28 Days Later outbreak timeline - Death of a Nation

If you go back to one of the entries on this forum, Andy Harris was described as the "21st Century Hitler". Would it be fair he got all the blame because he was only 9 years old and therefore a minor?
For me, I wouldn't blame him, he was minor and he didn't deliberately bring Europe into madness. Too sad that he is a carrier.
 
It wouldn't surprise me one bit people would overlook a minor was an unwilling carrier.

But I tend to ignore the European outbreak. It's just not happening as I and others have repeatedly explained.
 

chankljp

Donor
It wouldn't surprise me one bit people would overlook a minor was an unwilling carrier.

But I tend to ignore the European outbreak. It's just not happening as I and others have repeatedly explained.
Same here. The idea of Rage wiping out Great Britain, and the rest of the world dealing with the aftermath, was an interesting idea worth exploring enough as it is. No need to add in Mainland Europe as well.
 
If you go back to one of the entries on this forum, Andy Harris was described as the "21st Century Hitler". Would it be fair he got all the blame because he was only 9 years old and therefore a minor?
I wrote that entry detailing his fate. My justification was that once Rage burns through Europe and the governments there reestablished, those countries will be mostly made up of resettled refugees or survivors who've lost everything; they're bitter and they would want someone to blame. The US decided that making sure post-Rage Europe doesn't fall too heavily into Russia's orbit meant offering them some red meat; they had also gotten everything useful out of him in the form of the Rage vaccine. Andrew was only turned over once he was an adult, and he never appeared in person at the new ICJ's tribunal because he was a carrier, so the whole process was very dehumanizing. There was a "Free Andy Harris" movement, but they never gained any traction because the countries that had suffered the most were in the driver's seat of the trial. Some might even have considered being put to death a more humane fate than isolated imprisonment for the rest of his natural life.
 
I wrote that entry detailing his fate. My justification was that once Rage burns through Europe and the governments there reestablished, those countries will be mostly made up of resettled refugees or survivors who've lost everything; they're bitter and they would want someone to blame. The US decided that making sure post-Rage Europe doesn't fall too heavily into Russia's orbit meant offering them some red meat; they had also gotten everything useful out of him in the form of the Rage vaccine. Andrew was only turned over once he was an adult, and he never appeared in person at the new ICJ's tribunal because he was a carrier, so the whole process was very dehumanizing. There was a "Free Andy Harris" movement, but they never gained any traction because the countries that had suffered the most were in the driver's seat of the trial. Some might even have considered being put to death a more humane fate than isolated imprisonment for the rest of his natural life.
So you're the author of that entry. A nice tough although very depressing.

With the apparent dissolution or weakened NATO, the Russians would definitely try to expand West ward. Though it appeared the U.S. and NATO were somehow open to the prospect of assisting the Russians, up until they gobbled up what remains of Belarus, Ukraine, and the Baltics. But I guess Bush or whoever is in the White House had no interests in containing Russia this time, seeing that the refugees of Europe would see Russia as a savior.

The prospect of blaming a nine year old at the time would be very controversial and have a divided view. It was also mentioned here that Andy was kept in the U.S., possibly the CDC or Fort Detrick. He shares the same fate with Sherry Birkin in Resident Evil 2 and 6 who lived under government custody up until the sixth entry to the franchise.
 
Blaming Andy Harris for the European outbreak would be a gross injustice but also impossible if you are in possession of the facts. The US military command in Britain and Andys parents Don and Alice Harris all bear more direct culpability for what happened than Andy.....
 

chankljp

Donor
Just a question that I came up with, and had considered making a thread about, but decided to post it here instead since this had basically become an unofficial "28 Days Later" ATL general discussion thread at this point....

In the earlier discussions, most members seems to agree that even when dealing with a virus that is as supernaturally aggressively infectious and fast spreading as Rage, the idea of the UK getting utterly overrun and most of its population wiped out in merely 28 days was a bit too much, forcing the author to basically come up with in universe justification on why the country collapsed so quickly.

As such, my question would instead be this: 'Realistically' with everything else staying the same (The nature of the virus, the outbreak starting in the Cambridge lab, etc), what would the outcome have been? Would the UK still have been wiped out? If so, how long would it have taken instead? Or could the outbreak have been contained?
 
Just a question that I came up with, and had considered making a thread about, but decided to post it here instead since this had basically become an unofficial "28 Days Later" ATL general discussion thread at this point....

In the earlier discussions, most members seems to agree that even when dealing with a virus that is as supernaturally aggressively infectious and fast spreading as Rage, the idea of the UK getting utterly overrun and most of its population wiped out in merely 28 days was a bit too much, forcing the author to basically come up with in universe justification on why the country collapsed so quickly.

As such, my question would instead be this: 'Realistically' with everything else staying the same (The nature of the virus, the outbreak starting in the Cambridge lab, etc), what would the outcome have been? Would the UK still have been wiped out? If so, how long would it have taken instead? Or could the outbreak have been contained?

I think if you are talking post COVID then there is a chance of containment as soon as the outbreak starts and the transmission vectors become known, the govt orders everyone home/stay home and goes full Lockdown in the area allowing the Police/Army clear streets and much easier access to fight the infected. Without the Panic seen in the movie and folks trying to travel then its kept in Cambridgeshire.

Problem will always be the time delay in going from knowing it is a 'riot' to an Outbreak, and how far the infection can spread in that time. In the above scenario with all our experiences of lockdown and such I can see the first responders recognising it is an viral outbreak *much* faster than in the original timeline. Once people are ordered to stay put then its easier to fight it. Without that experience however the original timeline was fecked, as folk got up on the AM after/during the riot to goto work/school/shops and got caught up in it, and once a Horde forms spreading and spreading, leading to panic its was just a matter of time.

The 'unrealistic' bit of Rage is the speed of transmission- a few drops of a substance can turn you into homicidal rager in what 20-30 seconds tops?
 
I think if you are talking post COVID then there is a chance of containment as soon as the outbreak starts and the transmission vectors become known, the govt orders everyone home/stay home and goes full Lockdown in the area allowing the Police/Army clear streets and much easier access to fight the infected. Without the Panic seen in the movie and folks trying to travel then its kept in Cambridgeshire.

Problem will always be the time delay in going from knowing it is a 'riot' to an Outbreak, and how far the infection can spread in that time. In the above scenario with all our experiences of lockdown and such I can see the first responders recognising it is an viral outbreak *much* faster than in the original timeline. Once people are ordered to stay put then its easier to fight it. Without that experience however the original timeline was fecked, as folk got up on the AM after/during the riot to goto work/school/shops and got caught up in it, and once a Horde forms spreading and spreading, leading to panic its was just a matter of time.

The 'unrealistic' bit of Rage is the speed of transmission- a few drops of a substance can turn you into homicidal rager in what 20-30 seconds tops?
Agreed on the unrealistic.

As I understand, basically a Rager completely bound on the other side of the room would cause those in anything except space suits to become ragers within a minute. (Not sure on positive pressure suits on the care givers)
 
As such, my question would instead be this: 'Realistically' with everything else staying the same (The nature of the virus, the outbreak starting in the Cambridge lab, etc), what would the outcome have been? Would the UK still have been wiped out? If so, how long would it have taken instead? Or could the outbreak have been contained?
I'm not sure how densely populated is the British Isles outside of major cities, but seeing that the virus is not airborne, and that Ragers run about at normal human speeds (with unknown endurance levels) and requires sustenance (see: them dying out in the opening shots of 28WL) there's a good chance that national parks and mountains would become a fire break of sorts. The southwest and north of England, for one, should survive, not to mention Scotland.

Marc A
 
As I understand, basically a Rager completely bound on the other side of the room would cause those in anything except space suits to become ragers within a minute. (Not sure on positive pressure suits on the care givers)
No, blood has to get into the victim's bloodstream (or eyes in the case of Frank). In fact, Jim and Major West were standing next to the infected soldier that was vomiting up blood and they were just fine. So were the colleagues of Patient Zero and the scientist trying to stop them - until she fully succumbed, anyway.

I'm not sure how densely populated is the British Isles outside of major cities, but seeing that the virus is not airborne, and that Ragers run about at normal human speeds (with unknown endurance levels) and requires sustenance (see: them dying out in the opening shots of 28WL) there's a good chance that national parks and mountains would become a fire break of sorts. The southwest and north of England, for one, should survive, not to mention Scotland.

Marc A
I recall a 28WL prop map showing exactly that.
 
No, blood has to get into the victim's bloodstream (or eyes in the case of Frank). In fact, Jim and Major West were standing next to the infected soldier that was vomiting up blood and they were just fine. So were the colleagues of Patient Zero and the scientist trying to stop them - until she fully succumbed, anyway.
Given how much infected fluid they eject I'm surprised anybody would be able to go near one of them without getting some of it on them. A good question is how long the virus can survive outside of the body. Could a bit of blood on someones sleeve start a new outbreak? What about if dead infected were eaten by animals and then unknowingly eaten by people?
 
Given how much infected fluid they eject I'm surprised anybody would be able to go near one of them without getting some of it on them.
It's getting into the bloodstream that's the problem, not just getting it on you. Serena butchered Mark because he had open wounds and Infected blood was splashed all over him.
 
It's getting into the bloodstream that's the problem, not just getting it on you. Serena butchered Mark because he had open wounds and Infected blood was splashed all over him.
Sure, but if the infection can survive outside the body for any reasonable amount of time then getting it on you is just the first step to getting infected. Similar to how easy it is to get infected by going anywhere near an Ebola victim in our world which is the basis of RAGE.
 
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Sure, but if the infection can survive outside the body for any reasonable amount of time then getting it on you is just the first step to getting infected. Similar to how easy it is to get infected by going anywhere near an Ebola victim in our world which is the basis of RAGE.
In the case of Frank it survived long enough to drop from the body of a dead Infected being pecked on by a crow into Franks eye and as with bites and kisses and other exchanges of bodily fludis the infection was still amost instant but that was internal-as the case with Mark and Serena but If you arent bitten or cut and there is no other direct exchange of bodily fluid it probably doesnt spread usually. However given the way that Ragers snarl and vocalize they are probably constantly spraying spittle and blood all over the place so that would also explain why contact with them is so dangerous.
 
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