An Alternate Trek
- Thread starter Lindseyman
- Start date
series 3
Reset Broadcast March 16th 1968
The episode starts in the conference room in Woomera. There are now two Spocks in the room. One is the Science Officer of the Endeavour, the other is the hooded and cloaked version seen at the end of the last episode. It is this Spock that is addressing the startled and frightened conference.
He tells them that he is an android from a society called “The Rememberers”. It is their chosen role to record and remember as much as possible that happens in the galaxy. They have been carrying out this task for hundreds of thousands of years.
To the horror of the conference he announces that the energy field is the harbinger of the end of this history! It has reappeared several times since the Rememberers started recording. Each time it heads for a version of Earth scoring planets along its path. When it finds an Earth it sends a signal if it does not receive the expected reply that Earth is scoured and the whole galaxy is reset back by about 10 000 years. As a side effect another Earth also appears in the galaxy! The Rememberers strongly suspect that this had happened even before they were created, in a previous pass of history. It is as if this energy cloud is trying to recreate the Earth from which it originated has become the accepted theory. Only once did history not get reset as the version of Earth that it then visited was then in a preindustrial age and it was as if it knew that the time was not right so history was allowed to continue. It was this pass of the cloud that Savek (Anthony Quayle) had referred to earlier.
However this time it was heading towards Tellus which had reached an appropriate level of industrialisation and history was going to be reset again. The Android Spock tells them that each pass of history follows the same basic path but the details are different. There has been a United Planets, an Association of Planets, a Federation of Planets, once there was a Terran Empire! The time before the reset is longer when the USA was the leader in creating a United Earth which then led the creation of the galactic community. As this time it was the German Empire on Tellus, the Rememberers expect history to be reset quickly.
They had announced themselves to the Commonwealth as they had interacted with the Rememberers before, albeit with certain rogue elements for example on Gemini III and its environs. Android Spock tells them that it is possible to save the records of their history and perhaps even the Commonwealth itself, if enough of their ships are in jump space when history is reset. They can show the Commonwealth how to reengineer their jump engines to achieve that.
Decker gathers his Spock and Holmes and beams back to the Endeavour. Back on board he has a meeting of his command crew. They agree that they have to attempt to stop the Energy Cloud. Scotty and O’Gorman look at the recordings of the cloud and say that they can come up with a way to neutralise it but then it depends on what is creating the cloud. Just as they are preparing to break orbit three people beam on board. One is Admiral Pike (Christopher Plummer) the previous Captain of the Endeavour, one is Quos (Earl Cameron) and the other is the Android Spock.
Pike tells Decker that he suspected what he was going to attempt as he would have done it himself and wanted to offer his help as did the Android Spock. Quos has brought schematics of the Klingon Stealth Device which they will need to evade the Tellurian Navy. Scotty and O’Gorman begin to build a Stealth Device and Decker orders the Endeavour to prepare to jump to the Tellus system.
PS Does anyone know haow to change the date in the title of my last episode from 1986 to 1968?
The episode starts in the conference room in Woomera. There are now two Spocks in the room. One is the Science Officer of the Endeavour, the other is the hooded and cloaked version seen at the end of the last episode. It is this Spock that is addressing the startled and frightened conference.
He tells them that he is an android from a society called “The Rememberers”. It is their chosen role to record and remember as much as possible that happens in the galaxy. They have been carrying out this task for hundreds of thousands of years.
To the horror of the conference he announces that the energy field is the harbinger of the end of this history! It has reappeared several times since the Rememberers started recording. Each time it heads for a version of Earth scoring planets along its path. When it finds an Earth it sends a signal if it does not receive the expected reply that Earth is scoured and the whole galaxy is reset back by about 10 000 years. As a side effect another Earth also appears in the galaxy! The Rememberers strongly suspect that this had happened even before they were created, in a previous pass of history. It is as if this energy cloud is trying to recreate the Earth from which it originated has become the accepted theory. Only once did history not get reset as the version of Earth that it then visited was then in a preindustrial age and it was as if it knew that the time was not right so history was allowed to continue. It was this pass of the cloud that Savek (Anthony Quayle) had referred to earlier.
However this time it was heading towards Tellus which had reached an appropriate level of industrialisation and history was going to be reset again. The Android Spock tells them that each pass of history follows the same basic path but the details are different. There has been a United Planets, an Association of Planets, a Federation of Planets, once there was a Terran Empire! The time before the reset is longer when the USA was the leader in creating a United Earth which then led the creation of the galactic community. As this time it was the German Empire on Tellus, the Rememberers expect history to be reset quickly.
They had announced themselves to the Commonwealth as they had interacted with the Rememberers before, albeit with certain rogue elements for example on Gemini III and its environs. Android Spock tells them that it is possible to save the records of their history and perhaps even the Commonwealth itself, if enough of their ships are in jump space when history is reset. They can show the Commonwealth how to reengineer their jump engines to achieve that.
Decker gathers his Spock and Holmes and beams back to the Endeavour. Back on board he has a meeting of his command crew. They agree that they have to attempt to stop the Energy Cloud. Scotty and O’Gorman look at the recordings of the cloud and say that they can come up with a way to neutralise it but then it depends on what is creating the cloud. Just as they are preparing to break orbit three people beam on board. One is Admiral Pike (Christopher Plummer) the previous Captain of the Endeavour, one is Quos (Earl Cameron) and the other is the Android Spock.
Pike tells Decker that he suspected what he was going to attempt as he would have done it himself and wanted to offer his help as did the Android Spock. Quos has brought schematics of the Klingon Stealth Device which they will need to evade the Tellurian Navy. Scotty and O’Gorman begin to build a Stealth Device and Decker orders the Endeavour to prepare to jump to the Tellus system.
PS Does anyone know haow to change the date in the title of my last episode from 1986 to 1968?
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series 3
Shock Broadcast March 23rd 1968
Missiondate 4043.6, the Endeavour is having to fight her way out of the Solar System. She is being continually attacked and harried by the small ships of the Rememberers. Although any one, or indeed ten, of them would be no problem there appear to be hundreds of them and they are slowly wearing the Endeavour’s defences down. Decker is hailed by the CinC of the fleet (guest star Bernard Lee) who tells Pike and Decker that they should come to their senses as this a Code Trinity situation.
On hearing this Decker and Pike share a surprised glance and Decker orders all systems to be shut down with immediate effect. Scotty registers a complaint but does so. Almost as soon as the Endeavour’s systems have shut down there is a massive energy surge through the Solar System. All the Rememberer ships cease any sort of activity. The Android Spock also slumps no longer functioning.
“Well that is an added bonus” murmurs Pike to Decker. Within 5 minutes the Endeavour’s systems are back up and running and she makes the jump point.
“We won’t jump straight to the Tellurian System” Decker announces “as we will need to test the Stealth Device”. He orders a jump to the Gemini System. However there is a strange discontinuity and instead of arriving at the Gemini System the Endeavour arrives at the Guardian’s Planet. Decker remarks that he thought that this planet was no longer approachable after the Zeng He had left at the end of Pike’s court martial.
“Well the Curie made several attempts and failed each time” is Pike’s reply. Just then the Endeavour is hailed from the planet’s surface. Instead of the Guardian, it is Magister (guest star Christopher Lee) that speaks to them.
“Good you have arrived. We have a little problem, our mutual little friend has tried and failed to stop the energy cloud but we don’t know why. This is going to take a lot of explaining so can you beam down and we’ll discuss the problem”
Decker, Pike, Spock and Quos beam down to the planet’s surface and are met by Magister. He leads them to a room where the Guardian is resting on a bed. There are several chairs around him and he waves weakly at them to sit down. He gestures to Magister and whispers in his ear. Magister looks surprised and whispers something back. The Guardian nods and then slumps back.
Magister then begins to explain about the cloud but says that he will have to include some very ancient history. “Thousands of Millennia ago, this planet was the centre of a thriving civilisation. Like all civilisations it had its idealistic, pragmatic and even corrupt periods but the lot of its peoples was generally happy. Then it discovered Time Travel, at first it was just used to observe, then over the centuries it became abused until the civilisation was very corrupt and decadent. One of the peoples that were enslaved by this civilisation (mine adds Magister) rebelled and after a short war a new more equable consensus was reached and applied. However whilst this war was continuing another species developed time travel and found out about the way that history had been altered including their own. They objected strongly and a Time War broke out between the two civilisations. It was horrendous Time was in a period of constant flux as each race tried to gain an advantage by changing the other’s history. Just as the newcomers had just about beaten our defences down something happened the cloud appeared for the first time. It had obviously observed our conflict for some time and had prepared more than adequate defences. Both our and our enemies’ fleets were completely destroyed. It destroyed our world (already severely damaged by my experiments adds a subdued Magister), the Guardian only survived because he was elsewhere. It then headed to our enemies homeworld signalled it and when it did not receive the expected reply scoured it and somehow reset history by 10000 years. As a side effect a duplicate of its homeworld was created.”
Just then Decker interrupts “Are you saying that the new time travelling civilisation was us?”
“No” replies the Magister “but it was human and based on Earth!”
To be continued
Missiondate 4043.6, the Endeavour is having to fight her way out of the Solar System. She is being continually attacked and harried by the small ships of the Rememberers. Although any one, or indeed ten, of them would be no problem there appear to be hundreds of them and they are slowly wearing the Endeavour’s defences down. Decker is hailed by the CinC of the fleet (guest star Bernard Lee) who tells Pike and Decker that they should come to their senses as this a Code Trinity situation.
On hearing this Decker and Pike share a surprised glance and Decker orders all systems to be shut down with immediate effect. Scotty registers a complaint but does so. Almost as soon as the Endeavour’s systems have shut down there is a massive energy surge through the Solar System. All the Rememberer ships cease any sort of activity. The Android Spock also slumps no longer functioning.
“Well that is an added bonus” murmurs Pike to Decker. Within 5 minutes the Endeavour’s systems are back up and running and she makes the jump point.
“We won’t jump straight to the Tellurian System” Decker announces “as we will need to test the Stealth Device”. He orders a jump to the Gemini System. However there is a strange discontinuity and instead of arriving at the Gemini System the Endeavour arrives at the Guardian’s Planet. Decker remarks that he thought that this planet was no longer approachable after the Zeng He had left at the end of Pike’s court martial.
“Well the Curie made several attempts and failed each time” is Pike’s reply. Just then the Endeavour is hailed from the planet’s surface. Instead of the Guardian, it is Magister (guest star Christopher Lee) that speaks to them.
“Good you have arrived. We have a little problem, our mutual little friend has tried and failed to stop the energy cloud but we don’t know why. This is going to take a lot of explaining so can you beam down and we’ll discuss the problem”
Decker, Pike, Spock and Quos beam down to the planet’s surface and are met by Magister. He leads them to a room where the Guardian is resting on a bed. There are several chairs around him and he waves weakly at them to sit down. He gestures to Magister and whispers in his ear. Magister looks surprised and whispers something back. The Guardian nods and then slumps back.
Magister then begins to explain about the cloud but says that he will have to include some very ancient history. “Thousands of Millennia ago, this planet was the centre of a thriving civilisation. Like all civilisations it had its idealistic, pragmatic and even corrupt periods but the lot of its peoples was generally happy. Then it discovered Time Travel, at first it was just used to observe, then over the centuries it became abused until the civilisation was very corrupt and decadent. One of the peoples that were enslaved by this civilisation (mine adds Magister) rebelled and after a short war a new more equable consensus was reached and applied. However whilst this war was continuing another species developed time travel and found out about the way that history had been altered including their own. They objected strongly and a Time War broke out between the two civilisations. It was horrendous Time was in a period of constant flux as each race tried to gain an advantage by changing the other’s history. Just as the newcomers had just about beaten our defences down something happened the cloud appeared for the first time. It had obviously observed our conflict for some time and had prepared more than adequate defences. Both our and our enemies’ fleets were completely destroyed. It destroyed our world (already severely damaged by my experiments adds a subdued Magister), the Guardian only survived because he was elsewhere. It then headed to our enemies homeworld signalled it and when it did not receive the expected reply scoured it and somehow reset history by 10000 years. As a side effect a duplicate of its homeworld was created.”
Just then Decker interrupts “Are you saying that the new time travelling civilisation was us?”
“No” replies the Magister “but it was human and based on Earth!”
To be continued
series 3
Tempus Fugit Broadcast March 30th 1968
Missiondate 4051.2 the Endeavour is preparing to leave the Guardian's planet to try and stop the energy cloud. The crew is very aware of Magisters last message. "It is unlikely that you will succeed. To the Guardian's knowledge this has been attempted over 100 times and each time history has been reset. Our time travel device will only work within the reset history not through all history even though he has records of them all." Magister has given them the records of all the attempts to stop the cloud of which the Guardian has access. It has been sobering to see them. Some of the crews and ships have looked very familiar even if the names have been different. One of the attempts has piqued their interest. In this version of history a Spaceship called the USS Enterprise commanded by James Kirk (that bombast mutters Decker (see the Episode Decline and Fall)) managed to stop the cloud but failed to transmit the full signal needed.
Spock and Scotty pore over the records of that attempt and think they have found out why it failed. The Enterprise broadcast an old contact signal of their equivalent of a late 20th century NASA probe called Explorer II. It caused the cloud to stop but Spock says it is as if the ship at the centre of the cloud deliberately stopped the signal from working. It has given him an idea and he has found the equivalent from their history and has compared the signals. They are almost identical.
Decker, Pike and Quos agree that it has to be worth a try so they jump to the Tellurian system and engage the Stealth Device. Once there they find utter carnage. There are multiple wrecks of ships some of which have survivors. We'll worry about them if we succeed is Decker's order. They approach the cloud which has almost reached Tellus. The energy cloud has dissapated somewhat but Scotty and O'Gorman manage to cause the remaining energy cloud to shut down (as they had promised earlier). At the centre is indeed a craft that looks like a 20th century probe although it has some interesting additions almost as if someone had repaired it using different technology.
The craft begins to broadcast a signal to Tellus. Spock and Holmes analyse it and find that it is an old NASA signal but is being broadcast on an old long unused radio frequency. They broadcast their old NASA reply. The probe swings round and scans them. It then sends out a blocking signal which also damages their energy systems. The Endeavour is left virtually powerless and they register a power buildup of an unusual type centered on the probe.
Thinking that they have failed Decker orders that the Endeavour should ram the probe to try and destroy it before their history is expunged. Spock in a last attempt broadcasts the signal on every wavelength that the damaged Endeavour can manage. Just as they are about to reach the probe the energy build up stops and a massive signal is received which burns out the Endeavour's sensors.
However five minutes later they are still there. Scotty by some miracle gets some sensors working. The probe has gone, Tellus is still there as are the wrecked remains of its fleet but there no longer seem to be any survivors and there are no signals from Tellus. They seem to have suceeded although they cannot contact the Commonwealth. Decker orders them to make enough repairs to attempt the jump back to Earth.
Missiondate 4051.2 the Endeavour is preparing to leave the Guardian's planet to try and stop the energy cloud. The crew is very aware of Magisters last message. "It is unlikely that you will succeed. To the Guardian's knowledge this has been attempted over 100 times and each time history has been reset. Our time travel device will only work within the reset history not through all history even though he has records of them all." Magister has given them the records of all the attempts to stop the cloud of which the Guardian has access. It has been sobering to see them. Some of the crews and ships have looked very familiar even if the names have been different. One of the attempts has piqued their interest. In this version of history a Spaceship called the USS Enterprise commanded by James Kirk (that bombast mutters Decker (see the Episode Decline and Fall)) managed to stop the cloud but failed to transmit the full signal needed.
Spock and Scotty pore over the records of that attempt and think they have found out why it failed. The Enterprise broadcast an old contact signal of their equivalent of a late 20th century NASA probe called Explorer II. It caused the cloud to stop but Spock says it is as if the ship at the centre of the cloud deliberately stopped the signal from working. It has given him an idea and he has found the equivalent from their history and has compared the signals. They are almost identical.
Decker, Pike and Quos agree that it has to be worth a try so they jump to the Tellurian system and engage the Stealth Device. Once there they find utter carnage. There are multiple wrecks of ships some of which have survivors. We'll worry about them if we succeed is Decker's order. They approach the cloud which has almost reached Tellus. The energy cloud has dissapated somewhat but Scotty and O'Gorman manage to cause the remaining energy cloud to shut down (as they had promised earlier). At the centre is indeed a craft that looks like a 20th century probe although it has some interesting additions almost as if someone had repaired it using different technology.
The craft begins to broadcast a signal to Tellus. Spock and Holmes analyse it and find that it is an old NASA signal but is being broadcast on an old long unused radio frequency. They broadcast their old NASA reply. The probe swings round and scans them. It then sends out a blocking signal which also damages their energy systems. The Endeavour is left virtually powerless and they register a power buildup of an unusual type centered on the probe.
Thinking that they have failed Decker orders that the Endeavour should ram the probe to try and destroy it before their history is expunged. Spock in a last attempt broadcasts the signal on every wavelength that the damaged Endeavour can manage. Just as they are about to reach the probe the energy build up stops and a massive signal is received which burns out the Endeavour's sensors.
However five minutes later they are still there. Scotty by some miracle gets some sensors working. The probe has gone, Tellus is still there as are the wrecked remains of its fleet but there no longer seem to be any survivors and there are no signals from Tellus. They seem to have suceeded although they cannot contact the Commonwealth. Decker orders them to make enough repairs to attempt the jump back to Earth.
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series 3
Episode list for Series 3 (second half of Season 2 elsewhere)
1. Tomorrow's Endeavour broadcast 6th Jan 1968
2. The Message broadcast 13th Jan 1968
3. Through the Looking Glass broadcast 20th Jan 1968
4. What They Found There broadcast 27th Jan 1968
5. Of Mhysse and Men broadcast 3rd Feb 1968
6. Decline and Fall broadcast 10th Feb 1968
7. The Quest broadcast 17th Feb 1968
8. The Zoo broadcast 24th Feb 1968
9. Between a Rock... broadcast 2nd Mar 1968
10. The Conference broadcast 9th Mar 1968
11. Reset broadcast 16th Mar 1968
12. Shock broadcast 23rd Mar 1968
13. Tempus Fugit broadcast 30th Mar 1968
Once again Star Trek beat anything that the BBC scheduled against it into the ground. However once again there was a slight decline in viewing figures although Tomorrow's Endeavour and Tempus Fugit both achieved the highest viewing figures for any episode of Star Trek broadcast so far. Research showed that the casual viwers were dropping away because of the runs of linked episodes which meant that they felt that if they missed one they couldn't pick up the story. (These linked episodes would however be a major selling point when it came to selling the video tapes, then the DVDs and then the Blu Rays but thats long in the future
)
However there was a battle brewing between Lew Grade and the American Networks on one hand and the unlikely (given their falling out earlier) partnership of the Roddenberrys and the Andersons over how Star Trek should approach Series 4 and 5 (Season 3). Lew and the Americans wanted more BANGS, a settled bad guy and episodes which could be broadcast in any order. The Roddenberrys and Andersons liked story arcs and a definite episode order(although they didn't mind having some stand alone episodes). There was a massive behind the scenes battle virtually from when series 3 was in the can until the start of filming for series 4. When the dust settled there were some major changes on the production and direction side.
1. Tomorrow's Endeavour broadcast 6th Jan 1968
2. The Message broadcast 13th Jan 1968
3. Through the Looking Glass broadcast 20th Jan 1968
4. What They Found There broadcast 27th Jan 1968
5. Of Mhysse and Men broadcast 3rd Feb 1968
6. Decline and Fall broadcast 10th Feb 1968
7. The Quest broadcast 17th Feb 1968
8. The Zoo broadcast 24th Feb 1968
9. Between a Rock... broadcast 2nd Mar 1968
10. The Conference broadcast 9th Mar 1968
11. Reset broadcast 16th Mar 1968
12. Shock broadcast 23rd Mar 1968
13. Tempus Fugit broadcast 30th Mar 1968
Once again Star Trek beat anything that the BBC scheduled against it into the ground. However once again there was a slight decline in viewing figures although Tomorrow's Endeavour and Tempus Fugit both achieved the highest viewing figures for any episode of Star Trek broadcast so far. Research showed that the casual viwers were dropping away because of the runs of linked episodes which meant that they felt that if they missed one they couldn't pick up the story. (These linked episodes would however be a major selling point when it came to selling the video tapes, then the DVDs and then the Blu Rays but thats long in the future
)However there was a battle brewing between Lew Grade and the American Networks on one hand and the unlikely (given their falling out earlier) partnership of the Roddenberrys and the Andersons over how Star Trek should approach Series 4 and 5 (Season 3). Lew and the Americans wanted more BANGS, a settled bad guy and episodes which could be broadcast in any order. The Roddenberrys and Andersons liked story arcs and a definite episode order(although they didn't mind having some stand alone episodes). There was a massive behind the scenes battle virtually from when series 3 was in the can until the start of filming for series 4. When the dust settled there were some major changes on the production and direction side.
"Real" World
Gene Roddenberry was proving to be too much of an irritant to Lew Grade. He just didn't have any idea how to budget properly. Star Trek ALWAYS overan its budget. Lew shuddered to think what would have happened to the budget if Gerry and Sylvia Anderson hadn't been involved. OK they could both be prima donnas about intellectual property and being left alone but they did understand about the bottom dollar.
Also to sell the program to the states the program had to be made more user friendly for the networks who claimed that story arcs and no real bad guys just people trying to get along doing the best they could did not make successful television. They also bemoaned the lack of romantic interest, although several of the crew obviously did have families and relationships and the lack of big bangs which had occurred in Thunderbirds. On being told that the lack of these didn't seem to have hampered sales and viewing figures in the rest of the world they just shrugged their shoulders and said if you want prime time US television slots you need to make a primetime US television show!
Both Gene and Gerry saw the reasoning but neither did they see the need to change something that obviously worked. Lew argued long and hard that programmes that did well in the States did well elsewhere but that the opposite did not often work and that Star Trek was a prime example of that! He wanted to crack the US market and to keep to budget.
The arguments started before the end of filming for series 2, continued through the filming for series 3 and eventually Lew had had enough.
Gene Roddenberry was promoted to be Executive Producer but had no real power over the programmes. Like wise for Gerry Anderson although he was still in charge of the special effects. To produce the show Lew brought in Leonard White and Brian Clemens from the Avengers, it was in hiatus as they couldn't find a suitable replacement for Diana Rigg. Clemens brought in Malcolm Hulke as chief scriptwriter as he had experience of Science Fiction programmes and Hulke brought along his "protege" Terence Dicks.
Satisfied that he was now going to get the Star Trek that he wanted, Lew was happy. It didn't quite work out as he had planned!
Also to sell the program to the states the program had to be made more user friendly for the networks who claimed that story arcs and no real bad guys just people trying to get along doing the best they could did not make successful television. They also bemoaned the lack of romantic interest, although several of the crew obviously did have families and relationships and the lack of big bangs which had occurred in Thunderbirds. On being told that the lack of these didn't seem to have hampered sales and viewing figures in the rest of the world they just shrugged their shoulders and said if you want prime time US television slots you need to make a primetime US television show!
Both Gene and Gerry saw the reasoning but neither did they see the need to change something that obviously worked. Lew argued long and hard that programmes that did well in the States did well elsewhere but that the opposite did not often work and that Star Trek was a prime example of that! He wanted to crack the US market and to keep to budget.
The arguments started before the end of filming for series 2, continued through the filming for series 3 and eventually Lew had had enough.
Gene Roddenberry was promoted to be Executive Producer but had no real power over the programmes. Like wise for Gerry Anderson although he was still in charge of the special effects. To produce the show Lew brought in Leonard White and Brian Clemens from the Avengers, it was in hiatus as they couldn't find a suitable replacement for Diana Rigg. Clemens brought in Malcolm Hulke as chief scriptwriter as he had experience of Science Fiction programmes and Hulke brought along his "protege" Terence Dicks.
Satisfied that he was now going to get the Star Trek that he wanted, Lew was happy. It didn't quite work out as he had planned!
There is a possibility of a pretty massive ATL here...
It's about now that the first episode of "Dad's Army" is about to air ("The Man and the Hour", Wednesday 31 July 1968). The role of Captain Mainwaring was originally offered to Jon Pertwee, who turned it down IOTL. Season 6 of "Dr Who" is about to start on BBC 1 (10 August 1968 IOTL).
It was at this point that Dr Who was nearly cancelled IOTL due to bad ratings, but in the event they went with the recasting to Pertwee, the introduction of color, and cheaper Earth-bound episodes: season 7 and 8 was a success, and the program continued.
But now you have Hulke and Dicks writing for ITTL Star Trek, so I'm thinking...if you get Pertwee to accept the Mainwaring role and get the BBC to cancel Dr Who in 1969 before season 7...you'll have butterflied away Dr Who ITTL
It's about now that the first episode of "Dad's Army" is about to air ("The Man and the Hour", Wednesday 31 July 1968). The role of Captain Mainwaring was originally offered to Jon Pertwee, who turned it down IOTL. Season 6 of "Dr Who" is about to start on BBC 1 (10 August 1968 IOTL).
It was at this point that Dr Who was nearly cancelled IOTL due to bad ratings, but in the event they went with the recasting to Pertwee, the introduction of color, and cheaper Earth-bound episodes: season 7 and 8 was a success, and the program continued.
But now you have Hulke and Dicks writing for ITTL Star Trek, so I'm thinking...if you get Pertwee to accept the Mainwaring role and get the BBC to cancel Dr Who in 1969 before season 7...you'll have butterflied away Dr Who ITTL
I honestly hadn't thought about killing off Dr Who although it may well be more of a close run thing ITTL given how successful this British Star Trek has become (apart from in the US). What had crossed my mind is a longer hiatus between the end of the Troughton Doctor and the third (who will NOT be Jon Pertwee as he has accepted the role of Captain Mainwaring nor will it be Ron Moody (the other major candidate OTL)). As they say "Watch this space!".
On another note over 30 000 views! I never thought that this thread would get that many even in my dreams. Thanks to all of you who have taken the time to read this and especially to those who have commented. Your thoughts have been much appreciated.
On another note over 30 000 views! I never thought that this thread would get that many even in my dreams
. Thanks to all of you who have taken the time to read this and especially to those who have commented. Your thoughts have been much appreciated.I was just rereading the previous episodes to try and find out what (if any) roles Patrick McGoohan/Edward Woodward/David McCallum played ITTL to see if you could squeeze one of them into being the Third Doctor, when I noticed this....
Does this famous Navy officer wear a lot of Scarlet?...
Does this famous Navy officer wear a lot of Scarlet?...
No not ITTL but Captain Turner in the previous episode does manage to wear a lot of black.
Does this famous Navy officer wear a lot of Scarlet?...
Jon Pertwee's Mainwaring would have been different to Arthur Lowe's Mainwaring. I agree that now he would seem to have been a better fit for Sergeant Wilson but he was the first choice for Mainwaring. The way Arthur Lowe played Mainwaring would have made a good version of Hodges but that means no Bill Pertwee.
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"Real" World
Excerpt from an interview given by Malcolm Hulke in 1976
I and Terry had a big problem on taking up the reins. The three Americans (Richard Bradford, Glenn Corbett and Gary Clark) all wanted out for various reasons but mainly as they were getting fed up of being away from home for so long. They HAD to appear in the first episode at least, to tie up the loose ends so to speak and we got that agreement from them. Lew (Lew Grade) insisted on having a big name known in the US to replace them. Our first thought was Robert Vaughn and he was interested, but our schedules never coincided enough for him to be feasible (although he did make a guest appearance). The actor we did get, whilst not a mistake as he was a consumate professional, did bring a LOT of baggage from his previous role!
I and Terry had a big problem on taking up the reins. The three Americans (Richard Bradford, Glenn Corbett and Gary Clark) all wanted out for various reasons but mainly as they were getting fed up of being away from home for so long. They HAD to appear in the first episode at least, to tie up the loose ends so to speak and we got that agreement from them. Lew (Lew Grade) insisted on having a big name known in the US to replace them. Our first thought was Robert Vaughn and he was interested, but our schedules never coincided enough for him to be feasible (although he did make a guest appearance). The actor we did get, whilst not a mistake as he was a consumate professional, did bring a LOT of baggage from his previous role!
Andy Griffith? Bill Cosby? Robert Reed? Are you going to butterfly away the Brady Bunch?...
"Real" World
Excerpt from an Interview with Terence Dicks 1988
Replacing those three (Richard Bradford, Glenn Corbett and Gary Clark) was something we (Terence Dicks, Malcolm Hulke,Leonard White and Brian Clemens) could have done without! The big sticking point was Lew Grade's insistance that at least one of the replacements had to be a name recognised in the US.
Unfortunately Robert Vaughn was a no, although it was closer than most people think. We then thought about Roger Moore as he was getting fed up with the Saint but he signed on for another series. Chris (Christopher Plummer) suggested Bill Shatner and again we got close but the timings were wrong. Andy Griffiths was available as was Robert Reed but they weren't willing to spend so much time in the UK and were wary of SF. Adam West was approached but although he thanked us for our interest he wanted to do something completely different and everyone would have expected Kapow to appear on the screen every time he punched someone!
Shooting was getting closer when someone suggested Bill Cosby. He was available and willing especially as he was going to be the lead. It caused no problems in the UK or elsewhere but we were NOT prepared for the reaction to this casting in the States!
Replacing those three (Richard Bradford, Glenn Corbett and Gary Clark) was something we (Terence Dicks, Malcolm Hulke,Leonard White and Brian Clemens) could have done without! The big sticking point was Lew Grade's insistance that at least one of the replacements had to be a name recognised in the US.
Unfortunately Robert Vaughn was a no, although it was closer than most people think. We then thought about Roger Moore as he was getting fed up with the Saint but he signed on for another series. Chris (Christopher Plummer) suggested Bill Shatner and again we got close but the timings were wrong. Andy Griffiths was available as was Robert Reed but they weren't willing to spend so much time in the UK and were wary of SF. Adam West was approached but although he thanked us for our interest he wanted to do something completely different and everyone would have expected Kapow to appear on the screen every time he punched someone!
Shooting was getting closer when someone suggested Bill Cosby. He was available and willing especially as he was going to be the lead. It caused no problems in the UK or elsewhere but we were NOT prepared for the reaction to this casting in the States!
Lord, you've just butterflied away "The Bill Cosby Show" (not the "Cosby Show")...
Actually, he is a very good fit. We remember him now as an avuncular comedian, but in in the 60's he showed he could act steely and determined. So he'd be good as the captain of a starship. I assume his comedic side will begin to be introduced in a year or two's time.
Incidentally, is the series still being shot in the UK at this point?
"Real" World
The First Officer Post was easy, recalled Brian Clemens in 1976, we finally gave Spock the promotion his character deserved but this made free the post of Chief Scientific Officer. Ian Richardson's Holmes was first choice but he wanted to cut back his appearances as he was getting a lot of theatre offers. Although we loved Brian Blessed's character Stein, there was no way any sane organisation would have him in charge of the Sciences!
We wanted a fairly objective and impartial character to be CSO, then I remembered the Colonel from the film Quatermass and the Pit. Julian (Glover) was available and willing so he became CSO Commander Richard Bryne. We also filled our other post with an actor from the same film as Bryan Marshall became Lieutenant Commander John Travis Chief of Security.
Bill Cosby as Captain Benjamin Russell was a delight to work with at all times. However we were all taken aback by the strength of the reaction to his casting by some of the US Media.
We wanted a fairly objective and impartial character to be CSO, then I remembered the Colonel from the film Quatermass and the Pit. Julian (Glover) was available and willing so he became CSO Commander Richard Bryne. We also filled our other post with an actor from the same film as Bryan Marshall became Lieutenant Commander John Travis Chief of Security.
Bill Cosby as Captain Benjamin Russell was a delight to work with at all times. However we were all taken aback by the strength of the reaction to his casting by some of the US Media.
"Real" World
From an interview with Terence Dicks in Doctor Who Magazine October 2013
I and Malcolm(Malcolm Hulke) had just started work on Star Trek when we started hearing the rumours. We ignored them, surely no one could be that stupid! We were so wrong! The BBC press release caught us completely by surprise but not the newspaper headlines the next day. The Sun had the headline "EXTERMINATE" and the Mirror more prosaically "Daleks finally get the Doctor!"
Both played on the fact that the BBC had cancelled the next series of Doctor Who to replace it with Terry's (Terry Nation) spinoff "The Daleks". Some idiot in the BBC hierarchy had decided that they couldn't run both programmes and as viewing figures had slipped the Doctor had to go! It caught poor Pat (Patrick Troughton) on the hop, he really thought that there would be at least one more series. He swore never to work for the BBC again (1), he felt that badly let down. It bore all the hallmarks of a rushed decision as the last episode wasn't a farewell (unlike Sylvester McCoy's in 1987)(2). It really was a case of decide in haste and repent at leisure!
I felt sorry for Terry! Overnight he went from being the "Whovians" favourite scriptwriter to one of the most hated men in Britain. He had nothing to do with the decision. In a strange way it also signed Star Trek's death warrant although we didn't realise it at the time (68/69 series 4 and 5) but a year later (69/70 series 6 and 7).
1 He was persuaded otherwise later.
2 No it's not cancelled permanently.(For how long the Doctor is off the air keep reading)
I and Malcolm(Malcolm Hulke) had just started work on Star Trek when we started hearing the rumours. We ignored them, surely no one could be that stupid! We were so wrong! The BBC press release caught us completely by surprise but not the newspaper headlines the next day. The Sun had the headline "EXTERMINATE" and the Mirror more prosaically "Daleks finally get the Doctor!"
Both played on the fact that the BBC had cancelled the next series of Doctor Who to replace it with Terry's (Terry Nation) spinoff "The Daleks". Some idiot in the BBC hierarchy had decided that they couldn't run both programmes and as viewing figures had slipped the Doctor had to go! It caught poor Pat (Patrick Troughton) on the hop, he really thought that there would be at least one more series. He swore never to work for the BBC again (1), he felt that badly let down. It bore all the hallmarks of a rushed decision as the last episode wasn't a farewell (unlike Sylvester McCoy's in 1987)(2). It really was a case of decide in haste and repent at leisure!
I felt sorry for Terry! Overnight he went from being the "Whovians" favourite scriptwriter to one of the most hated men in Britain. He had nothing to do with the decision. In a strange way it also signed Star Trek's death warrant although we didn't realise it at the time (68/69 series 4 and 5) but a year later (69/70 series 6 and 7).
1 He was persuaded otherwise later.
2 No it's not cancelled permanently.(For how long the Doctor is off the air keep reading
)
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What happens to Red Dwarf ITTL? Is it set in Star Trek Universe?
On a related note, is the US version set in the same continuity?
And what happens to Star Wars? Expanded Universe tv series?
On a related note, is the US version set in the same continuity?
And what happens to Star Wars? Expanded Universe tv series?
1. No Red Dwarf is (will be?) a production for the BBC so it won't be in the Star Trek Universe.
2. That would be telling
3. I really don't know yet. This is growing "organically". I haven't thought much beyond 1970.