2001: A Space Time Odyssey (Version 2)

Having fun picking up the Version 2 of this story again.

A minor quibble with Gemini 9 and 12 missions. It looks like you butterflied away the prime crew crashing and killing themselves for Gemini 9. This means the original backup crew of Stafford and Cernan fly on Gemini 12 and Lovell and Aldrin remain the backup crew for Gemini 10, which is a dead end assignment. Unless you have changed something else with Stafford and Cernan that I am not aware of.
 
Red China's New Strong Man

China
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The Relationship between USSR and China deteriorated in 1960 during Soviet state visit to China.
Thanks to reformist Nikita Khrushchev's unlucky metaphor about how "you need to change worn old shoes“ referring to China's authoritarian form of communism similar to Stalinism.
This was translated into the Chinese metaphor of "you need to get rid of the old whore“ Mao Zedong considered this a major insult on his person.
Until 1966 the USSR and Chinese relations deteriorated to the worst they could be.
Nikita Khrushchev economic reforms which moved the USSR to less emphasis heavy Industry toward consumer goods by individual enterprises, with profits as incentives was interpreted by conservative Maoist as treason toward communism and was denounced as "reactionary" and "revisionist" in addition to the increasing amount of free political criticism and changing attitudes associated with the Khrushchev Thaw.
But Mao had other problems, the Chinese politburo wanted to remove him from power, because of a series of disastrous programs ordered by Mao and the current situation between USSR and China with the USSR and US's relations improving despite the situation in Vietnam.
In 1966 Mao Zedong found a Solution to that: The Cultural Revolution
Official a Movement by groups of young people (Red Guards) operate under Mao orders, against authorities at all levels in China.
But the situation escalated into a civil war in China and went out control as, In industrial City of Wuhan, Red Guards started to fights under each other!
Beginning in 1967 it went so bad that that Mao Zedong had to fly personal to Wuhan to deal with situation.
It was a certain Irony that Mao Zendong was killed by Red Guards believing the airplane was carrying enemy reinforcements, shooting it down during landing.

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The News of Mao dead let to the "30 Day Crisis“ a battle over control of People’s Republic of China.
Like Mao Widow, Jiang Qing and three other High rang official operating as "Gang of Four“ trying to take over the Chinese politburo but failed.
The winner of Crisis became the Chinese People’s Liberation Army under commando of Marshall Lin Biao, who restored law and order in China.
Lin Biao ruled with hard hand over China and cleaned up Mao Zedong's followers, Red Guards and made necessary reforms, leading China out it’s political isolation.
His top priority in 1968 was the Vietnam war and reconciling with the USSR with Success, Kosygin was very receptive to reconciliation with China
Biao started an arms race to build an ICBM that could hit the USA,
After the death of Ho Chi Minh in the beginning of 1968, the resulting Power struggle, was won by Pro China forces in the North Vietnamese Politburo.
The beginning of the Sino-North Vietnamese alliance
Now the USA faced a similar scenario, they had during the Korean War, Danger of being over run by the Chinese People’s Liberation Army. But this time they got Nuclear weapons !
For US Capitol Hill "The Chinese Nightmare“ started.

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[1]Khrushchev's remaining in office and his continuation of reforms, rapprochement to the West and the rise of a new class of market reformers in the USSR like Alexei Kosygin lead to a greater backlash in China and the Cultural Revolution being even more violent than in OTL. Mao Zedong is killed and Lin Biao comes to power as a result. He attempted a coup against Mao in OTL which failed in 1971. The Gang of Four also attempted a coup which also failed in OTL.
 
Having fun picking up the Version 2 of this story again.

A minor quibble with Gemini 9 and 12 missions. It looks like you butterflied away the prime crew crashing and killing themselves for Gemini 9. This means the original backup crew of Stafford and Cernan fly on Gemini 12 and Lovell and Aldrin remain the backup crew for Gemini 10, which is a dead end assignment. Unless you have changed something else with Stafford and Cernan that I am not aware of.

Great! Hope you enjoy it, we're really trying to be as realistic and yet as ambitious as we can with this timeline. I edited the post you are referring to. It should show Cernan and Stafford flying as the prime-crew for Gemini 9 now.
 
great new chapter, Mao is Dead , good , I do hope that Sanner heads prevail and no Nuclear war between China and The USA . Cant hardly wait for the next chapters .
 
SpaceGeek said:
beginning of the Sino-North Vietnamese alliance
I have a small quibble about this one. The Vietnamese, historically, hated & mistrusted the Chinese as occupiers. Why would they ally themselves? (I'll admit, I'm unaware if DRV did it OTL.:eek:)

That aside, I'm liking this quite a bit. A closer Space Race has a real appeal.:cool:
 
I have a small quibble about this one. The Vietnamese, historically, hated & mistrusted the Chinese as occupiers. Why would they ally themselves? (I'll admit, I'm unaware if DRV did it OTL.:eek:)

That aside, I'm liking this quite a bit. A closer Space Race has a real appeal.:cool:

The reason was simpel: China had occupy North of Vietnam and govern it as Province, before the French took over.
Communist Hồ Chí Minh was therefor aimed more to Soviet as China under Mao.
But to my surprise i discover in German book about this topic: there was a Pro china fraction in North Vietnamese Politburo !
During the Vietnam War thing changes, next the Help by USSR, came also Help by China !
Hồ Chí Minh manage to keep the Politburo united even after his death.
but in this TL thing are different Hồ Chí Minh dies earlier leafing the the Politburo partitioned.
and in China rules Marshall Lin Biao, who consider the Conflict as repeat of Korea war
Order massing of troops atlong border to North Vietnam and increase the Help to Vietnamese, giving the Pro china fraction a boost.
what let to political destabilization in North Vietnam.

on Space Race is for moment a "neck and neck race"
who fix there Technical problems first is the winner...
 
So there is no Vietnam War ITTL? Interesting. More money towards Lyndon Johnson's great society and the space program?
 
So there is no Vietnam War ITTL? Interesting. More money towards Lyndon Johnson's great society and the space program?

Sadly not, the Vietnam War happens and LBJ is confronted with the subversion in China and Lin Biao increasing involvement with North Vietnam.
LBJ realized the USA is now again in similar Situation as during Korea War only this time got Chinese also the Atomic bomb
next to that USSR and China relations improving
and in USA the presidential election coming

in other words: Capitol Hill got a "Chinese Nightmare"
 
Soyuz 3: First Men Round the Moon

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By fall 1968 the Soviet Manned Spaceflight Program was finally regaining it's footing after the completion of the Vostok Program forced them to develop new hardware in their long term plans for space superiority. The very public successes of the Soyuz 1 & 2 low Earth orbit docking missions along with the "Kosmos" unmanned circumlunar flights had given engineers sufficient confidence in the N-2 rocket and Soyuz spacecraft to launch a manned flight around the Moon. Although initially several spacecraft systems that were later used on the Soyuz failed during the in-flight testing phase on Vostok flights, the upgrades and modifications made to them were successesfully demonstrated during the seven day Soyuz 1 & 2, Soyuz 3 & 4 and Soyuz 5 & 6 flights. Although Zond 8 would be much more ambitious, it would also be a simpler mission. After five years of development, experimentation, testing and research the Soviets were convinced that they were ready for a circumlunar flights.
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Meanwhile the CIA was keeping a close eye on the activities of the Soviets. The American Space Program was falling behind after NASA's temporary lead over the Soviets during the Gemini Program ended. The tragic losses of four American Astronauts (one on an X-15 flight, three on Apollo-1) had made NASA significantly more cautious and delayed plans for manned testing of Apollo hardware, Giving the Soviets time to take center stage. The CIA warned that a Soviet flight around the Moon by the end of the year was imminent.
But NASA estimation for Apollo safety modification, it would take at least another months before Apollo 7 could safely launch on it's Low Earth Orbital test mission.

Aleksei Arkhipovich Leonov, Oleg Grigoryevich Makarov were given the assignment for the first trip around the Moon. The N-2 "Proton" rocket was readied for launch, this would be the first time it ever launched with a human crew. The launch escape tower had been demonstrated time and time again by the dedicated Soviet Space Agency. In retrospect it's apparent that the degree of centralized dedication towards this first goal (to the exclusion of other projects) is likely what allowed the Soviets to proceed so rapidly.

On September 15, 1968 the cosmonauts stepped up to the tower and entered the largest and most powerful rocket humans had yet flown on. They looked up at the Moon in the distance, and ascended at a remarkable acceleration. As Americans were preparing for festivities and celebration for Christmas, Comrade Paver Tsybin was hard at work ensuring his men got home in time for the Russian new year celebration.

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As the crew climbed out of the Earth's gravity well the Earth shrank, becoming smaller and smaller. Despite the magnificent size of their homeland, 14 Republics spanning 2 continents, the men felt small, very small indeed. Such significant effort was put by the engineers involved in the programme to ensure the reliability of the life support system that other systems such as the waste disposal system was neglected. This became "an unfortunate nuisance" mid flight, the fact this failure was publically disclosed was a testament to the liberalization in freedom of the press that had been taken in the Soviet Union.
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Soyuz 3 entered the Moon's gravitational influence on September 18. While numerous black and white photographs were taken, few color ones were captured although the few that were soon were printed across all the popular magazines and newspapers in the Eastern & Western Blocs (such as Time, Life, the New York Times, Pravda and Krasnaya Zvezda).

Communications blackout occurred as the cosmonauts were flung by the moon's gravity around it's backside as predicted. For the first time the far side of the Moon's landscape (although previously mapped by robotic precursors) was finally glimpsed by man's own eyes. Emerging from the farside of the Moon, witnessing the rise of the Earth over the lunar horizon mission Pilot Leonov announced to the world the now famous phrase by the Russian father of the Space Age Konstantin Tsiolkovsky.

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Man will not always stay on Earth; the pursuit of light and space will lead him to penetrate the bounds of the atmosphere, timidly at first, but in the end to conquer the whole of solar space.
The moment was far from spontaneous, the timing was precisely calculated in advance from Moscow mission planners and the cosmonauts were working off a script but that didn't detract from the awe of the moment in the slightest. Nothing could help the feeling, both for those watching the television broadcast and those around the Moon, that this was just the beginning of something much greater.
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The magic of the moment subsided as the cosmonauts began falling unstoppably back towards the Earth. In a way they had never really escaped the pull of the Earth's gravity, for although they had the energy to climb out of Low Earth Orbit, they did not have the energy to slow down into a lunar orbit let alone the energy necessary to come back from such an orbit (similer in a way, to the early Suborbital flights of the Mercury & X-15, capable of leaving Earth's atmosphere but unable to stay). After just a few hours of gazing at the magnificent desolation of the Moon, the wanderers were dragged back by the unstobable power of gravity.
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The landing on 22 September was anything but graceful as the momentary failure of the Service Module to detach from the descent module nearly resulted in mission failure and loss of the entire crew and spacecraft. The temporarily uncontrolled re-entry had mission control preparing for the worst. Thankfully the searing heat of re-entry soon solved that problem before the cosmonauts faced yet another obstacle, the failure of the retro-rockets. Although the parachutes worked as planned, this was not enough to ensure a soft landing and so the Descent module rammed into the ground at nearly 12 m/s. After the high g-forces experienced by re-entry this resulted in serious injuries to both cosmonauts including broken teeth, concussions, multiple fractures and broken bones and serious bleeding. The late arrival of the rescue team and the isolation of their landing site confounded the risk to the cosmonauts. Plans of parades and world tours were put on hold. Rumors floated among the western press that the spacecraft had crashed and that the cosmonauts had died. Despite the appearance of the injured heroes of the Soviet Union on State TV, conspiracy theories to this effect persist to this day.

Despite all the sacrifice the entire mission accomplished almost nothing scientifically, much to the dismay of the Soviet Academy of Sciences. Rather Zond 8, like Soyuz 1 & 2, was an engineering demonstration mission aimed at proven all the critical mission systems for that more ambitious goal of having the Soviet flag standing proudly on the lunar surface. The cosmonauts meanwhile celebrated their parade a year later on the anniversary of their safe return. Rather than admitting the engineering mistakes the Soviet press played off the cosmonauts as Heroes of the USSR, willing to take any amount of injury and sacrifice for the exploration of the Cosmos and the Pride of the Motherland. Several earth orbital and lunar missions brought the Soviets within spitting distance of a lunar landing from the standpoint of the American public.

Post-Vostok Soviet Manned Space Programme
November 28, 1966: Kosmos-133, Unmanned test, failure
December 14, 1966: Kosmos 134 explosion on Pad. 1-killed.
April 23, 1967: Kosmos 156 launch (Total failure), launch of Kosmos 157 scrubbed, .
September 27, 1967: Zond 4, Successful unmanned circumlunar, L1-guidance system fails, self-destruct. (finally Parachute working)
November 22, 1967: Zond 5, Successful unmanned circumlunar, L1-guidance system fails, self-destruct.
November 27 & 29, 1967: Soyuz 1 & 2, manned rendezvous/docking, EVA crew exchange, four cosmonauts. Komarov, Bykovsky, Khrunov, Yeliseyev.

February 16, 1968: Soyuz 3 & 4, manned rendezvous/docking, EVA crew exchange, four cosmonauts. Crew Gagarin*, Nikolayev, Gorbatko, and Kubasov
March 2, 1968: Zond 6, Successful unmanned circumlunar, L1-guidance system succeeds. Animals recovered.
April 23, 1968: Zond 7, Successful unmanned circumlunar L1-guidance system succeeds. Second fully successful mission. Animals recovered.
July 21, 1968: Planned Unmanned Launch, Block D stage explosion on Pad. 3-killed.
September 15, 1968: Zond 8, Manned circumlunar flyby, two cosmonauts, 1500 km closest aproach. Crew Bykovskiy, Rukavishnikov
October 11, 1968: Soyuz 5 & 6, manned rendezvous/docking, EVA crew exchange, four cosmonauts. Crew Shatalov, Volynov, Shonin, Volkov
November 10, 1968: Zond 9, Manned Circumlunar flyby, two cosmonauts, 1110.4 km closest aproach. Crew Leonov, Makarov
January 20, 1969: Zond 10, circumlunar flyby.
 
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This adds some suspense. Is a prelude to a Soviet Moon landing, or is it an American moon landing? It might be the same as the original, but I don't remember the original draft, so I can't remember what happened.
 
I can't reply properly because I have to work an extra full day tomorrow and I'm cross-eyed tired now...

But I'm pretty excited by this latest installment!

"Proton" ITTL is a derivative of the (OTL) anyway Korolev N-1 design, right? It is the downgraded version that takes the second and third stage of the projected big rocket (substituting the engines specialized for sea level and relatively low altitude from the big A block of the big -1 rocket for the high-altitude version on the -1's second stage--as they are specialized versions of the same basic engine this is easy to do) to make a smaller booster. Analogous to Saturn 1B's (actually all Saturn 1x versions) relationship to Saturn V, but a much closer relationship--functionally N-1 corresponds to Saturn V, and N-11 (as everyone else in OTL or other timelines referred to the shortened version) to Saturn 1B in role.

But not in capability! I've been working N-1 related stuff again lately due to other threads, and I figure that even taking a conservative and less capable 1962 version of the N-1 as the baseline (three stages only, capable of putting 62 tons into LEO) a two stage rocket using that version's Block B and V stages only can still match OTL Chelomei's Proton at 18+ tons in LEO--but adding on a third stage could I believe enable that to be raised to 24 tons and more! Presumably using the more advanced ker-lox engines eventually developed OTL for the N-1 launches attempted OTL, it would be even more--I've recently seen a Silverbird Launch calculator result as high as 29 tons!:D

I may have goofed when I did that though.:eek:

The tricky thing with N-1 is to judge just what sorts of dry stage and propellant masses are reasonable. I figured Korolev was reasonably sober with his 1962 design and took the masses from Encyclopedia Astronautica verbatim; when I look at later versions, including the flown one, I feel one had better beef up the dry masses of the stages a bit since we know OTL they took all sorts of dubious shortcuts to get the masses down--and used what I consider a pretty dubious method of stuffing in as much propellant as possible by chilling it! So I feel I have to downgrade the masses given for propellant, since I don't think the chilled fuel procedure is a good idea at all--not from the point of view of maximizing propellant anyway. Given realities of launch pad holds and the fact that weather can be unpredictable means that one might find the fuel warming up and spilling out (or with no relief valve, bursting out:eek:--the sensible thing to do is leave a little ullage space and fill the thing at standard temperature.

So if I try to see what the redesigned later version can really do I have to guess how much to heavy up the dry components and scant the fuel. So it is all guesswork:eek:
-----
Anyway I heartily approve your ATL for choosing the ker-lox N-1 complex, which I'd forgotten is your big switch from the original version of this TL (where it was going to be Chelomei's hypergolic UR monster.

So apparently the little brother is called "Proton" for the same reason the UR-300 derivative was OTL, for the first set of significant non-test payload, used to launch the Proton probes. Here it is a Korolev rocket that gets that name.

Also you call it N-2 alternatively, instead of -11. This strikes me as quite sensible!
 
very good new update , i hope that NASA lands on the Moon,and get some very interesting scientific discoveries . Cant hardly wait for the next update Space Geek
 
THX Shevek23
i got similar number calculating the N-1 complex
here it replace two rockets of OTL the UR-500 ICBM "Proton" and R-7 ICBM "Soyuz"
and put to getter with another big block form the N1 "Luna" super booster
the original 1962 „Nositjel“ modular approach of Sergei Korolev would have brought cost reduction by building one and same rocket components
for Three Mission types 7 tons, 24 tons and 95 tons in low orbit

Now the designation there ware several N1, N11, N111, N-1, N2 etc.

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As Americans were preparing for festivities and celebration for Christmas, Comrade Paver Tsybin was hard at work ensuring his men got home in time for the Russian new year celebration.
Pavel, surely. Is this a real person? Also, why "Russian" new year celebration? They celebrate the same time as everyone else, no?

that other systems such as the waste disposal system was neglected. This became "an unfortunate nuisance" mid flight, the fact this failure was publically disclosed was a testament to the liberalization in freedom of the press that had been taken in the Soviet Union.
I don't want to think about it.
The landing on 28 December was anything but graceful as the momentary failure of the Service Module to detach from the descent module nearly resulted in mission failure and loss of the entire crew and spacecraft. The temporarily uncontrolled re-entry had mission control preparing for the worst. Thankfully the searing heat of re-entry soon solved that problem before the cosmonauts faced yet another obstacle, the failure of the retro-rockets. Although the parachutes worked as planned, this was not enough to ensure a soft landing and so the Descent module rammed into the ground at nearly 12 m/s. After the high g-forces experienced by re-entry this resulted in serious injuries to both cosmonauts including broken teeth, concussions, multiple fractures and broken bones and serious bleeding. The late arrival of the rescue team and the isolation of their landing site confounded the risk to the cosmonauts. Plans of parades and world tours were put on hold. Rumors floated among the western press that the spacecraft had crashed and that the cosmonauts had died. Despite the appearance of the injured heroes of the Soviet Union on State TV, conspiracy theories to this effect persist to this day.
Umm... They admit to shit floating around the cabin (worst case), but not to the cosmonauts having broken bones? That seems ... improbable to me.
 
THX Shevek23
i got similar number calculating the N-1 complex
here it replace two rockets of OTL the UR-500 ICBM "Proton" and R-7 ICBM "Soyuz"
and put to getter with another big block form the N1 "Luna" super booster
the original 1962 „Nositjel“ modular approach of Sergei Korolev would have brought cost reduction by building one and same rocket components
for Three Mission types 7 tons, 24 tons and 95 tons in low orbit

Now the designation there ware several N1, N11, N111, N-1, N2 etc.

17460709330_4ffc5faabb_c.jpg

I don't believe he had the "N111" replace the Soyuz, which latter was a well proven craft by this point, no? Or was this just your suggestion? Or did I not read this version carefully enough?
 
I don't believe he had the "N111" replace the Soyuz, which latter was a well proven craft by this point, no? Or was this just your suggestion? Or did I not read this version carefully enough?

I skimmed over it last night and indeed the plan is to replace the R-7 with the N-3.

I don't know; I spent a fair amount of time running variations on the N system rockets through Silverbird and it seems that while the N-2 is remarkably capable, the N-3 seems marginal. But as I've said before, anything other than the very problematic OTL N-1F of the late 60s is speculative; note how Michel Van's versions of the N-3 already deviate from anything found in any known OTL draft design, with different numbers of engines on the A and B Blocks. Since the N-2 "Proton" and the N-3 "Soyuz" are supposed to take the successive B and V blocks as their first stages, and presumably any higher stages are also going to be similar to N-1 stages minus one or two, respectively, we have to know how these upper stages evolve and deviate from OTL plans.

It seemed to me that even with a special upper stage to try to optimize it the N-3 would be anemic compared to an R-7, but since Michel has already mutated Block B, I certainly don't have a very solid basis for modeling a block V, let alone higher stages still; looking at Mishin's late 60s design seems of only limited value as a guide--recall that by the time development was approved for the N-1, and that heavy rocket only, no derivatives, the focus was on the Moonshot; all the masses should be optimized toward pushing the planned Lunar payload, not toward serving as lower stages on a smaller rocket.
 
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