Map Thread IX

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Yep, the Japanese are still allied with Britain, since the Germans have been incredibly influential in China untill fairly recently ITTL, so TTLs Russia hasn't gotten around to kicking them out yet, but it's on the bucket-list.

So France and Russia against Britain and Germany? Because I can hardly see the British looking favorably on the Russian takeover of most of the middle East. Heck, I have trouble seeing the French being happy with such an engorgement of Russia, now that they are neighbors in central Europe... (BTW, would a Soviet Union this large be believable? If not, why Russia)

Bruce
 
A while ago I did a map of a world where the Persians conquer Greece, but are taken down some time later by an alliance between an Indian prince and some rebellious satraps. However, the emperor retreated to Sardis and worked out a deal with the westernmost satraps, and the empire (officially the Persian Empire, but usually called as the Sardic Empire because it was more Greek than Persian culturally and was ruled by Greeks after the first two emperors and because a new Persian Empire was built in the actual Persia after a very brief period of Indian rule and a much longer period of civil war) survived in Greece, the southern Balkans, and Asia Minor. It prospered and expanded, mostly into Europe (the first Greek emperor was obsessed with conquering Europe, and passed on the dream to his descendants, leading to a confrontational relationship with Carthage which varied between aggressive influence-building and long bloody wars), but also in Asia Minor, where they became bitter enemies of the expansionist Kingdom of Iberia (the Caucasus' Iberia, not the Iberian Peninsula). Most of the time, the gains in Europe were small, but eventually a young emperor launched a major campaign north (previously, the Sardic Empire ruled just about all of the Balkans, but no farther). It was quite successful, and included the conquest of the entire Oder river, all the way up to the Baltic. However, these territories were weakly held and served to anger the Germanic tribes. They were united under the banner of the charismatic Irmin, later nicknamed "the Hammer," who gave himself the fictitious title of "High Satrap of Europe" and marched south, which is where the story on the map begins. The map is set in 177 BC, after the ensuing wars have ended. Carthage and Syria go on to dominate the Mediterranean between them, as well as expanding along the Atlantic coast (for Carthage) and into other parts of the Near East (for Syria).

Post-Fall WPE+.gif
 
The world from my timeline circa 1885.

Questions, comments, and criticism always welcome.

This was well done, but some of the U.S. state borders need to be redrawn, badly. I suggest starting with TTL's Minnesota, Kansas, and whatever OTL's Arizona ended up being named. (East and West Texas look okay, though.)
Also, what's with the blue outline in Western Canada? :confused:
 
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This was well done, but some of the U.S. state borders need to be redrawn, badly. I suggest starting with TTL's Minnesota, Kansas, and whatever OTL's Arizona ended up being named. (East and West Texas look okay, though.)
Also, what's with the blue outline in Western Canada? :confused:
Please don't quote images. :)
 
Interesting. Also, I like the level of detail you've put, well, everywhere.

Thank you very much! :)

Afghanistan got smashed and divided between its neighbours, (Central-)Poland has a new overlord and the birth of a French colonial empire in East Asia.
What is the name of the Slavic state in the Balkans?

Persia was the real winner there, not so much a division as it is an occupation.

"Vell, the Germans have at least given us some liberties already. And they've promised not to try and make us into Wenden."

Its rather amazing what occupying Korea does for one's outlook on life.

Beautiful, wolf_brother. :D Glad to see the American colonial empire coming into fruition. Looking forward to updates on the *Canada area, China, and particularly Latin America and Africa.

May I also note to the thread at large that New Mexico could have been a state right away, but there's this thing called racism sooooo...

And a thank you to you as well! :)

Honestly I think what people aren't commenting on is just as interesting as what they are looking at :)

Serbocroatia.

Ye gods.. I have an advocate! :eek:

Wouldn't the Slovenes oppose such naming?

Compare to OTL's Austria-Hungary, and specifically how the Czechs were in many ways considered rural or degenerate Germans.

I just saw that San Marino still exists indepedently from Italy, how's that possible.

Might be that they have already been independent for 1,500 and some years at the date of this map? Oldest still-surviving nation, IIRC.

As Lascupa0788 states San Marino, like IOTL, is never drawn into the Italian unification program. They had their opportunity in 1848, but the revolution never spread into the city-state beyond a few minor protest demonstrations, and the city council specifically asks the Italian government not to join the Confederacy.

That being said though unlike IOTL the Sammarinese have never offered refuge to the likes of Garibaldi, simply because Italian unification is so much more successful ITTL, so there's no honor-bound agreement between San Marino and Rome, and the Italians are certainly going to be pushing for annexation at some point, which the Sammarinese are unlikely going to be able to resist due to simple economic and demographic pressures without a great power patron.

Also I see that Russian's protection of fellow Orthodox nations happens in Greece, although I suppose that the Greeks will have very tense relations with both Bulgarians and Turks over Crete, Cyprus and Thessaloniki and other Greek-speaking areas and might cause further Russo-Ottoman Wars.

The Balkans still seem a mess, Hungary has lost lots of land to the Romanians and Russians (or quite a few) while the Serbo-Croatian entity has grown into encompassing Serbia and not just Serbian areas of the Quadruple Monarchy, which seems to have vanished.

I wonder what's going on in Canada and Australia, looks liek the British aren't capable of properly controlling their OTL white dominions while Indian seems to been suffering a sepoy-like revolt. Bad times for British, but thanks to O'Donnell and the Carlist kings, really good in colonization terms for Spain, perhaps would they try an occupation of Morocco?

The Second Republican period is certainly going to be the height of Greek irredentist nationalism.

The Balkans aren't really a mess; now the the Dinarides though, that's a different matter altogether. Hungary specifically is going through a lot of internal pressures at the moment, most of it stemming from its territorial losses and national disgrace, which has resulted in demands for bosszú. As for Serbocroatia see my above reply to Grand Prince Paul II. on the topic.

I'm not sure why Britain's (lack of) control over her white dominions is so surprising; Australia was a penal colony until quite late in her history, and British North America west of the Great Lakes was all-but ignored by London. Hell the Brits were more than willing to toss the whole of Canada under the bus even as late as the 1930s IOTL in case of a War Plan Red-esque scenario. The most important thing to note here, at least IMHO (and I could be wrong; I'm always open to outside commentary), is that the North American territories have received responsible government (e.g. local rule) earlier, and thus the reason for the West-East split, where as Australia hasn't been graced with such a policy at all.

India is undergoing what will later be called the Second War of Indian Independence, but for right now the London newspapers are decrying the 'Great Revolt.'

Spain is doing about as well as she possibly can be at the moment, and then some (see: South America), however her colonial aspirations will have to be put on hold soon by the outbreak of another round of in-fighting.

This was well done, but some of the U.S. state borders need to be redrawn, badly. I suggest starting with TTL's Minnesota, Kansas, and whatever OTL's Arizona ended up being named. (East and West Texas look okay, though.)
Also, what's with the blue outline in Western Canada? :confused:

I'm not exactly sure what your criticism regarding the US state borders are. Could you explain a bit further? Keep in mind that ITTL's New Mexico, Kansas, and Minnesota aren't the same as OTL's states.

The blue outline is the RCS New Zealand color, which I've applied to Western Canada to show the differences between the Kingdom of Canada and the Confederation of Colombia.

-----

I spoke about this idea a while back and it's finally finished, to a degree anyway.

Go on, take a wild guess :D

Was the choice of bottle-green for Russia a conscious one; e.g. is this a republican Russia?

Reposting because Minecraft clearly distracted you from my map.

Interesting. What's the state of affairs in the rest of North America? More specifically, what's stopping British *America from expanding across the whole of the continent?

My MOTF entry for this week: :)

Mannerheim's version of Suursuomi (Greater Finland) during the Continuation War. The text reads "Fight for victory! Let Greater Finland become a reality!". Large letters is Finnish, small letters is Swedish due to the bilingual situation in Finland.

I was in sort of a rush so I might have mistyped something, but generally I'm quite happy with how it turned out.

I can't speak to the content, as its outside of my area of knowledge, but the presentation is amazing. What techniques/effects did you use to get that particular poster look?

A while ago I did a map of a world where the Persians conquer Greece, but are taken down some time later by an alliance between an Indian prince and some rebellious satraps. However, the emperor retreated to Sardis and worked out a deal with the westernmost satraps, and the empire (officially the Persian Empire, but usually called as the Sardic Empire because it was more Greek than Persian culturally and was ruled by Greeks after the first two emperors and because a new Persian Empire was built in the actual Persia after a very brief period of Indian rule and a much longer period of civil war) survived in Greece, the southern Balkans, and Asia Minor. It prospered and expanded, mostly into Europe (the first Greek emperor was obsessed with conquering Europe, and passed on the dream to his descendants, leading to a confrontational relationship with Carthage which varied between aggressive influence-building and long bloody wars), but also in Asia Minor, where they became bitter enemies of the expansionist Kingdom of Iberia (the Caucasus' Iberia, not the Iberian Peninsula). Most of the time, the gains in Europe were small, but eventually a young emperor launched a major campaign north (previously, the Sardic Empire ruled just about all of the Balkans, but no farther). It was quite successful, and included the conquest of the entire Oder river, all the way up to the Baltic. However, these territories were weakly held and served to anger the Germanic tribes. They were united under the banner of the charismatic Irmin, later nicknamed "the Hammer," who gave himself the fictitious title of "High Satrap of Europe" and marched south, which is where the story on the map begins. The map is set in 177 BC, after the ensuing wars have ended. Carthage and Syria go on to dominate the Mediterranean between them, as well as expanding along the Atlantic coast (for Carthage) and into other parts of the Near East (for Syria).

A *Greco-Persian empire spanning from Asia Minor to the Balkans seems a bit much. The Carpathians are no laughing matter, especially in the Slovakian highlands.

EDIT: Baltic, not Balkans.
 
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A while ago I did a map of a world where the Persians conquer Greece, but are taken down some time later by an alliance between an Indian prince and some rebellious satraps. However, the emperor retreated to Sardis and worked out a deal with the westernmost satraps, and the empire (officially the Persian Empire, but usually called as the Sardic Empire because it was more Greek than Persian culturally and was ruled by Greeks after the first two emperors and because a new Persian Empire was built in the actual Persia after a very brief period of Indian rule and a much longer period of civil war) survived in Greece, the southern Balkans, and Asia Minor.).

Nice map, interesting concept. What's the OTL year? And do you have a link to the older map?

Bruce
 
Ok, here's a map for my ASB thread - the world of the old tv series "Amerika", in which the USSR defeats the US by ASB fiat in 1987 and takes over, at the supposed time of the series...

(A scenario will be along a bit later.)

Bruce

Amerika1998.png
 
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My God! You brilliant, brilliant man! I love WWI Hell-To-A-Handbasket Maps! :D
Thanks, heh. Not quite sure, though, if I fall under brilliant :p.

Finally finished Oceania* and Africa; fixed some mistakes. Now...
Does anyone want to see this made into a map series?

Comments and criticisms welcome~!


*: The Pre-1900 maps are even worse then usual on the subject... I had to research the status of each separate island chain...

1912.png
 
Ok, here's a map for my ASB thread - the world of the old tv series "Amerika", in which the USSR defeats the US by ASB fiat in 1987 and takes over, at the supposed time of the series...

(A scenario will be along a bit later.)

Bruce
There are two 19s: one in Albania (which is what the 19 in the text is about), and one in Finland.
 
Its rather amazing what occupying Korea does for one's outlook on life.

This means there will be a more successful and intense TTL equivalent to the OTL French campaign against Korea, right?
It would explain why France occupies territories of Corea's former(?) overlord.
Is South China a republic?

That being said though unlike IOTL the Sammarinese have never offered refuge to the likes of Garibaldi, simply because Italian unification is so much more successful ITTL, so there's no honor-bound agreement between San Marino and Rome, and the Italians are certainly going to be pushing for annexation at some point, which the Sammarinese are unlikely going to be able to resist due to simple economic and demographic pressures without a great power patron.

Italian unification (Italian: il Risorgimento, or "The Resurgence") was the political and social movement that agglomerated different states of the Italian peninsula into the single state of Italy in the 19th century. Despite a lack of consensus on the exact dates for the beginning and end of this period, many scholars agree that the process began in 1815 with the Congress of Vienna and the end of Napoleonic rule, and ended sometime around 1863 with the War of Polish Restoration. The last città irredente however, did not join the Italian Confederation until...

I am now certain that San Marino is the said last "città irredente".
 
I had to research the status of each separate island chain...

I had to do that when I was still doing the GCS History maps, actually I have a Wordpad saved of the history of all the Pacific islands from status changes from 1600 (though mostly from 1800) to their independence.
 
Nice. And I approve up the Munroist writeup. :D

Minor couple points: 21. I think you have "eastern" where there should be "western". And perhaps the "beating" rather than "throbbing" heart of industry? Throbbing sounds vaguely painful.

(Now we need a song for the future Yazoo state. The words "up" and Yazoo" must take place in close proximity. )

Bruce

Thanks! And I'm glad you don't mind my homage to your style. Thats a good point about 21. But then what Munroist map is complete without a trivial mistake. And I'll thinking you'll find throbbing only ever has positive connotations. Presumably the song'll involve sticking something up someone else's Yazoo.


Interesting. What's the state of affairs in the rest of North America? More specifically, what's stopping British *America from expanding across the whole of the continent?

Its Britain-in-America. Well, the Hudson's Bay Company still exists, and is evolving into more of an EIC type thingy, carving native groups into native kingdoms tied economically to the Company with areas of direct company control based around forts known as 'plantations'. Settlement by whites is only very sparse. Newfoundland is not integrated into either as it is under military jurisdiction following Catholic Irish riots. For now, its staying a colony, separate from Britain-in-America. Louisianne is back under the Kingdom of the French, the result of a French revolution which produced a constitutional monarchy rather than a republic. As its only 1800, Alaska remains Russian, and New Spain remains under Spanish jurisdiction despite the collapse of their south american domains. New Spain is an autonomous kingdom.
 
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So France and Russia against Britain and Germany? Because I can hardly see the British looking favorably on the Russian takeover of most of the middle East. Heck, I have trouble seeing the French being happy with such an engorgement of Russia, now that they are neighbors in central Europe... (BTW, would a Soviet Union this large be believable? If not, why Russia)

Bruce

No Britain stayed neutral during the conflict. They entered it in the closing months, mainly to secure parts of German Africa and Ottoman Arabia.
Before hostilities had broken out Britain had been working at better relations with Germany, they dominated the continent and were kind enough to leave Britain with their empire enact after the Great war, so some sort amiable relationship was necessary.

They avoided getting into the alliance system on the continent as no one in Whitehall was sure who would win this one, though arrangements were made with the individual powers for dealings after the conflict. Russian dominance of eastern Europe was seen as natural, Russian dominance of the Middle East is countered by large British influence in Mesoptamia and the Persian Gulf. They'd also secretly agreed to a carve up of Ottoman Arabia before Britains entry, British commercial interests in Asia being protected and the size of the Russian North Sea and Mediteranean fleets.

France in everyone's opinion is lucky that Russia doesn't dominate all of Germany. Frances war was colonial and naval, with the only really struggles being trying to attack German shipping in Atlantic (no Britain=no blockade). France only attacked Germany in Europe after the Russians were advancing into Prussia and the Hungarians and Bulgarians had jumped ship, which was a blast to the Rhine and carpet bombing the Rhur. By time the war ended Berlin, Vienna and Constantinople had fallen to the Russians, most of northern German, western Austria and some of northern Italy was already occupied by. When negotiations broke out it was France who was asking Russia to let then expand their European occupation zone into unoccupied regions of Germany, aswell as annexing German African colonies.

Actually I think this is more realistic, Russia isn't Communist ITTL, they're authoritarian yes, but frankly the world expects that. Britain is more likely to like this Russia than the USSR for the fact that they are at heart capitalists and they're willing to look after business interests, couple with that the fact this Russia lost more men than the USSR, and far more than France or Britain ITTL, then they have some sympathy for having such a huge occupation zone.

They've been industrialising for far longer than the USSR, they're military was very experienced before the major conflict, they've had open trade with most of the rest of the world all this time, they're one of the few places autarky has sort of worked, they're allies trust them more then the Wallies trusted the USSR and are willing to share information with them. I think this Russia does have potential to be this large and dominating.

Was the choice of bottle-green for Russia a conscious one; e.g. is this a republican Russia?

Yes it was, though mainly for aesthetic reasons, I just prefer green to gold.
Russia at this point has just had it's President dissolve the republic, he's reformed the empire with himself as Tsar.
 
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Ok, here's a map for my ASB thread - the world of the old tv series "Amerika", in which the USSR defeats the US by ASB fiat in 1987 and takes over, at the supposed time of the series...

(A scenario will be along a bit later.)

Bruce

Bhutan can survive almost EVERYTHING.

Does it have Gross National Happiness?
 
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