A Better Rifle at Halloween

Hodden Grey
22nd August 1914, St Albans.

The three original infantry battalions of the Seaforth and Cameron Highlanders as well as the Artillery, Engineers and other personnel of the Brigade were drawn up on the new parade ground adjacent to St Albans School. The brigade was headquartered at the school and the soldiers were locally billeted. As the men stood to attention, a battalion in kilts of Hodden Grey marched onto the parade ground, the Pipes and Drums of the London Scottish playing Highland Laddie as the marched to form the fourth side of the hollow square.
The London Scottish had previously been attached to the 2nd London Division but with the decision to allow them to retain the FQH Mk 1 Rifle, they had been transferred to the Seaforth and Cameron Highlanders Brigade. The Cameron Highlanders Battalion had been reinforced to full strength with London Scots who had re-joined the colours and the two Seaforths battalions had subsumed most of the third battalion, which would then be fleshed out with new recruits and act as training cadre. This parade was a chance for the Brigadier General commanding the brigade to meet and formally accept the new battalion into his command. He was already highly impressed by the soldierly bearing of the men of the Battalion, they clearly were a fine body of soldiers and would bring his brigade up to full strength.
His brigade would be handing in their older Long Lee Enfield rifles and receiving the new FQH Mk 1 in exchange, how he wished that they could also be rid of the divisional artillery, a mixture of useless 5” Howitzers, 4.7” Guns and 15 pounder guns, all of them obsolete but all that was available.
The moral of the brigade was excellent, they would be training hard to ready for their deployment to France. It was not yet certain as to when the 51st Division would go to France or Belgium. Already the Territorial Force had begun deployed three divisions to the continent, two divisions had commenced deployment to France, the 1st London Division and the North Midland Division they would assemble with the rest of the army between Mauberge and Le Cateau, the Wessex Division had gone to Belgium and had already begun landing in Bruges. It was expected that these first three divisions would take a further week to be fully deployed and then would be the turn of the next three divisions. The Territorial Force divisions would be added to each of the 3 Corps already present, once the 2nd trio of territorials arrived then the Corps would form an army and each territorial division would pair with a regular division. When the initial reinforcement was complete there would be 3 armies present each with 2 corps of 3 divisions. This would give a total of 18 divisions in the BEF, with 6 Divisions deployed to Belgium and 12 divisions in France. The splitting of the BEF was seen as a risk, should Belgium collapse rapidly, the possibility of the Germans reaching the coast and then rolling up the British army was a real possibility. Flanders was not a place filled with glory for British arms even the great Wellington had struggled in that place. Thus far though the Belgian resistance was proving stronger than anticipated, the Siege of Liege was ongoing with thousands dying on both sides the fortress and town were still holding on. The Belgian army was using the time well, they had called up all of their reservists and were digging ever greater fortifications around Antwerp. The Garrison at Namur had been reinforced with a French Infantry brigade and 3 French Artillery Batteries.
The Belgian division based in Ghent had moved up to screen Brussels, German Cavalry and Infantry units were filtering past Liege but without the road, canal and railways which passed through the town their movements were very slow.
The Brigadier General ceased his reverie and began to address the assembled Brigade.
 
A division equipped with the new rifle makes sense, especially if it is used for something like garrisoning one of the Belgian channel ports.
 
A division equipped with the new rifle makes sense, especially if it is used for something like garrisoning one of the Belgian channel ports.
It is only going to be a brigade to start with as they will not have the rifles to make it otherwise, production at this stage is 75 per day so you are looking at 13-14 days to equip a battalion. At the start of the war we had 2500 rifles, by this stage they should have another 500-750 and the rest of the battalions equipment by early September. The 51st division may not go to France with the next tranche of troops, as they may not be equipped yet. We shall see what happens. One of the things that people don't realise is how much Kitchener screwed up the Haldane plan, he also pissed off Redmonds volunteers which is another thing he won't get to do now.
 
One of the things that people don't realise is how much Kitchener screwed up the Haldane plan, he also pissed off Redmonds volunteers which is another thing he won't get to do now.
Diesal, would you mind going into detail on that please, I've tried to look it up, but I am struggling to discover Haldane's plan compared to Kitchner's new Army plans.

Many thanks

Simon
 
The short answer is the haldane reforms resulted in the formation of complete territorial force divisions including artillery. They were intended for both expeditionary purposes and home defence initially however when the legislation was passed it was for home service only but the formations existed. Kitchener didn’t want to use them so they went over piecemeal and often had to struggle with obsolete equipment while the newly formed new army units trained with new gear. In my timeline with Kitchener dead the territorial divisions will be sent to France as soon as practicable, they will be short of equipment as in otl but they can go into the line. The new volunteers will go as individuals to regular and first and second line tf units.
 
. The new volunteers will go as individuals to regular and first and second line tf units.
So the County Territorial Associations will continue with recruiting and training and retain the Regular permeant staff at the Depots for training. Will this be a better situation compared to the forming of the New Army in OTL

I see the 2 Regular Divisions which were retained for Home Defence in 1914 were dispatched to Belgium, whilst the other four were dispatched to France as per OTL.

Do you intend for the Overseas Regular Battalions to return to Fight in Europe and be replaced by TF Battalions or return to the UK to form a Cadre for expanding the Army?

Cheers
 
Do you intend for the Overseas Regular Battalions to return to Fight in Europe and be replaced by TF Battalions or return to the UK to form a Cadre for expanding the Army?
Some of the regulars will come back as quickly as practicable, others will wait on replacement with Tf forces. The County Territorial associations and the regular army recruiting and training infrastructure will be retained but merged. All combat experienced units will be combed for potential leaders both nco and officer.
 
So the expansion of the British Army won’t be quite as raw, with a better leavening of experienced long service officers and, more importantly, NCOs? That’ll certainly help improve their performance. Now if only they can hold some decent defendable ground.
 
So the expansion of the British Army won’t be quite as raw, with a better leavening of experienced long service officers and, more importantly, NCOs? That’ll certainly help improve their performance. Now if only they can hold some decent defendable ground.
Exactly.
 
I'm not sure not having Pals Battalions would make all that much difference given that infantry battalions recruited from specific areas anyway. If the battalion of a local regiment takes huge casualties the local community is going to be devastated anyway. You're still going to get villages or even towns that lose a generation of young men in a morning.
 
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Sooty

Banned
I'm not sure not having Pals Battalions would make all that much difference given that infantry battalions recruited from specific areas anyway. If the battalion of a local regiment takes huge casualties the local community is going to be devastated anyway. You're still going to get villages or even towns that lose a generation of young men in a morning.
Thankful Villages (also known as Blessed Villages; Welsh: Pentrefi Diolchgar)[1][2] are settlements in England and Wales from which all their members of the armed forces survived World War I. The term Thankful Village was popularised by the writer Arthur Mee in the 1930s; in Enchanted Land (1936), the introductory volume to The King's England series of guides, he wrote that a Thankful Village was one which had lost no men in the war because all those who left to serve came home again. His initial list identified 32 villages. There are tens of thousands of villages and towns in the United Kingdom.

In an October 2013 update,[3] researchers identified 53 civil parishes in England and Wales from which all serving personnel returned. There are no Thankful Villages identified in Scotland or Ireland yet (all of Ireland was then part of the United Kingdom).[4]

Fourteen of the English and Welsh villages are considered "doubly thankful", in that they also lost no service personnel during World War II.[4] These are marked in italics in the list below (note: while the list includes 17 of these, not all have been verified).
 

Coulsdon Eagle

Monthly Donor
I'm not sure not having Pals Battalions would make all that much difference given that infantry battalions recruited from specific areas anyway. If the battalion of a local regiment takes huge casualties the local community is going to be devastated anyway. You're still going to get villages or even towns that lose a generation of young men in a morning.
Actually at the start of the war you could chose the regiment or corps that you preferred serving with. Newcastle United fans in Nottingham joined the Northumberland Fusiliers. Northern folk who'd not visited the seaside chose the Duke Of Cornwall's Light Infantry. More often than not this system worked. Really only the Pals retained that local link, and as conscription came in, and manpower shortages struck, you went where they sent you, and I've known of infantrymen who served with five separate regiments inside 3 years. Quite a number of Englishmen served in Scottish, Irish or Welsh regiments, and vice-versa.

Case in point. My grandfather joined the army in 1908 as a boy soldier. He was born & lived in Croydon but enlisted in the Ox & Bucks Light Infantry.
 
I am currently watching a lecture on the German army in 1914. One thing mentioned is that the German plan if the fall of Liege was delayed then the plan was to violate Dutch Neutrality to outflank it. Since Liege is still holding ITTL, would we see the Germans go through the Netherlands?
 
The short answer is the haldane reforms resulted in the formation of complete territorial force divisions including artillery. They were intended for both expeditionary purposes and home defence initially however when the legislation was passed it was for home service only but the formations existed. Kitchener didn’t want to use them so they went over piecemeal and often had to struggle with obsolete equipment while the newly formed new army units trained with new gear. In my timeline with Kitchener dead the territorial divisions will be sent to France as soon as practicable, they will be short of equipment as in otl but they can go into the line. The new volunteers will go as individuals to regular and first and second line tf units.
The Territorials weren't well thought of by the regular army in the run up to WWI.

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The thing is the Army didn't trust them enough to do that, they didn't even trust them to defend the home islands against an all but impossible landing and reduced the initial size of the BEF to do that. The army so didn't trust them that they preferred to form Kitchener's New Army and start from scratch rather than deal with what they saw as a bunch of poorly trained, ill-disciplined militiamen. They were dead wrong but that was what they thought in August 1914.
 
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