thought you preferred to keep it stationed in Whitehall, to keep an eye on them?” That was the reason he’d used, initially.
“I do. But there will be war again, and I think we’d be best equipped to handle things from Dover, where the ships are actually stationed, or rather where Herbert’s ships are stationed than in Whitehall, where anything could happen.” George replied.
“Is this because you distrust Herbert? Or because you want to see active service?” Anne asked. Her husband had been wanting to fight during the Six Years War and she had denied him that, fearing that something would happen to him. He had not quite forgiven her for that.
“Herbert is not a problem; we have an understanding. I just think that as Lord High Admiral my place is where the ships are.” George replied, then added. “During war time.”
Anne sighed, frustration growing. “Why do you keep saying there will be war? France was just as badly hit, if not more so than us, with the Six Years War. Louis of France is many things but I do not think he is a complete idiot to demand war so soon after the conclusion of the last war.”
“We know that he has rebuilt his fleet with more guns per ship than we have. We know that he has men patrolling the border of the Spanish Low Countries, and we know the Savoyards allowed French troops under the command of his nephew to patrol their border with the Italian lands. What more do you need?” George replied heatedly.
Anne sighed and stopped walking, forcing her husband to stop as well. “Okay, say he is planning another war, what would you want me to allow you to do? Command a ship? Command a regiment? What? Why are you so desperate to fight?”
Her husband sighed. “I am a man and a soldier, mon Cherie, this is what I am made for. I love you and our children, but I am a fighter. I must command and I must show the politicians that we are committed to this cause.”
Anne wanted to scream, this was something she had greatly feared. “If I let you serve an active command, what will you do?”
“I will ensure to be as safe as one can be during the fighting.” Her husband replied. He turned and took her hands in his. “I promise.”
Anne nodded, and wanting to change the subject she instead said. “Mary will be marrying Charles of Sweden in the next few moons, Anne Sophia shall be heading to Portugal in the new century, but what of James. Our son is heir to the Kingdom; he needs a suitable bride. And we cannot have a Catholic one.” That was a shame, there were a few brides she thought might do some good from the Habsburg family.
Her husband said nothing for a moment, then replied. “I think Caroline of Ansbach would make a good wife for our boy.”
“She comes from a cadet branch of the Brandenburgs, what would she bring?” Anne replied. She wanted a Princess for her son, not some cadet scoundrel.
“George of Hanover’s son seems to be interested in her, furthermore, she would bring a heavy dowry with her. And she is said to be quite smart, we know James is highly intelligent. It would do him good to have an equal there to talk to.” George replied.
Anne considered this, she had heard a little of Caroline of Ansbach and she was supposed to be very beautiful, and smart, but she was from a minor family. Would she make an appropriate bride? “I shall have to think on this.” Was what she replied with. They continued walking, this time in relative silence, enjoying one another’s company.
VVD0D95
Banned
Agreed Re great northern war, Russia taking some of Turkish protectorates would be pretty swell.
I'm going to say no to Caroline as a bride. With alliances being formed with Denmark (through George), Sweden, and Portugal, they've got a good set of allies. Especially in naval matters. Spain in also de facto their ally against France. Brandenburg-Prussia is not well positioned to aid against France. I'd actually suggest a domestic marriage. While not a popular thing for royalty at this time, with the Act of Union already happening building up domestic support for the next king would make sense.
As for the GNW. Yes and no. The OTL sides are definitely gone. Saxony won't be involved with Augustus as king of the PLC, and the PLC seems more inclined to look south due to the Hasburg candidate being chosen. With Hasburg and Russian aid, taking Moldavia from the Ottomans is more valuable than Livonia. Only Denmark-Norway might be still willing, depending on the politics of Skaneland and how much influence Anne and George have over their royal in-laws. IOTL it was originally assumed by Russia that Denmark and the PLC would be doing most of the work, and they'd just be strolling in. Without that, Peter would only be going in when he has decided to commit enough forces against Sweden to fight alone.
However Peter almost certainly will at some point aim for St. Petersburg. A Baltic port was a long time goal for Russia, and Peter is the type of guy with lots of ambition (especially regarding gaining ports to build navies and gain trade connections to western Europe) and the capabilities and ruthlessness to achieve them. Now IOTL he preferred to focus on one front at a time. He first fought the Ottomans in Azov, then fought the Swedish, and only started the Russo-Turkish War of 1710 after Poltava where Sweden was gutted. He looked north mostly when he failed to gain support against the Ottomans. Here if he has the support of the Hasburgs and the PLC, he'll definitely look south first. When the war there peters out though, or maybe if things go so well Peter decides to try to consolidate there while knocking off another objective in the north quickly, he'll look towards his St. Petersburg.
It would be a vastly different war though, if Russia didn't have allies. The Swedes at this time specialized in routing their enemies to make up for their low population. Russia meanwhile was backwards, and so unless Peter enacted a multitude of military reforms against the Turks, the Swedes will almost certainly create an alt-Battle of Narva. And without Russia having the PLC to draw Charles' attention for the next eight years, Russia would have a bad time. Kola, Karelia, and really everything north and west of Novgorod could be occupied. Not much to Russia, of course, but potentially enough to make a secondary front too costly to keep up. Russia would win if they kept in there and was willing to marshal enough resources( outnumbering Sweden 20-1 helps with that), unless Sweden gets allies, but if Sweden has OTL level of military success than Peter would likely have to make peace or probably be overthrown.
So a Russo-Swedish war will happen at some point, but whether it happens in 1700 or 1715 depends on the war against the Ottomans. And whether it becomes a 'Great Northern War' depends on the circumstances, allies, military fortune, etc.
VVD0D95
Banned
Interesting, couldn’t Caroline be used as a proxy for Prussia to sway them away from francE? As for a domestic marriage could that not harm the future heirs as it seemed to do with Mary and Anne re their suitability for foreign marriages. As to building up support for he future king, how do you mean?
And interesting points re Peter and northern war. I agree that plc isn’t likely to get involved here.
Without Great Northern War King of Poland could make better use of Lithuanian Civil war of 1700, when magnates (including Radziwiłł family) supported by middle nobility crushed powerful Sapieha family, who de facto controlled Grand Duchy od Lithuania.
VVD0D95
Banned
Potentially increasing his power there?
Also a question, I want Charles older brother to keep the palatinate in his line, but his otl second wife is married to the duke of Modena, so who could he marry as a second wife?