The A11 (Vickers Infantry tank) has whats being called the 6/18pdr. That's a 6pdr gun 'throated out' to take the 18pdr shell, with a bit lower MV. It means they have HE, smoke, and other shells available, all they had to do was make a fixed cartridge case. It does have an AT shell, its a bit better than that on the Pz IV L/24 gun. They are really pretty similar tanks for similar roles, except the British A11 has much thicker armourThe tanks sound darn good, but I'm always struggling to remember what ones are what due to the lack of namesThe numbers always throw me and I curse the pre-war British army for not giving their vehicles names!
If they as was said
If that's true that's still a mark up from what they had at the start of the war, the A11 ITTL is armed with what? I've kinda lost track and not sure whats changed with what. If that's got a HE lobber and is an infantry support tank as per the Panzer IV's original design but better then again, that's a marked step up and a larger vehicle capable of growing into something else in the future.
I see that welding is being used rather than riviting and this is a good thing and the Liberty may well be on its way out. With a better tank armed with a 47mm gun that can hopefully fire a small HE shell the UK will have better tanks, better doctrine and training. But the problem's numbers, the UK's armoured brigades are going to be outnumbered by the Panzers and they've been doing the same kind of thinking, not as motorised for sure but still. the big changer is the APC's though, that could be very useful and will be very popular with the troops too.
The Forge of Weyland
- Thread starter Astrodragon
- Start date
The RTC's tanks are going to lose the camo paint and be polished.
They you can go 'oooh, SHINY' and look at them
The A11 runs from London to Norwich so they could name it the Norwich.
And upgunned Mk VI's in the Far East would be very useful.They did upgrade some MkVi's in Egypt with the 1 1/2pdr COW gun, but the MkVI is seen as obsolete, they aren't planning to build more. Well, probably
Initially the Italians get to play with the Nuffield A13 , which still looks like a Centurion to the Italian tankettes...
British tank details
OK here's a data sheet on the current British tanks. Named after weapons, except the Matilda (as its basically the same tank, it would have been confusing to rename it).
Two are basically very similar to OTL, the other 2 should have been straightforward to build. Ironically the two Vickers designs are very close to the Pz III(with the 5cm gun and thicker armour of Autumn 1940) and the Pz IV (with the thicker armour of late 1940), both of which could easily have been produced in 1939.
British Tanks, comparison with OTL tanks
Vickers A10* (Sabre) Mk3
HV3pdr gun, 50mm frontal armour, 35mm sides. 360hp diesel engine, speed about 20mph/28mph(road). Modified 3-wheel 'slow motion' Horstman suspension. About 20 tons.
In British terms its similar to the Crusader tank Crusader tank - Wikipedia. Its also similar to PzIII Ausf.H Panzer III - Wikipedia
Vickers A11 - (Cutlass) Mk 2
6/18pdr gun, 70mm frontal armour, 60mm sides, 360hp diesel engine, speed about 14mph/23mph(road). Horstman suspension.Weight about 25 tons
No real OTL British equivalent, operationally is a faster Matilda with a bit less armour. The closest OTL tank is the PZ IV Ausf.F1 or Ausf.E Panzer IV - Wikipedia
Vulcan A12 (Matilda) Mk 1
HV3pdr gun, 78mm frontal armour, 70mm sides, 190hp (twinned engine), speed about 9mph/16mph(road). OTL suspension. Weight about 26 tons
Basically this is the OTL Matilda II with a 3pdr gun. Matilda II - Wikipedia
Nuffield A13 (Scimitar) Mk 2
HV3pdr gun, 30mm frontal armour, 15mm sides, 320hp petrol engine (Liberty), speed about 24mph/30mph. VVSS Horstman suspension.
Most similar OTL tank is the Cruiser Mk IV Cruiser Mk IV - Wikipedia the differences are the HV3pdr gun and the different suspension system. Has the same wonderful *cough* Nuffield Liberty engine. About 16 tons
Guns.
The HV3pdr is an enlarged 2pdr. Something similar to 4,7cm KPÚV vz. 38 - Wikipedia or 47 mm APX anti-tank gun - Wikipedia. As it can use the older 3pdr ammunition (at a lower MV), it does have an HE shell, even though it's not brilliant
The 6/18pdr is based on a Vickers 6pdr naval gun, lightened a bit then 'throated out' to handle the 18pdr shell. It has an AT round, but this isnt as powerful as the 18pdr artillery one, but its still good by 1939 standards
The Kiwi engine is a diesel based on the RR kestrel, a simplified version of one built for a racing car.
The Sabre Mk3 comes in Autumn 1939 (the Mark 1 finishes production Summer 1939)
The Cutlas Mk2 comes in Spring 1939
The Matilda starts arriving in Summer 1939 (in small numbers, production issues as OTL)
Scimitar Mk2 starts arriving in Spring 1939
Two are basically very similar to OTL, the other 2 should have been straightforward to build. Ironically the two Vickers designs are very close to the Pz III(with the 5cm gun and thicker armour of Autumn 1940) and the Pz IV (with the thicker armour of late 1940), both of which could easily have been produced in 1939.
British Tanks, comparison with OTL tanks
Vickers A10* (Sabre) Mk3
HV3pdr gun, 50mm frontal armour, 35mm sides. 360hp diesel engine, speed about 20mph/28mph(road). Modified 3-wheel 'slow motion' Horstman suspension. About 20 tons.
In British terms its similar to the Crusader tank Crusader tank - Wikipedia. Its also similar to PzIII Ausf.H Panzer III - Wikipedia
Vickers A11 - (Cutlass) Mk 2
6/18pdr gun, 70mm frontal armour, 60mm sides, 360hp diesel engine, speed about 14mph/23mph(road). Horstman suspension.Weight about 25 tons
No real OTL British equivalent, operationally is a faster Matilda with a bit less armour. The closest OTL tank is the PZ IV Ausf.F1 or Ausf.E Panzer IV - Wikipedia
Vulcan A12 (Matilda) Mk 1
HV3pdr gun, 78mm frontal armour, 70mm sides, 190hp (twinned engine), speed about 9mph/16mph(road). OTL suspension. Weight about 26 tons
Basically this is the OTL Matilda II with a 3pdr gun. Matilda II - Wikipedia
Nuffield A13 (Scimitar) Mk 2
HV3pdr gun, 30mm frontal armour, 15mm sides, 320hp petrol engine (Liberty), speed about 24mph/30mph. VVSS Horstman suspension.
Most similar OTL tank is the Cruiser Mk IV Cruiser Mk IV - Wikipedia the differences are the HV3pdr gun and the different suspension system. Has the same wonderful *cough* Nuffield Liberty engine. About 16 tons
Guns.
The HV3pdr is an enlarged 2pdr. Something similar to 4,7cm KPÚV vz. 38 - Wikipedia or 47 mm APX anti-tank gun - Wikipedia. As it can use the older 3pdr ammunition (at a lower MV), it does have an HE shell, even though it's not brilliant
The 6/18pdr is based on a Vickers 6pdr naval gun, lightened a bit then 'throated out' to handle the 18pdr shell. It has an AT round, but this isnt as powerful as the 18pdr artillery one, but its still good by 1939 standards
The Kiwi engine is a diesel based on the RR kestrel, a simplified version of one built for a racing car.
The Sabre Mk3 comes in Autumn 1939 (the Mark 1 finishes production Summer 1939)
The Cutlas Mk2 comes in Spring 1939
The Matilda starts arriving in Summer 1939 (in small numbers, production issues as OTL)
Scimitar Mk2 starts arriving in Spring 1939
Commanded by Major Bloodnock, with privates Eccles and Seagoon.
Classic use of reuse/recycle! Those extra radios will make coordinating the carriers much easier.
You know, I'd never thought of it before but naming the A-series tanks after towns-on-A-series roads is kind of brilliant. Astrodragon's already canonized naming tanks after swords though, but maybe a good idea for support vehicles perhaps. Bring on the Berrick! Come forth, the Darlington!
Deleted member 94680
Unlike the Germans with their IIs, IIIs and IVs or the Russians with their BT-7s, T-34s and KV-1s?The tanks sound darn good, but I'm always struggling to remember what ones are what due to the lack of names
The Americans aren't exactly guiltless either. At least the British didn't use the same number for different pieces of equipment. How many different M3's were there? How Many M1's?