The "east" coast of Antarctica looks an awful lot like Ireland's east coast...
Right, that's it, been in the Map Thread too long.
Map Thread V
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Right, that's it, been in the Map Thread too long.
A fairly random map, somewhat prompted by an old Jack Williamson story and some recent entries:
It's a world where, thanks to a delayed Soviet bomb project, no Korean war and the Guomindang winning in China, the US is less spooked by the Red Menace, and after some nasty disagreements re European colonial policy, ends up largely withdrawing into isolationsim by the mid-50's, from which it would not really emerge until the 70s.
Western Europe survives, but its heavily militarized and poorer society eventually ends up taking a turn to the hard right: by the early 21st century western Europe is more closely integrated than our EC, but one of the things that unifies it is a distinctly racist conception of "Europeanness" which is a bit uncertain as to whether Slavs are really part of the Herrenvolk or not.
The USSR doesn't collapse, but it reaches economic crisis by the late 80s anyway, and has been pursuing painful two-steps-forward-one-step-backward reforms since the early 90's. By the late 90's Soviet forces had largely withdrawn from Eastern Europe and a three-way struggle for influence began that is still ongoing.
China is the fourth Big Power, and is 15-20 years ahead of OTL China in terms of economic development.
Bruce
It's a world where, thanks to a delayed Soviet bomb project, no Korean war and the Guomindang winning in China, the US is less spooked by the Red Menace, and after some nasty disagreements re European colonial policy, ends up largely withdrawing into isolationsim by the mid-50's, from which it would not really emerge until the 70s.
Western Europe survives, but its heavily militarized and poorer society eventually ends up taking a turn to the hard right: by the early 21st century western Europe is more closely integrated than our EC, but one of the things that unifies it is a distinctly racist conception of "Europeanness" which is a bit uncertain as to whether Slavs are really part of the Herrenvolk or not.
The USSR doesn't collapse, but it reaches economic crisis by the late 80s anyway, and has been pursuing painful two-steps-forward-one-step-backward reforms since the early 90's. By the late 90's Soviet forces had largely withdrawn from Eastern Europe and a three-way struggle for influence began that is still ongoing.
China is the fourth Big Power, and is 15-20 years ahead of OTL China in terms of economic development.
Bruce
Updated the AFLE map I did a bit back. Between 2009 and 2012, the Edinburgh Highlanders moved to Inverness and teams were added in Venice and Zurich. In 2013, two more teams will be added in La Palma, Oslo, and Rome. The AFLE has quickly grown in popularity in northern Italy and there are rumors that more teams will be coming from there in the near future. Meanwhile, French officials in the league have been complaining about there still only being two teams to represent France.
Also, sorry about the big empty space in the east. I forgot/was too lazy to crop it before I saved it.
Also, sorry about the big empty space in the east. I forgot/was too lazy to crop it before I saved it.
Hm? I don't see it as particularly an improvement on OTL: China is better off, but Western Europe is nastier, as are some of it's allies: that's a still-Aparthied South Africa, for instance. An Israel without a superpower defender has avoided Victory Disease, but all of Korea went Red after US forces withdrew. Six of one, half a dozen of another, I'd say.
Bruce
Thande
Donor
Good concept (and map), Bruce, but in one of my usual displays of pedantry, I have to criticise the presence of a "European Union" - everyone seems to forget the term was only coined in 1993 and to have it appear in TLs with PODs this early seems rather convergent. A much more popular phrase among euro-federalists back before and immediately after WW2 was "United States of Europe".
Well, to be fair, it is a reasonable name- especially if the people coming up with the name might not want to be that clear on just how united this Union is, so I wouldn't call all that unrealistic that it sometimes shows up in timelines with a pre-1993 POD.
Philip
Donor
True.
I don't know if it is so convergent as to be rejected. Perhaps USE falls out of favor as relations with USA deteriorate through the 1950s. Then again, EU isn't the only other option, and I may be making excuses for someone who missed a fine point of history.
"Zurich Gnomes?" I think the "Pikers" would be a much better name. Anyway, for the next round of French expansion teams, I vote for the "Bordeaux Privateers" and the "Strasbourg Brewers"
Updated the AFLE map I did a bit back. Between 2009 and 2012, the Edinburgh Highlanders moved to Inverness and teams were added in Venice and Zurich. In 2013, two more teams will be added in La Palma, Oslo, and Rome. The AFLE has quickly grown in popularity in northern Italy and there are rumors that more teams will be coming from there in the near future. Meanwhile, French officials in the league have been complaining about there still only being two teams to represent France.
Also, sorry about the big empty space in the east. I forgot/was too lazy to crop it before I saved it.
Someone suggested that for Europe, I liked it, so I ran with it.
I was thinking of doing a team in Bordeaux or Strasbourg, but couldn't think of names. Thanks.Anyway, for the next round of French expansion teams, I vote for the "Bordeaux Privateers" and the "Strasbourg Brewers"
That was pretty much my first reaction when seeing the map. A B_Munro map where the entire world isn't a FAT-esque shithole?! There has to be something wrong with him.
But seriously, it's good to see another of your maps, B_Munro. It may not be perfect, but it's the least dystopian one I've seen in a while.
A map,
The pod is that the Huns do not invade Europe but Persia together with their White hunnic brethern. They largely destroy the Eastern Roman and Persian Empires. They establish an empire that stretches from Anatolia to Mesopotamia and from Armenia to Egypt.
Then the Goths and other tribes arrive in Greece driven there by nomadic tribes like the Sarmatians, Alans and the like. The Sarmatians establish dominance over the Alans and other tribes and conquer large parts of the Pannonian plaines. Meanwhile the Goths have been sacking Greece until the court of the ERE in Constantinople asks them to fight the Huns in Anatolia. The Huns by this time are fragmenting into several smaller kingdoms. This seems a good chance for the ERE to regain land in Asia.
However the Goths decide to take most of the land they take from the Huns for themselves. The ERE reacts furious and decides to destroy the Goths. With no real threat at their other borders due to the Sarmatians being at war with the WRE over Illyria. The Roman forces that where assigned to defeat the Goths where destroyed in their first battle. This greatly weakened the power of the ERE which now started to truly collapse under the weight the losses of Anatolia, Egypt and Syria plus the destruction of their remaining forces brought.
Now with a part of the goths crossing over to the other side of the sea of Marmara the city of Constantinople was being surrounded by all sides. The only reasons that the Goths couldnt take the city was because of the strong naval presence the ERE had in the Aegean and Black seas and its large walls.
At the point that the WRE and the ERE are having little to no control over the provinces of Illyria and Epiros several of its cities revolt. In Epiros a new emperor is declared who quikly uses the confusion and weakness of the Empires to consolidate a large region in Greece and Epiros for himselve. At this point the Goths have split into two tribes the Ostro and Visi Goths. The Visi Goths live in Thrace and Macedonia with the city of Thessalonica as capital of their region. And the Ostro goths who control the Pontus (North Anatolia) region. They are fighting with the Huns over Cappadocia.
The Hunnic Empire which now is at the verge of collapse with invaders in the west and the new born Sassanid Dynasty which is attacking them in the East they are facing collapse. This happens in the year that the Armenian revolt takes place. The Armenians where deported to Cilicia as soldiers and captives. The huns moved large parts of the old vassal of the ERE, Armenia to this region. The Armenians who liked the natives of Cillicia which where also Orthodox christians had reached popular support took arms and defeated the Hunnic forces counter attacking them.
In the West the WRE is doing much better. Now they have only lost Illyria to barbarian invaders but pressure is growing at their borders. German tribes are pushing their northern and western borders while Saxons (yes those are german to) are attacking the British islands. After several years of peace while the Hunnic and Eastern Roman empires are collapsing they are now starting to have troubles to. Lombards are attacking the Alpine provinces together with the Allemanian confederation. While the Franks have finally broke through the Rhine border.
About 50 years later the Franks dominate the north Gaulish areas while the Allemanian Confederation has pushed to the Po valley. This was stopped by the Slavic invasions. The Slavic invasions. The Slavs who travelled through several routes to Italy and the Balkans one was through Frankish territory in Germania through some alpine passes (defeating some smaller German tribes in the process) or through the Dacian route into Sarmatian or Visigothian territory. Eventually the slavs push out the lombards from Northern Italy and Illyria (The Lombards arrived earlier) the Lombards who remained pretty intact after the slower invasion of northern Italy by the Slavs then moved into southern Italy. Greatly damaging Western Roman power in the region. Their influence was even further damaged by the Epiros invasion of Italy. In the same year of that invasion the Lombards sacked Rome and the Epirians occupied Tarentum and captured a portion of the Imperial fleet .
In the mean time the Vandals who where a part of the Lombard kingdom until their defeat by the Slavs. The Vandals would sack the Mediterranean shipping for several decades to come.
List of states/nations/tribal alliancies/groups
- Kingdom of the French (Blue in Northern France)
- Kingdom of Burgundy (Light grey south of the Franks)
- Kingdom of the Angles (Grey in Bretagne)
- Kingdom of the Jutes (Light grey in Normandy)
- Kingdoms of the Saxons (Grey in Britain)
- Western Roman Empire (Red)
- Allemanii Federation (Greenish in Austria-Switzerland-South Germany)
- Kingdom of the Mediolanii (Grey in Northern Italy)
- Kingdom of the Lombards (Purple in Italy)
- Preafacturate of Epiros (Yellow)
- Regnum Romanoi (Purple in Greece)
- Kingdom of the Visigoths (Green in Thrace)
- Slavic tribes of Illyria (Grey in the Balkans)
- Sarmatians (Pinkish in Hungary)
- Regnum Dacia-Romanum (Brown in Romania)
- West Slavic tribes (Grey in Poland)
- Kingdom of the Ostrogoths ( lighter green in North Anatolia)
- White Hunnic Federation (Gold in Western Anatolia)
- Kingdom of Armenia & the Romans (Pink-Purple in Southern Anatolia)
- Patriarchate of Jerusalem (Grey in Palestine)
- Emirate of the Lakhmids (Grey in the Sinai)
- Patriarchate of Alexandria (Orange in Egypt)
- Kingom of the Lower Huns (Caucasus)
- Kingdom of the Upper Huns (Mesopotamia)
- Empire of Persia (dark purple)
The pod is that the Huns do not invade Europe but Persia together with their White hunnic brethern. They largely destroy the Eastern Roman and Persian Empires. They establish an empire that stretches from Anatolia to Mesopotamia and from Armenia to Egypt.
Then the Goths and other tribes arrive in Greece driven there by nomadic tribes like the Sarmatians, Alans and the like. The Sarmatians establish dominance over the Alans and other tribes and conquer large parts of the Pannonian plaines. Meanwhile the Goths have been sacking Greece until the court of the ERE in Constantinople asks them to fight the Huns in Anatolia. The Huns by this time are fragmenting into several smaller kingdoms. This seems a good chance for the ERE to regain land in Asia.
However the Goths decide to take most of the land they take from the Huns for themselves. The ERE reacts furious and decides to destroy the Goths. With no real threat at their other borders due to the Sarmatians being at war with the WRE over Illyria. The Roman forces that where assigned to defeat the Goths where destroyed in their first battle. This greatly weakened the power of the ERE which now started to truly collapse under the weight the losses of Anatolia, Egypt and Syria plus the destruction of their remaining forces brought.
Now with a part of the goths crossing over to the other side of the sea of Marmara the city of Constantinople was being surrounded by all sides. The only reasons that the Goths couldnt take the city was because of the strong naval presence the ERE had in the Aegean and Black seas and its large walls.
At the point that the WRE and the ERE are having little to no control over the provinces of Illyria and Epiros several of its cities revolt. In Epiros a new emperor is declared who quikly uses the confusion and weakness of the Empires to consolidate a large region in Greece and Epiros for himselve. At this point the Goths have split into two tribes the Ostro and Visi Goths. The Visi Goths live in Thrace and Macedonia with the city of Thessalonica as capital of their region. And the Ostro goths who control the Pontus (North Anatolia) region. They are fighting with the Huns over Cappadocia.
The Hunnic Empire which now is at the verge of collapse with invaders in the west and the new born Sassanid Dynasty which is attacking them in the East they are facing collapse. This happens in the year that the Armenian revolt takes place. The Armenians where deported to Cilicia as soldiers and captives. The huns moved large parts of the old vassal of the ERE, Armenia to this region. The Armenians who liked the natives of Cillicia which where also Orthodox christians had reached popular support took arms and defeated the Hunnic forces counter attacking them.
In the West the WRE is doing much better. Now they have only lost Illyria to barbarian invaders but pressure is growing at their borders. German tribes are pushing their northern and western borders while Saxons (yes those are german to) are attacking the British islands. After several years of peace while the Hunnic and Eastern Roman empires are collapsing they are now starting to have troubles to. Lombards are attacking the Alpine provinces together with the Allemanian confederation. While the Franks have finally broke through the Rhine border.
About 50 years later the Franks dominate the north Gaulish areas while the Allemanian Confederation has pushed to the Po valley. This was stopped by the Slavic invasions. The Slavic invasions. The Slavs who travelled through several routes to Italy and the Balkans one was through Frankish territory in Germania through some alpine passes (defeating some smaller German tribes in the process) or through the Dacian route into Sarmatian or Visigothian territory. Eventually the slavs push out the lombards from Northern Italy and Illyria (The Lombards arrived earlier) the Lombards who remained pretty intact after the slower invasion of northern Italy by the Slavs then moved into southern Italy. Greatly damaging Western Roman power in the region. Their influence was even further damaged by the Epiros invasion of Italy. In the same year of that invasion the Lombards sacked Rome and the Epirians occupied Tarentum and captured a portion of the Imperial fleet .
In the mean time the Vandals who where a part of the Lombard kingdom until their defeat by the Slavs. The Vandals would sack the Mediterranean shipping for several decades to come.
List of states/nations/tribal alliancies/groups
- Kingdom of the French (Blue in Northern France)
- Kingdom of Burgundy (Light grey south of the Franks)
- Kingdom of the Angles (Grey in Bretagne)
- Kingdom of the Jutes (Light grey in Normandy)
- Kingdoms of the Saxons (Grey in Britain)
- Western Roman Empire (Red)
- Allemanii Federation (Greenish in Austria-Switzerland-South Germany)
- Kingdom of the Mediolanii (Grey in Northern Italy)
- Kingdom of the Lombards (Purple in Italy)
- Preafacturate of Epiros (Yellow)
- Regnum Romanoi (Purple in Greece)
- Kingdom of the Visigoths (Green in Thrace)
- Slavic tribes of Illyria (Grey in the Balkans)
- Sarmatians (Pinkish in Hungary)
- Regnum Dacia-Romanum (Brown in Romania)
- West Slavic tribes (Grey in Poland)
- Kingdom of the Ostrogoths ( lighter green in North Anatolia)
- White Hunnic Federation (Gold in Western Anatolia)
- Kingdom of Armenia & the Romans (Pink-Purple in Southern Anatolia)
- Patriarchate of Jerusalem (Grey in Palestine)
- Emirate of the Lakhmids (Grey in the Sinai)
- Patriarchate of Alexandria (Orange in Egypt)
- Kingom of the Lower Huns (Caucasus)
- Kingdom of the Upper Huns (Mesopotamia)
- Empire of Persia (dark purple)
Invasion of Japan in 45 after the failure of the Manhatten Program? Don't See many of them too often
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