Naaah, It's the benefits of not being Ruled by Mao Zedong and her gang of bad guys Early on if PRC had been ruled by good people from the beginning, it could have been really good but in the end that's my personal point.
沒有國民黨就沒有中國, Without the Kuomintang there would be no China, A Republic of China Story
- Thread starter CELTICEMPIRE
- Start date
So long as it practiced a fully communist system, China was doomed to not reach its full potential. Notably their economic growth only began when they opened up to the global market, implemented state capitalism and called it ‘socialism with Chinese characteristics’
六十, Kennedy's successor
John F. Kennedy’s presidency was coming to an end. He was, overall, a successful president. He broke the Curse of Tecumseh [1]. And he was generally well-liked. Most of his domestic agenda had been codified into law. His goal of putting a man on the moon was not realized, but the Soviets weren’t any closer to accomplishing that either. In foreign policy, he was considered successful. America became more active in combatting Communism abroad, but few boots were put on the ground. Thus, he could say that he successfully contained Communism (at least in Latin America and East Asia) and kept America out of war. As he was ineligible to run again in 1968, the question of who would be his successor became more and more important.
In the Democratic primary, the two main candidates would be Vice President Lyndon Johnson of Texas Senator, Alabama Governor George Wallace, and Hubert Humphrey of Minnesota. In a surprising upset, Humphrey emerged victorious. He would be the nominee for president and Representative Wilbur Mills of Arkansas was the nominee for Vice President. The main Republican candidates were Senator Barry Goldwater of Arizona, Pennsylvania Governor William Scranton, and New York Governor Nelson Rockefeller. Barry Goldwater was the nominee for president and Maryland Governor Spiro Agnew was the nominee for vice president. In addition, George Wallace ran a populist and segregationist campaign as an independent. His running mate was Governor Lester Maddox of Georgia.
(Hubert Humphrey)
Humphrey was an outspoken supporter of civil rights. That gained him votes with some and lost him other votes to Goldwater or Wallace. Goldwater had a mixed record on civil rights, supporting some bills and opposing others, while Wallace was a staunch segregationist. Both men being on the ballot helped Humphrey win several Southern states. In the end, he won in a landslide, with 53% of the popular vote and 443 electoral votes (Goldwater and Wallace won 41% and 5% of the popular vote, and 68 and 27 electoral votes respectively). Hubert Humphrey would continue the policies of John F. Kennedy, and seek to expand them. He would be a much less successful president than JFK, however, and Democrat majorities would be much smaller than they were during Kennedy’s presidency. Most of his pushes for more progressive policies failed. He did have one major success though.
The Space Race was ongoing from the late 1950s to the early 1970s. Though Britain, France, China, and several other countries would all launch objects into space during this time, the real competition was between the United States and the Soviet Union. Both countries were launching multiple objects into space every year. Before long, animals were being sent into space. People were going into space not long after that. The Soviets put the first man into orbit, and America followed. For a while, it looked like the Soviet Union would win the Space Race. But Humphrey was determined to have the final victory. In June of 1972, America successfully put a man on the moon, with James Lovell Jr. having the honor of being the first man on the moon. This allowed America to declare victory in the space race.
(America won the Space Race)
While the Space Race victory boosted Humphrey’s popularity, he was having problems back on earth. Wilbur Mills’ scandals caused him to be dumped off the ticket, and replaced by Senator Al Gore Sr. of Tennessee. Fatigue after 12 years of Democrat rule was helping Republicans. In the GOP primaries, House Minority Leader Gerald Ford of Michigan defeated Spiro Agnew, Senator James Buckley of New York, and Representative George H. W. Bush of Texas. Nevada Governor Paul Laxalt would be his running mate. The polls showed Ford with a narrow advantage during the summer. However, gas prices skyrocketed in September because of an oil embargo from several Middle Eastern countries. Ford won in a landslide and Humphrey was a one-term president. The popular vote was 53-47% and the electoral vote was 357-181.
(Gerald Ford)
1: The idea of The Curse of Tecumseh comes from every president OTL elected each 20 years from 1840 to 1960 died in office.
In the Democratic primary, the two main candidates would be Vice President Lyndon Johnson of Texas Senator, Alabama Governor George Wallace, and Hubert Humphrey of Minnesota. In a surprising upset, Humphrey emerged victorious. He would be the nominee for president and Representative Wilbur Mills of Arkansas was the nominee for Vice President. The main Republican candidates were Senator Barry Goldwater of Arizona, Pennsylvania Governor William Scranton, and New York Governor Nelson Rockefeller. Barry Goldwater was the nominee for president and Maryland Governor Spiro Agnew was the nominee for vice president. In addition, George Wallace ran a populist and segregationist campaign as an independent. His running mate was Governor Lester Maddox of Georgia.
(Hubert Humphrey)
Humphrey was an outspoken supporter of civil rights. That gained him votes with some and lost him other votes to Goldwater or Wallace. Goldwater had a mixed record on civil rights, supporting some bills and opposing others, while Wallace was a staunch segregationist. Both men being on the ballot helped Humphrey win several Southern states. In the end, he won in a landslide, with 53% of the popular vote and 443 electoral votes (Goldwater and Wallace won 41% and 5% of the popular vote, and 68 and 27 electoral votes respectively). Hubert Humphrey would continue the policies of John F. Kennedy, and seek to expand them. He would be a much less successful president than JFK, however, and Democrat majorities would be much smaller than they were during Kennedy’s presidency. Most of his pushes for more progressive policies failed. He did have one major success though.
The Space Race was ongoing from the late 1950s to the early 1970s. Though Britain, France, China, and several other countries would all launch objects into space during this time, the real competition was between the United States and the Soviet Union. Both countries were launching multiple objects into space every year. Before long, animals were being sent into space. People were going into space not long after that. The Soviets put the first man into orbit, and America followed. For a while, it looked like the Soviet Union would win the Space Race. But Humphrey was determined to have the final victory. In June of 1972, America successfully put a man on the moon, with James Lovell Jr. having the honor of being the first man on the moon. This allowed America to declare victory in the space race.
(America won the Space Race)
While the Space Race victory boosted Humphrey’s popularity, he was having problems back on earth. Wilbur Mills’ scandals caused him to be dumped off the ticket, and replaced by Senator Al Gore Sr. of Tennessee. Fatigue after 12 years of Democrat rule was helping Republicans. In the GOP primaries, House Minority Leader Gerald Ford of Michigan defeated Spiro Agnew, Senator James Buckley of New York, and Representative George H. W. Bush of Texas. Nevada Governor Paul Laxalt would be his running mate. The polls showed Ford with a narrow advantage during the summer. However, gas prices skyrocketed in September because of an oil embargo from several Middle Eastern countries. Ford won in a landslide and Humphrey was a one-term president. The popular vote was 53-47% and the electoral vote was 357-181.
(Gerald Ford)
1: The idea of The Curse of Tecumseh comes from every president OTL elected each 20 years from 1840 to 1960 died in office.
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So who ended up the first man on the moon ITTL? Because with it happening three years later than OTL, I have to figure it was a different crew.
Maybe it was the group from Apollo 13 who didn’t get to touch down IOTL?
Quite a bit. And since there are a lot of Communist insurgents active around there, there's a huge military presence there.
The Chinese Navy is strong compared to that of most countries, but would easily lose to the US or Britain.
Pretty good.
James Lovell Jr. was the first man on the moon TTL (and I think that makes him the sixth living person to be mentioned once I edit him into the TL). The other living people are the Dalai Lama, Queen Elizabeth, Liu Chia-ching, Huang Hua, and maybe a fifth person whose name I forgot as well).
Maybe, and it depends on what you mean. The main opposition to the KMT will come from parties that adopt some form of Chinese Nationalism. As of 1972, there's still a supposed state of emergency that justifies the lack of full democracy and the existence of only two opposition parties (ones that collaborate with the KMT). That's a temporary situation though. On the other hand, advocacy of any sort of separatism (be it for Tibet, Xinjiang, or Taiwan) is considered an "anti-China" activity and is liable to get put in prison for a few years. There will be a lot of opposition to allowing separatist parties to participate in government.
六十一, Behind the Scenes
-Walter P. McConaughy, 1973, shortly before being succeeded by Walter Judd as US ambassador to China
Chiang Kai-shek had won a fifth and final term. But the Chiang Kai-shek of 1972 and beyond was different from the Chiang Kai-shek who led China against Japan and the Communists. He was getting old, and he would celebrate his 85th birthday later that year. The death of his friend and former Vice President Sun Fo in 1973 must have been an unpleasant reminder of his own mortality. He would spend much less time doing his governmental duties than in the past (though this had been the case since 1970). His few public appearances after the Shanghai Olympics were mostly confined the occasional military parade. This led many to suspect, with good reason, that Ching Kai-shek wasn’t really the one running the government anymore.
(Sun Fo, 1891-1973)
There were many people with influence in the government, but the two most powerful men in China were Vice President Chen Lifu and Premier Chiang Ching-kuo. In general, Chen Lifu worked on domestic policy while Chiang Ching-kuo worked on foreign policy. Knowledge of this state of affairs didn’t stay within the Presidential Palace in Nanking for long. A newspaper in Tianjin was shut down after running a story calling Chen Lifu the true leader of China. In the Soviet Union, Chen considered to be the man calling the shots in China. The Soviets absolutely hated Chen Lifu, and he hated them too. A double agent in Moscow informed Chen Lifu that there was a potential assassination plot against him by the KGB.
(Chen Lifu)
Chen Lifu was politically similar to Chiang Kai-shek, or if anything, more extreme. He was more hardline in his stance against Communism. He also wanted to go further in tackling corruption. Chen Lifu’s support of Chiang helped blunt right-wing opposition to the government’s policies, especially land reform. In addition to his political views, he was also a strong proponent of Confucianism and traditional Chinese medicine. He had enemies within the Kuomintang, at all levels of government, and particularly in Jiangsu province. There were many in the party who believed that Chiang had made a terrible lapse in judgment. Nevertheless, Chen was popular with Chiang’s entire family. The Kuomintang, along with China, was stuck with him at least until 1978.
(In the red provinces, a majority of National Assembly delegates voted against Chen Lifu)
Chiang Ching-kuo was more popular all around, with few in the party actually hating him. That didn’t mean that there weren’t those in the KMT who opposed a potential 1978 Chiang Ching-kuo presidential bid. There were a lot of people, including people with power, who didn’t want to see China become the “Chiang Dynasty.” Nevertheless, Chiang worked to promote his allies and demote his rivals from 1972-1978. Chen Lifu was happy to help him, as most of Chiang’s enemies were also his enemies. Chen had a good relationship with the secret police, so it was easy to find dirt on his political opponents. The two men were on good terms, though Chiang had some lingering suspicions that if his father died before his term ended, Chen would not step aside in favor of him in 1978.
Chiang Ching-kuo made many international trips in the years following 1972. Even before 1972, Chiang Kai-shek had stopped travelling internationally. In 1971, Ching-kuo attended the 2,500-year celebration of the Persian Empire, hosted by Shah Mohammad Reza Pahlavi. Iran was a Chinese ally, and was increasingly beset by the Soviet Union or its allies on multiple fronts. In 1973, Chiang visited America, where he was pleased to see the return of the Republican Party to power, hoping that Gerald Ford would be another William Knowland. He would make several visits to Africa, visiting the Central African Republic, Ethiopia, and Kenya in 1973. Later, he would meet Portuguese leaders in Macao for a discussion of the return of the city to China.
Considering Portugal IOTL wanted to give it back after the Carnation Revolution, I wouldn't be surprised if it becomes Chinese 25 years ahead of OTL.
A Chen Lifu presidency looks like it would further entrench the KMT's dictatorial credentials, considering he is perhaps even more hardline than Chiang. He is also quite old. I can imagine resistance against KMT repressiveness grows into something of a political revolution in the 80's, railing against the gerontocracy, and harming China's stability. A Chiang Ching Kuo presidency, though reeking of dynasticism, would probably work out much better for China seen as though he was so open to democratic reform IOTL. Although being better for China in the long run doesn't make him more likely to actually win the leadership contest..
Also it would be pretty funny
With the democratization of China being called "The Chiang Dynasty" even if Ching Kuo's successor ends up being completely unrelated to him
Like imagine being a chinese student reading a history book and you see one of the last chapters being called that and you think "Great, another dynasty" but its actually about China going democratic
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