What does Sicily think about the Triunes? Would they try to get Rhomania to help their friends? Any independent Sicilian intervention would end up backfiring especially if it drags the war into Eastern territories (i.e., Sicilian support gives the Triunes a casus belli to attack Island Asia or Indian territories). Personally, any intervention (outside any piracy) into Europe on behalf of Despotate needs to come with strings attached, or it comes with a tightening or integration on such an upstart despotate for a clear violation of Rhomania's foreign policy.
An Age of Miracles Continues: The Empire of Rhomania
- Thread starter Basileus444
- Start date
The Triune conquest of the Rhine kind of parallels a potential Roman conquest of Mesopotamia. A massive economic gain, but will require an incredible amount of military resources to hold, and they better hope they've broken the foe east of it otherwise they'll be back in a few decades.
French, sorry Triune logistics are far better in holding a Rhine border...
I reckon that good chunks of Arles will be eaten by the Triune but a surviving rump state will remain the provence region. Transalpina anyone?
B444, can we get a rating scale once the dust settles to see what level the countries are at after the war? A lot has happen and the power balance has shifted drastically.
here's my proposed flag for a united Russia for once the gathering of the Rus happens, for the naval flag at least. Although I assume naval flags becoming a main depiction of national identity won't be a thing for a while now.
I modified the old Russian imperial flag from the 1600's with the old Romanov flag colors from otl to make it. I like the concept of a cross in the middle divided by four quadrants becoming this tl's tricolor flag due to the Romans and Triunes flags having the similar designs
Also I apologize for not having my world map done by Christmas, I wish I had an excuse other than rage quitting because doing the regions of Ethiopia was too hard. Hopefully I can get over my laziness by Orthodox Christmas and complete my goal by technicality.
I modified the old Russian imperial flag from the 1600's with the old Romanov flag colors from otl to make it. I like the concept of a cross in the middle divided by four quadrants becoming this tl's tricolor flag due to the Romans and Triunes flags having the similar designs
Also I apologize for not having my world map done by Christmas, I wish I had an excuse other than rage quitting because doing the regions of Ethiopia was too hard. Hopefully I can get over my laziness by Orthodox Christmas and complete my goal by technicality.
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Agreed (it took me a while to get the "french comma" ). The only real chance for any german invasion force is during or right after the civil War. Even a stabilized independent "France" would be a very tough nut to crack if it keeps that border.
Would be interesting to see how a German national identity develops in relations to these "lost territories" (I guess Aachen and Mainz are a "must" to get back, the first in connection with Charlesmagne and the HRE and the second is/was the seat of Catholic Papacy in "Germany", if I'm not mistaken).
This is an incredible piece of writing, I was here from the beginning and I remember how almost harmless some of the speculations were on logistics, administration and the mechanics of a roman state which must survive. Now I'm reading something with such depth and complexity that really touches me, makes me feel solidarity and anger as well as pity and sympathy for all sides in a conflict. The competing narratives between all different factions tightly coupled with their love and hate and how they resolve their own identity is just very complex and rich. That even the coldest application of geopolitics seems like an expression of all that raw humanness and pain is wonderful to read, even the horrifying and monstrous things people are saying for revenge shows how much people have become attached to the plight of this fictional Rome and how it blinds them like their fictional counterparts. It must of been exhausting making some of these more recent posts and you have my thanks and a brain which will not forgot this story till it dies.
Doubtful. At least for a long time; I think that national identities have yet to emerge (although probably the war against the Triunes may give rise to a German identity, coupled with the hatred for the "evil" romans) and to boot attacking Hungary is a bad idea, given the defensive alliance they're in (Rhomania, plus Vlachia, Serbia).
They still might try though. However they still need to recover their western front back and help Lotharginians recover their core lands. Once that's done they may try their luck once again, but given that the Romans are quiet on western europe for a forseable future, I doubt a war will occur. And their not gonna allow Hungary to lose it once again despite the withdrawal of Roman troops on Vienna.
I think that might be the unexpected masterstroke - or disaster, with the Hungarian Strategy. If the Germans pressure them they might be hostile, creating an ugly gap in that otherwise strong frontier. If the Romans win out the Hungarians are the first bastion of their defence.
But from a Hungarian perspective, there is value in being the bridge for both. The Germans and Romans probably have good reasons to trade, but German attitudes would make that undesirable for them - but Hungarian Middlemen? They could do very well. Not only that but it does open the door to the Hungarians developing a reputation as a central diplomatic player, reconciling Polish, German, and Roman-Sphere frontiers. The only player that is Catholic, but in the Roman world too? Very useful. I wouldn't be surprised to see some Hungarian members of the Roman diplomatic corps in the future, simply for their experience and ability to open some doors. The key is whether Hungary can essentially hide their ownership of Austria under the "Rawr, Romans" shadow. Having someone bigger to be angry at can be useful for hiding your own offences, but it could scupper any attempts to be a Bridge for Europe.
One of the big changes for Germany is that the Danube is now peaceful and navigable to the front. If the Hungarians and Romans get drawn into a war, the distance from Constantinople to Vienna is shorter than it appears on a map, and if fortified appropriately, a lot shorter than the reverse would be.
Interesting proposition but I think there's just one big problem with that, it's that Hungary backstabbed the Germans. So being a middleman for both sides is not possible, they need to choose one side only, they've already choosen the Romans. The Germans will always be a threat on their frontier especially since those lands on Austria do contain some Germans (They can use it as casus belli if they took a revanchist approach).
They lost lands down south and west right (During the Roman-Hungarian War on Demetrios II reign)? Good thing I might add, if they didn't lose those lands, then this current treaty of bucharest would either have been impossible or downright hard to achieve without a measure of hard diplomacy and giving other form of concessions.
It will take a decade atleast for Hungary to be trusted by their northern "neighbours", meanwhile the balkan region is swimming with money. Enough money to clout the Hungarian doubts of the treaty and the ever watchful eyes of Rhomania. Hey, money talks. You can't argue with that. (Well the Hungarians wouldn't be stupid to break their treaty with Rome, Serbia, and Vlachia, their lands are really easy to invade in the Hungarian plains, the only good defense they have now is the Austrian region)
On a lighter note, I saw some posts about what sort of dinosaurs Odysseus would be obsessed with, and I saw Spinosaurus being an option. I tend to agree on this assessment since Egypt is probably the most common source for fossils. However, I would like to add one more dinosaur that he could be a fan of: Carcharodontosaurus.
I mean come on, it's a huge freaking theropod that would be the T-Rex of Rhomania if it was popular enough with Roman paleontologists (perhaps due to Odysseus?). Honestly, I think Spinosaurus and Carcharodontosaurus could be played as the biblical Leviathan and Behemoth in modern dino media if the Romans correctly assessed Spinosaurus as the aquatic-loving creature that it is early.
The dinosaur bit was originally supposed to just be some silliness that explained having them in A New and Ancient World, a rationale that became defunct when that died.
At the time I didn’t realize that T-Rex and Triceratops were indigenous to North America, and mainly the Great Plains and American West area, which makes it hard to explain how fossils of them got all the way to Constantinople. So OTL Carcharodontosaurus may be TTL Tyrannosaur to resolve that issue. Doesn’t explain Triceratops but that I’m willing to just handwave because, damnit, I think I’ve earned the right to handwave a few things.
Thank you very much for your kind words. I really appreciate them right now. And yes, it has been exhausting.
Just going to touch very briefly on geopolitics, because honestly I’m rather burned out and tired of talking about it and its implications and ramifications. I don’t have any plans for any big wars between a revived HRE/Germany and the Romans, but that is because the Romans, for different reasons, disengaged from central Europe such as by selling back Salzburg. Further tension will likely come through following von Nimitz’s ‘Northern Fringe’ strategy. Focus on flipping Hungary. Back a Polish play to take back Vlach Galicia (such an eyesore on the map). Perhaps support a revolution in Vlachia aimed at overthrowing the Roman-allied landowners. So more like 18th century version of the Cold War (with potential hot fighting via proxies) than WW2.
Feels like the Germans this time around is yhe TTL version of the Soviet Union, wouldn't the Russians be extremely pissed if Poland starts coming east again?
Well those Triceratops fossils must have had a very long and arduous journey just to get to the Sideroi's collection. Considering the current relationship between the Empire of Mexico and the Roman Empire, then I think it's possible for Triceratops to realistically end up in Constantinople through budding Mexican or Roman paleontologists digging incomplete skeletons in New Mexico or Arizona, although it definitely would've cost them the big bucks. Luckily I think this happened before the crippling Roman depression so let's just leave it at that
Still, Odysseus the Magnificent is very unique even amongst his OTL historical counterparts because of his affinity towards dinosaurs, which is something that doesn't actually exist for Early Modern rulers since dinosaurs weren't discovered until the 1800s. Considering the larger than life character of Ody and his legacy being romanticized by Roman historians, I think they could play on this motif a LOT, since dinosaurs are simply awe-inspiring and terrifying to look at, so having a person be equated with something akin to a monster like Behemoth or Leviathan seems like what the Romans would do to Odysseus.
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Because the HRE is too weak after the Lotharingian invasion and the Great Latin War, I agree that they cannot commit a war with the Romans just yet. I don't think the HRE Emperor/Empress will even try for the next few decades, because taking back the Rhineland and Lotharingia from the Triunes seems more like a priority for the German court, despite the backlash from their own jingoist fanatics. Still, Vlachia is definitely something that the HRE will try to woo towards their side against the Romans through espionage and diplomacy, since the Vlachs despise the Romans for essentially forcing most of their countrymen into serfdom. A free Vlachia is not what Constantinople wants in the slightest, so I can definitely see a proxy war happen if a Vlachian revolution occurs, as the Romans will support a pro-Orthodox faction while the HRE and others could support an independent Vlachia that cuts ties with Romania.
While Vlachia has the potential to be an interesting region to look at for the future, the Triunes, Arles, and Russia are also places where we could see some immense changes happening to the continent. With all those changes happening while the Romans are withdrawing from European affairs, I can't help but think that Odysseus or his successors will be dragged back into the continent in some violent fashion, although that might not be the case. At the very least, having espionage and diplomacy becoming a more prominent part in 17th century politics in a Latin-Roman Cold War (mostly between the HRE and Romania) should make for an even more interesting time than it already has been.
Hungary I can see flipping, since they have bad blood with the Vlachs. Helping the Poles against Orthodox Vlachia though? That has a chance of triggering a Russian intervention. Poles and Hungarians would be crazy to do that without a very large amount of German insurance backing them up. The last time they did that the Emperor went crazy.
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Cryostorm
Monthly Donor
Big issue with a Vlachia going western aligned is that neither Rhomania nor a united Russia would be happy with a unfriendly neutral do close to their economic and agricultural heartlands. Best bet for a revolution would be for a Vlachian royal faction wanting to crush the nobles by allying with the peasants and getting Rhoman and Russian support.
The Romans wouldn't allow a Vlachian royal to overthrow the nobles at all, as they were the ones that brought Vlachia into this situation in the first place (i.e. serfdom) through their agreement with the nobility. Constantinople depends too much on Vlachian grain and their willingness to buy Roman goods for them to just suddenly end the current status quo. They would be the opposition for any reformist faction in my eyes.
If a Vlachian noble/king wanted to change the current situation in his country and end serfdom, he would have to align with the Latins, since their support would allow them to combat Roman and Russian interests. Of course, that is obviously a huge problem for Romania or Russia, one that will have to be dealt swiftly if Constantinople continues to benefit from the exploitation of the Vlachian people.