Labour will still win, but Blair doesn't have the leader's seat. He loses the contest to Prescott.
Revolution & Revanchism: A Rejection & Revenge sequel
- Thread starter wolverinethad
- Start date
Labour will still win, but Blair doesn't have the leader's seat. He loses the contest to Prescott.
Prescott wouldn't be the worst choice, he was a bolshie, combative git, but knew enough to get decent people around him.
And as far as the British Public as a whole are concerned, (unlike the generally more refined political opinions found on here), in a world essentially at war, a PM that can actually fight, is likely to win over the public and the tabloids.
Maybe ITTL, rather than just getting a decent punch in on the guy that egged him, it was an [enemy of the day] Muppet and Prescott laid him out for example? That would leave him pretty much untouchable.
So I'm gonna make a list of the ships the Russian Navy will look like but this
reading from a quote "In 1990, just before the fall of the Soviet Union, the Red Fleet was big, made up of over 600 ships spread out over dozens of different classes."
I will try to make a list of the ships the new Russia will keep or sell since OTL they kept the ships with maintenance of the former Red Fleet a total nightmare most of them ending up scrapped or retired as floating barracks.
I will start off with the many Submarines that the Red fleet use to have (this will take hours knowing the last time I done this)
This is expected of what the Russian navy will look like by the year 2000
I will go off NATO Reporting names to save confusion or the most used Western name these boats and ships went off by
Numbers of 1-6 or 0-3 mean's number of ships the Russian's might keep but I'm unsure if they have the money
SSBN
Borei-class: laid down late 90s
3-6 Typhoon-class: 6 of these biggest submarines built in the world were built before the fall of the USSR very expensive to Modernised these late 70s tech boats.
7 Delta IV-class: all 7 of these early 80s built submarines were retained by the Russian navy OTL however one caught fire from the shipyard it was docked at.
3-8 Delta III-class: Most of these boat's where station on the Pacific Ocean by the end of the USSR it is very possible that these boat's are sold to China out of the 13 built.
SSGN
9-11 Oscar II-class: Very capital quiet Submarine that construction on the last 3 submarines could be restarted with older boats of the class could be sold to China.
0-0 Charlie II-class: Could be sold to India or China early 70s era Submarine
SSN
1-3 Akula III-class: There is no NATO classification of this boat OTL but this submarine is more quiet then the best US submarine's at the time.
1-3 Akula II-class: More quieter then the Akula I and better sonar the Akula II is the first Soviet attack submarine at the 1990s to be more quieter than the Improved Los Angeles-class.
6-8 Improved Akula I-class: These submarines are much quieter than early Akula-class having SOCKS hydrodynamic sensors except one and better sonar original Akula
7 Akula I: The K-284 Akula herself came out in 1984 it caught Western intelligence agencies by surprise as they believe it would take 10 years for the Soviets to build such a boat.
0-1 Sierra III: Laid down in 1990 the fate of this submarine is undecided it is built with light and strong titanium hull that is expensive it might be saved by the Government.
2 Sierra II: The Sierra II class was specifically developed for search and destroy missions against US nuclear submarines. It has a smaller turning circle than any other modern submarine.
2 Sierra I: Like all Sierra's the titanium pressure hull the boat has enables the class to dive to greater depths and reduce the level of radiated noise. These boat's might be place in reserve.
0-1 Alfa-class: The K-123 in 1983 underwent a refit that took 9 years and OTL she was used for training and was officially decommissioned July 31, 1996 she could stay in service.
10-25 Victor III-class: Entered service in 1979 and built until 1991 class was continuously improved during construction and late production models have a superior acoustic performance.
SSK
22 Kilo-class: The Kilo was in 1980 the most silent submarine in the world with the improved Kilo-class being sold to other country's around the world OTL.
Aircraft Carriers
0-1 Ulyanovsk-class: The 85,000 tonne Aircraft Carrier was laid down in 1988 in Ukraine but construction was cancelled at 20% completion and Scrapping began on 4 February 1992 and was completed by the end of October 1992 (It take butterflys to save it at this rate and it looks bleak)
2 Kuznetsov-class: The ship was designed to use conventional aircraft in a STOBAR configuration. Built in Ukraine the second ship of the class was 68% completed when the USSR split the ship can be finish with Russia retaking Ukraine.
1-3 Kiev-class:The Baku subgroup of the class would be kept with the Kiev and Minsk either put in reserve or sold to China and would be used as Helicopter carriers unless the funding for the Yak-141 is restarted.
Battlecrusier
2-4 Kirov-class: The world biggest non-Aircraft carrier ships the Kirov need's to be repaired and funding to keep the other ships in service might not be available very advance 45'000 ton ships
Cruisers
3-4 Slava-class: One ship is located in Ukraine it could be put in service after Russia has retaken Ukraine
2-3 Kara-class: The ships would slowly be disposed of except one modified ship of the class.
0-1 Sverdlov-class: It might be kept but unlikely to be kept in service
(I'll finish Destroyers later in some point in time after spending 5 hours on this)
Year and a Half later and I haven't fixed it...
mention of the Russia not having the money to built as far as I thought is concerning but wolverinethad said it was only a bit of a reach so I think the Russian can build or sell or scrapped.Bit of a reach--but you'll have to wait to find out why.
reading from a quote "In 1990, just before the fall of the Soviet Union, the Red Fleet was big, made up of over 600 ships spread out over dozens of different classes."
I will try to make a list of the ships the new Russia will keep or sell since OTL they kept the ships with maintenance of the former Red Fleet a total nightmare most of them ending up scrapped or retired as floating barracks.
I will start off with the many Submarines that the Red fleet use to have (this will take hours knowing the last time I done this)
This is expected of what the Russian navy will look like by the year 2000
I will go off NATO Reporting names to save confusion or the most used Western name these boats and ships went off by
Numbers of 1-6 or 0-3 mean's number of ships the Russian's might keep but I'm unsure if they have the money
SSBN
Borei-class: laid down late 90s
3-6 Typhoon-class: 6 of these biggest submarines built in the world were built before the fall of the USSR very expensive to Modernised these late 70s tech boats.
7 Delta IV-class: all 7 of these early 80s built submarines were retained by the Russian navy OTL however one caught fire from the shipyard it was docked at.
3-8 Delta III-class: Most of these boat's where station on the Pacific Ocean by the end of the USSR it is very possible that these boat's are sold to China out of the 13 built.
SSGN
9-11 Oscar II-class: Very capital quiet Submarine that construction on the last 3 submarines could be restarted with older boats of the class could be sold to China.
0-0 Charlie II-class: Could be sold to India or China early 70s era Submarine
SSN
1-3 Akula III-class: There is no NATO classification of this boat OTL but this submarine is more quiet then the best US submarine's at the time.
1-3 Akula II-class: More quieter then the Akula I and better sonar the Akula II is the first Soviet attack submarine at the 1990s to be more quieter than the Improved Los Angeles-class.
6-8 Improved Akula I-class: These submarines are much quieter than early Akula-class having SOCKS hydrodynamic sensors except one and better sonar original Akula
7 Akula I: The K-284 Akula herself came out in 1984 it caught Western intelligence agencies by surprise as they believe it would take 10 years for the Soviets to build such a boat.
0-1 Sierra III: Laid down in 1990 the fate of this submarine is undecided it is built with light and strong titanium hull that is expensive it might be saved by the Government.
2 Sierra II: The Sierra II class was specifically developed for search and destroy missions against US nuclear submarines. It has a smaller turning circle than any other modern submarine.
2 Sierra I: Like all Sierra's the titanium pressure hull the boat has enables the class to dive to greater depths and reduce the level of radiated noise. These boat's might be place in reserve.
0-1 Alfa-class: The K-123 in 1983 underwent a refit that took 9 years and OTL she was used for training and was officially decommissioned July 31, 1996 she could stay in service.
10-25 Victor III-class: Entered service in 1979 and built until 1991 class was continuously improved during construction and late production models have a superior acoustic performance.
SSK
22 Kilo-class: The Kilo was in 1980 the most silent submarine in the world with the improved Kilo-class being sold to other country's around the world OTL.
Aircraft Carriers
0-1 Ulyanovsk-class: The 85,000 tonne Aircraft Carrier was laid down in 1988 in Ukraine but construction was cancelled at 20% completion and Scrapping began on 4 February 1992 and was completed by the end of October 1992 (It take butterflys to save it at this rate and it looks bleak)
2 Kuznetsov-class: The ship was designed to use conventional aircraft in a STOBAR configuration. Built in Ukraine the second ship of the class was 68% completed when the USSR split the ship can be finish with Russia retaking Ukraine.
1-3 Kiev-class:The Baku subgroup of the class would be kept with the Kiev and Minsk either put in reserve or sold to China and would be used as Helicopter carriers unless the funding for the Yak-141 is restarted.
Battlecrusier
2-4 Kirov-class: The world biggest non-Aircraft carrier ships the Kirov need's to be repaired and funding to keep the other ships in service might not be available very advance 45'000 ton ships
Cruisers
3-4 Slava-class: One ship is located in Ukraine it could be put in service after Russia has retaken Ukraine
2-3 Kara-class: The ships would slowly be disposed of except one modified ship of the class.
0-1 Sverdlov-class: It might be kept but unlikely to be kept in service
(I'll finish Destroyers later in some point in time after spending 5 hours on this)
Year and a Half later and I haven't fixed it...
Last edited:
It looks like a pretty good list. I'll keep this in mind when I get to that part.
Frank backed away from his comments last year, saying he was having some real bad times when he made them in 2011 and more or less apologized. He was living in L.A. at the time of the 2/11 attacks, but thankfully was not where that nuke happened, and Marvel HQ survived uptown, though the fallout issues led to those at work being quarantined in there for a little while.
Accurateworldwar
Banned
What happened to a certain billionaire businessman with his own namesake tower in New York? The one who in OTL is currently in the White House?
Well, I didn't talk about him in the first one because, well, I wrote that before he became the fly in our national ointment, and the nature of the NY bomb could make him dead or alive depending on which property he was at. I'll have to consider that.
Accurateworldwar
Banned
He'd be safe, though probably freaked the fuck out, if he's in New York as would be most likely. If he just so happens to have decided to go to Las Vegas, he's probably injured quite a bit.
He was working to buy this one around this time, hence the uncertainty:
Also, the fallout drifted over the eastern half of Midtown, and he has quite a few buildings there. He could easily have been caught in the 100 rad contour if he was in his car or something.
Accurateworldwar
Banned
Honestly, there's no way of knowing where Donald Trump was on February 11th, 1993, so I imagine you could use some creative license as the author to determine where he was on that specific day. Besides, there were already plenty of butterflies before the bombing, so it doesn't matter too much anyways.He was working to buy this one around this time, hence the uncertainty:40 Wall Street.
Also, the fallout drifted over the eastern half of Midtown, and he has quite a few buildings there. He could easily have been caught in the 100 rad contour if he was in his car or something.
I have a question that I never tackled: does anyone have any links or sources as to how a tunnel would be affected by the pressure wave of a nuke going off at ground level?
Bookmark1995
Banned
Well, I'm not an expert, but my guess is it would depend on how deep the tunnel is.
If it is close enough to the surface, it might collapse.
If not, there would be a lot of shaking.
Also, it turns out Monica Lewinsky had graduated high school when the bomb hit, so I'm gonna have to retcon her death to being at the Century City Mall. Book revisions and editing do tend to cause grief.
I got you, fam.
Destroyers:
1-3 Udaloy II-class: Anti-ship variant. One ship completed OTL; two more ships, one in Kaliningrad and one in St. Petersburg likely to be completed.
12 Udaloy I-class: Long-term core of destroyer force.
11-17 Sovremenny-class: Closest thing to a modern air-defense destroyer the Russians have. Begin slow retirement in 2000s.
1-4 Kashin-class: Modernized with KH-35 antiship missiles, modern sensors, and a helicopter landing pad in place of the aft 3" twin. Remainder discarded due to age and general obsolescence.
Further to Bookmark1995's comment, it should do quite well as the design is there to dissipate constant pressure. If the increase from the explosion isn't too great it should be fine.
I would be more concerned with the possibility of the tunnel working as a giant gun barrel and projecting fallout in a narrow but long and concentrated corridor.