1960s in a central Powers victory world.

[lounge60]

Vienna,April 3 1965.President Henry Cabot Lodge is arrived today with TWA Airship "USS Constitution.President Lodge will meet tomorrow at Hofburg Palace Emperor Otto Von Habsburg, and Prime minister Kirchschläger.Mr.President said that the relationship to United States and Habsburgic Commonwealth are fraternal and strong. President Lodge before his return to United States will be to United Republic to see in London President McMillan.

 

[mobius]

With no American intervention and a Brest_Litovsk like peace in the East things could be like this:
Peace in the west after a stalemate with a Peace Conferece in Switzerland.

Germany annexes Latvia and Estonia, Luxemburg, gets back its colonies and if they`re lucky Belg Congo but loses its pacific and China colonies to Brtain and Japan.
Prabably some years after the war will end up ruled by a military-conservative regime like OTL`s Dolfuss Austria and Horthy Hungary wich means nazism has been preempted.

France loses nothing except its pride and the blood of its youth. France will end up ruled by a conservative regime similar to Vichy, maybe even a monarchy, but it`s doubtful if they will engage in agressive politics after having suffered so much in vain during the war.

 

[mobius]

Austria without some disaster will be kept together. They don´t annnex anything except maybe Sanjak to cut Serbia from sea And Having a Bridge to Kosovo That becames Albanian, Albania becomes a austrian satellite and an occupation force is established in Serbia.

Galicia is going to be given to Poland that has a Habsburg king. Hungary after the war is going to have to accept universal suffrage so to keep a magyar majority in Parliament They are going to give kingdom status to Croatia who anexes Bosnia and Dalmatia. Without Galicia and Dalmatia Cisleitania Has a slim german Majority becoming more stable.

THE Tripartite Monarchy could survive indefinetely altough probably it will become little more Than three countries with a common monarch, common foreign policy and common economy

 

[Wendell]

With no American intervention and a Brest_Litovsk like peace in the East things could be like this:
Peace in the west after a stalemate with a Peace Conferece in Switzerland.

Germany annexes Latvia and Estonia, Luxemburg, gets back its colonies and if they`re lucky Belg Congo but loses its pacific and China colonies to Brtain and Japan.
Prabably some years after the war will end up ruled by a military-conservative regime like OTL`s Dolfuss Austria and Horthy Hungary wich means nazism has been preempted.

France loses nothing except its pride and the blood of its youth. France will end up ruled by a conservative regime similar to Vichy, maybe even a monarchy, but it`s doubtful if they will engage in agressive politics after having suffered so much in vain during the war.

While that might work, I think that the British would have wanted to gain something in Africa. Perhaps the eastern portion of the Belgian Congo?

 

[Ivan Druzhkov]

Does anyone have any ideas on what the Americans will be doing if they never intervene in Europe? Right now, it seems like there might be some financial hiccups in the 1920s, when the French (and maybe Britain) default on their war loans. The USN is probably going to start expanding in reaction to a continued German naval presence in the Atlantic, the inability of the Royal Navy to stop them, and to the stirring of Japanese imperialism in East Asia. Given German interest in Latin America before WWI and Japanese interest in the islandsof SE Asia, you could easily end up with a naval war or two in the 1940s. Of course, these wars would probably be far more limited in scope than WW2, so by the 1960s the United States is probably going to be considered the White China: it's powerful and wealthy, but generally keeps to itself.

 

[B_Munro]

Of course, these wars would probably be far more limited in scope than WW2, so by the 1960s the United States is probably going to be considered the White China: it's powerful and wealthy, but generally keeps to itself.

Extensive US exports, and large investments abroad, will make the US a much more intrusive presence than China: after all, Quing Chinese merchants weren't buying up large parts of London. [1] Or has globalization and free trade been killed dead, dead, dead, in this TL?

Bruce

[1] Well, aside from those working for the insidious Fu Manchu. And they worked through European intermediaries.

 

[Wendell]

Does anyone have any ideas on what the Americans will be doing if they never intervene in Europe? Right now, it seems like there might be some financial hiccups in the 1920s, when the French (and maybe Britain) default on their war loans. The USN is probably going to start expanding in reaction to a continued German naval presence in the Atlantic, the inability of the Royal Navy to stop them, and to the stirring of Japanese imperialism in East Asia. Given German interest in Latin America before WWI and Japanese interest in the islandsof SE Asia, you could easily end up with a naval war or two in the 1940s. Of course, these wars would probably be far more limited in scope than WW2, so by the 1960s the United States is probably going to be considered the White China: it's powerful and wealthy, but generally keeps to itself.

Maybe the Americans accept loan repayments in the form of colonies?

 

[Ivan Druzhkov]

Extensive US exports, and large investments abroad, will make the US a much more intrusive presence than China: after all, Quing Chinese merchants weren't buying up large parts of London. [1] Or has globalization and free trade been killed dead, dead, dead, in this TL?

Bruce

[1] Well, aside from those working for the insidious Fu Manchu. And they worked through European intermediaries.

Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of modern China: happily capitalistic, interested in making friends with various uncolonized peoples as an “honest broker,” but not all that eager to project substantial military force outside its own sphere. I have no illusions about the strange things you’d have to do to make Americans act like the Qing.

Maybe the Americans accept loan repayments in the form of colonies?

I doubt the Americans would take them. In OTL, the Americans wouldn’t accept a mandate over Armenia as part of the Versailles Treaty, and most pre-1950s foreign adventures that extended beyond the Americas usually resulted in the occupied territory getting self-government pretty damn fast. Furthermore, when the European debts start to become an issue (the mid-1920s, probably), there’s still going to be plenty of fresh memories about the Phillipine insurrection that will make those colonies seem less appetizing.

 

[B_Munro]

Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of modern China: happily capitalistic, interested in making friends with various uncolonized peoples as an “honest broker,” but not all that eager to project substantial military force outside its own sphere. [\QUOTE]

Say China in 30 years time, if it's foreign policies don't change: the US is going to have a much bigger economy vs the rest of the planet than OTL China. Remember, China is still essentially a third-world economy outside a few regions: the US, after all, has been more economically developed than _any_ European country since before the turn of the century. [1] [2] (I dunno where this "US impoverished in a Central Powers world" stuff comes from).

Bruce

[1]Twentieth, that is: sometimes I forget it's the 21st...where's my flying car?

[2] Well, Luxemburg, Switzerland. But we're talking small countries, EC integration, and a post-WWII development.

 

[Faeelin]

I(I dunno where this "US impoverished in a Central Powers world" stuff comes from).

Bruce

[1]Twentieth, that is: sometimes I forget it's the 21st...where's my flying car?

[2] Well, Luxemburg, Switzerland. But we're talking small countries, EC integration, and a post-WWII development.

Ooh, you'd love Kaisserreich, where a neutral America leads to a civil war in the 1930s after years of depressions between Syndicalists, California Secessionists, and God-Emperor Huey Long.

 

[B_Munro]

Ooh, you'd love Kaisserreich, where a neutral America leads to a civil war in the 1930s after years of depressions between Syndicalists, California Secessionists, and God-Emperor Huey Long.

Naah, I prefer less ASB TLs, such as this one https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=35174


(To be serious, sure we can have a screwed-up US in a "Central Powers Win" TL. I just don't see how one is particularly _likely_ to lead to the other.)

best,
Bruce

 

[B_Munro]

Naah, I prefer less ASB TLs, such as this one https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=35174


(To be serious, sure we can have a screwed-up US in a "Central Powers Win" TL. I just don't see how one is particularly _likely_ to lead to the other.)

best,
Bruce

Actually, re-reading what I just wrote, I may be wrong: a screwed-up US might indeed lead to a Central Powers victory!

Bruce

 

[Empror Mike]

The world is a better, tolerant place. Civil and workers' rights are much higher in TTL in 1960s then in OTL in 2000s.
Ottoman Empire collapses, and Austria-Hungary becomes the United States of Austria-Hungaria.

The Americans try to do evil but are much less succesfull then in OTL.

The end.... or is it?