WI battlecruiser HMS Tiger gets a refit and battles through WW 2?
- Thread starter Logan2879
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I don't know, it's certainly possible, but we don't really have anything to base it on, other than Repluse being paired with KGV and(I think?) Illustrious...
And a Repulse was told not to give chase with KGV after Bismarck sank Hood, so I expect the British would be even more cautious with Tiger,being an older, less powerful ship.
Repulse was low on fuel, she had been at see on a short run and was at the part where she had been scheduled to turn for port when the hunt for Bismark commenced.
Tiger would have been involved with the hunt but would probably have reinforced one of the existing groups rather than going after her on her own.
Tiger would have been involved with the hunt but would probably have reinforced one of the existing groups rather than going after her on her own.
I was never suggesting for her to go out on her own against Bismarck! That would be complete insanity! She would be blown to bits before her guns could even be brought to bear!
Yes this could happen I think and then Renown ?
How much money is saved by an early scrapping Of Iron duke and moth balling an R?
[Something which was I believe contemplated IOTL ,though that was as much to do with manning as anything else.]
And one other factor
British ship building capacity was savagely slashed indeed mutilated from say '31 onwards [yes I know we can argue over dates]
So what yard/firm/ town will you save, how does this effect British ship building ? [at all or hardly or somewhere in the middle.]
And if we do save Tiger and if money remains the same what is given up.
Lastly may I say how very much I am looking forward to a time line based on this discussion.
Regards
Hugh
Tiger needs more work then Repulse, ie boiler replacement be nice to replaced turbines as well but there is a depression, 28 knots find to deal with PB, twins not in sight at this time.
Swap heavier armoured turrets from an ID after they have elevation increase.
Deck armour increased belt should be ok.
Tigers 2 forward boiler rooms no longer needed so forward funnel can be removed no need to trunk it.
After Tiger I would rebuild Repulse and Renown, with Repulse receiving more work than historical. Hood to rebuild after Renown but cancelled due to war.
Using an R as training ship is not a great loss, removing a turret and a couple of boilers for 18 knots no big deal, once belt is slapped back on an 18 K R is good for convoy work.
I would remove X turret from all R's and QE's using these turrets to begin Vanguard class instead of KGV. R's and QE's get refitted instead of rebuilt, all have B turret elevation increased improved aa etc.
Money saved buy not rebuilding 3 QE's funds another Ark Royal and better aircraft for FAA.
Swap heavier armoured turrets from an ID after they have elevation increase.
Deck armour increased belt should be ok.
Tigers 2 forward boiler rooms no longer needed so forward funnel can be removed no need to trunk it.
After Tiger I would rebuild Repulse and Renown, with Repulse receiving more work than historical. Hood to rebuild after Renown but cancelled due to war.
Using an R as training ship is not a great loss, removing a turret and a couple of boilers for 18 knots no big deal, once belt is slapped back on an 18 K R is good for convoy work.
I would remove X turret from all R's and QE's using these turrets to begin Vanguard class instead of KGV. R's and QE's get refitted instead of rebuilt, all have B turret elevation increased improved aa etc.
Money saved buy not rebuilding 3 QE's funds another Ark Royal and better aircraft for FAA.
I have read that increasing the elevation while understandable from a tactical point of view sometimes has the draw back of increasing the loading/reloading time.
TBH I am not sure if this is a problem with Tigers gun/turret layout?
TBH I am not sure if this is a problem with Tigers gun/turret layout?
Admiral Beez
Banned
It would be interesting. Perhaps, like at River Plate where Graf Spee misidentified one of the RN's cruisers as a destroyer, Bismarck and Prinz Eugen would ignore Tiger (thinking her a cruiser), concentrating instead on Hood and PoW. Meanwhile, Tiger's 13.5" Greenboys (capable of penetrating 12.5" of armour, http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNBR_135-45_mk5.php) are smacking hard into Prinz Eugen.
It wouldn't be an impossible misidentification. For example, here's HMS London, 633 feet long.
And here's modernized Tiger, 704 feet long. Both are similarly sized, with fore/aft tripods, twin funnels, and both with "Queen Anne's Mansion" type bridge structures.
http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll118/kiyone4ever/TigerRebuild.png
If the aircraft catapult is forward of "Y" turret as below, the more empty space aft obvious to Tiger would be visibly busier, more cruiser like.
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Some kind of deal to rebuild the ships in places such as Pembroke,Rosyth and on the Clydebank, to prevent shipyards from closing down, as suggested earlier the government may need Welsh and Scottish votes. Keeping the shipyards open, which employees thousands would help
i dont think it would happen - as the weakest of the RN BC's she'd be off doing less important work
she'd probably be doing the job that Repulse or Renown were doing in OTL
of course that would free up one of those to join Hood / PoW and the added 15in shells (and the historical excellent gunnery that Renown and Repulse showed would make a mess of Pricen Eugen in short order)
If there's 15 inch shells available it's only firing at one place.
Repulse was the leadship of force H and Renown was covering a massive convoy until it was sure the twins wouldnt and and couldnt sortie from Brest before being broken off to search for the Bismark. Being the third ship in a squadron is less important work than being the lead ship of a squadron.
I'm pretty sure it was Renown with Force H, and Repulse broke from her convoy to help KGV cover the Faroe Is. Gap
Rodney was on convoy duty
Hood and POW were covering DS
Tiger could have been with force H instead of Renown
Yeah I mixed up Renown and Repulse. Repulse detached from the convoy ws8b (UK to Med via Freetown) after it became apparent that the twins could not sortie and if they did could not catch the convoy and then joined KGV for the hunt for the Bismark.
Force H was an important squadron and it was considered necessary to have a heavy capital ship available to operate in the western med or in case of a southern sortie by the twins.
So then Tiger goes to DS with Hood(rebuilt) and POW
I presume the formation would be Hood, POW and then Tiger.
But the question is..would Holland have the ships close in as they did, head on?
The main reason for doing this was because of Hoods deck armour, but that's not a problem anymore.
Would they be thinking about Tigers vulnerability?
The Germans might mistake tiger for a cruiser but the British don't know that they will..