King Arthur the Great: A Tudor TL

[FONT=&quot]Hey guys, so I haven't posted a TL in a while and I've been working on this as a side project. Theres likely numerous innacuracies and I encourage criticism if you view its due but I also encourage you to enjoy the story :D I cant guarantee regular updates but I hope to be able to.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] King Arthur the Great: A Tudor TL
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]A Timeline by Spamage[/FONT]​
[FONT=&quot]Chapter 1: The Waning Days of Henry VII[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]1502-1507
king-henry-VII.jpg

[/FONT]
King Henry VII of England

In the year 1502 England appeared to be content. The monarchy was solid; the War of the Roses a distant memory, and the heir to the throne had received marriage to the popular foreign princess, Catherine of Aragon, daughter of the famed Ferdinand and Isabella. However that feeling of content would soon be shattered when a mere sickness almost threw the Kingdom into disarray.

Following his marriage, Prince Arthur was sent to Ludlow Castle along with his wife. He was supposed to preside over the Council of Wales and the Marches and he did so until March when both him and his wife fell ill with what we now know to be sweating sickness.

Both the Prince and Princess had up and down periods but the greatest scare came on April 2nd, 1505 when Arthur nearly died. For a few moments it was certain the would-be King was fading fast but he miraculously began to improve. His wife, Princess Catherine, recovered as well and by the end of April both were nearly fully restored to pre-sickness levels. This apparently sealed the unity the couple would be later known for and caused great affection to arise. Many said God was with the young Prince and had great plans for him and his wife was one of the biggest supporters of this idea.

The couple returned to London by the end of the year and the Prince was reunited with his mother who had been worried extensively over the health of her son. Even Henry VII showed a surprising breach of his normally reserved attitude and hugged his son on sight. Another sign Arthur’s parent’s gratefulness was an effort spearheaded by Queen Elizabeth to create a positive relationship with her daughter-in-law, something she had not enjoyed with Henry’s mother. The two women did indeed develop a bond and became quick friends despite the age and language barriers which partially prevented much communication.
Language appeared to be an early struggle for Princess Catherine who could only communicate with her husband through Latin, but she gradually began picking up English and displayed herself an exceptionally bright student. By the dawn of the year 1503 conditions in the Kingdom looked even better than they had just one mere year prior. The Queen was pregnant with another child, good royal relations were being fostered, and the heir to the throne was healthy along with his wife.

In February 1503 Queen Elizabeth went into labor. She soon gave birth to a daughter whom the couple quickly named Princess Katherine. Both mother and daughter were healthy and celebrations ensued. It is presently unclear where the name Katherine came from but the majority of courtiers and Princess Catherine herself thought it was named after her, due to her surprisingly fast friendship with her daughter in law. The Queen herself never confirmed these rumors but did indeed invite Catherine to be one of the child’s godparents along with Louis XII or France, Margaret Beaufort, and King Manuel I of Portugal. The 2 Kings used stand ins at the baptism.
Other than the birth of Princess Katherine 1503 proved to be very un-notable with the exception of the marriage between Margaret Tudor and James IV. The marriage was largely a political match because of Henry’s attempts to break the Auld Alliance which he would die realizing was a failure. Regardless, Princess Margaret would depart in June and would arrive in Scotland shortly after where she would attempt to devote her life to improving relations between her mother and daughter countries.

In 1504 the influence of Princess Catherine was greatly lessened. Her mother died in November and not only was the Princess inconsolable, she found her position lessened and realized had she not been married to Arthur there was a high probability that she would have died an old maid. Henry VII himself was somewhat melancholy about the loss and apparently commented “that was some woman” in reference to the Queen. The 2 had been haggling partners primarily in the engagement of Arthur to Catherine and now only Ferdinand remained and he was somewhat more of a hard bargainer that his wife. Arthur consoled his wife and it appears their relationship bean to go from an awkward teen marriage to a legitimate state from this period on as Catherine found herself pregnant in January 1505. She was 19 and her husband was 18. The pregnancy was relatively smooth and in August she withdrew from court and went into the expected period of seclusion. Finally on September 21st, 1505 a baby boy was born to the couple. Both Arthur and King Henry were elated and the child was quickly named Henry in order to honor the King. Only one person in the royal family was pessimistic about the birth however, and that was the 14 year old Prince Henry who had continually seen his position diminish, first from Margaret becoming a foreign Queen, and now to him being demoted to 3rd in line to the throne. The prince apparently was very hard to deal with and was privately referred to by some of is tutors as “a brat”. Even so, marriage negotiations soon began for the 14 year old who was eventually decided to take the infant Ursula Pole as his one day wife in order to secure the Tudor power over the throne and inter mix their blood with those of the Plantagenet’s. Margaret Pole was the primary negotiator as she feared for both her and her children’s safety under Henry VII who had had her brother executed and had revealed he was not comfortable with the Pole family. By marrying her daughter she ensured not only political power for her family in some form but also protection. It was a surprising, yet genius idea.

By 1506 the King’s health soon began to decline. In May of the year both Queen Elizabeth and Princess Catherine announced their pregnancies. Prince Henry the young (Arthur’s son) was now 1 year old and many royal nobles were hoping for yet another son so Henry VII could die knowing his throne was secure. Queen Elizabeth went into labor in November and the child was a stillborn boy. The couple was devastated and Elizabeth never began to really recover due to her grief. In fact she went into decline and by the beginning of December her condition was terrible. By the 15th of that very same month she was dead. King Henry VII was extremely devastated and began mourning. Therefore it seemed somewhat awkward when Princess Catherine went into labor on the 22nd of December, the day of the Queen’s funeral. A daughter was born and was without question named Princess Elizabeth. The birth of the baby was slightly uplifting to the King but his health ultimately began declining as well. He refused to celebrate Christmas on the 25th of December 1506 and throughout the spring of 1507 he developed a cough that steadily got worse. The King lost part of his will to live and went into extended mourning before being forced to go to bed rest due to pure exhaustion caused by grief. Arthur became the de facto ruler during this period and on April 11th, 1507 King Henry VII passed away. In 1 year the Kingdom had went from having 2 healthy monarchs to a dead King and Queen. Prince Arthur was now due to ascend to the throne following the funeral of his father at the end of April at the age of 20.
 
Last edited:
Also guys, I'm trying to come up with a new name, the one at present doesn't really strike me.... feel free to place suggestions. As a hint this TL will be English centric, primarily Tudor centric... I was thinking a Tudorian Future but I dont know...
 
Like to see what happens to Henry here, does he become Archbishop of Canterbury (even if he is married), or is he the powerful Duke of York in this TL.
 
Interesting start but there's a couple issues. First, Elizabeth of York only got pregnant because of Arthur's death in an attempt to have another son. So maybe her pregnancy with Katherine would makes sense but th e last one would be unnecessary. Two why did Henry VII died earlier then in OTL? Besides wanting to get him out of the way earlier I can't see a real reason. Third, Henry of York was destined for the Church. That only changed because he was the last son left. So with his brother surviving and having a son, I can't see him being married off. Oh and you have the wrong year with Arthur and Catherine's ilness. It was 1505, not 1555. Besides those points very good start.
 
Interesting start but there's a couple issues. First, Elizabeth of York only got pregnant because of Arthur's death in an attempt to have another son. So maybe her pregnancy with Katherine would makes sense but the last one would be unnecessary. Two why did Henry VII died earlier then in OTL? Besides wanting to get him out of the way earlier I can't see a real reason. Third, Henry of York was destined for the Church. That only changed because he was the last son left. So with his brother surviving and having a son, I can't see him being married off. Oh and you have the wrong year with Arthur and Catherine's ilness. It was 1505, not 1555. Besides those points very good start.

I primarily wanted to bump Henry VII off ;) but in reality I think that with a sudden demise of his wife (later than OTL so his health is worse) would have worse effects on the King, although I see your point. Also, Elizabeth could've potentially gotten pregnant she had been 3 years prior and there wasn't very effective ways from preventing it back then although I never realized Arthur's death was the reason for Katherine

I have interesting plans for Henry which will involve his fierce independence (not a good thing) and his womanizing ;) . I forgot about the clergy apsect, so I'll contemplate that....


Thank you to the 2 of you for commenting. Your interest is aprpaciated
 
[FONT=&quot]Chapter 2: Equal in all but name, King Arthur & Queen Catherine[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1507-1509[/FONT]

220px-Arthur_Prince_of_Wales_c_1500.jpg
27413532527484280.jpg

King Arthur and Queen Catherine, the beloved monarchs

Even with the loss of two parents in the period of a year the new King Arthur had little time for mourning. He was at his father’s deathbed and his funeral which was one of the most lavish the city of London had seen up until that time. Following the funeral a coronation was set for the beginning of June with expediency being the best remedy in order to prevent challengers for the throne arising. The time soon passed and on June 4th, 1507 King Arthur and Queen Catherine were crowned in Westminster Abbey with much joy throughout the city. Among those looking on were Margaret Beaufort, Mary Tudor, Prince Henry (brother to king) Tudor, and many other ambassadors, nobles, and clergy. King Arthur and Queen Catherine immediately set down to work and ruled in a style similar to Catherine’s parents Ferdinand and Isabella. They were co-monarchs in all but name.

One of the first acts the new king made was calling off the marriage of his brother to Ursula Pole and instead having him marry Eleanor of Austria which would be set in 1514. Instead, with Margaret Pole's consent, Ursula would marry the next male heir Arthur and Catherine had. Although at the time of the agreement the chance of Ursula being married was low, Queen Catherine was soon again pregnant in the fall of 1507.

The King and Queen enjoyed enormous popularity during their first months and it largely was present for the rest of their reign. Crowds cheered often and people respected the “Great Couple”. In fact at one point the crowds following the monarchs as they left London were once so large they filled the city with disorder for hours and ended with several deaths.

Queen Catherine gave birth to yet another son on March 2nd, 1508 and the Kingdom was once again filled with celebrations. The boy was named Arthur after his father. Congratulations were sent from both Spain and the Holy Roman Empire while France was, oddly enough, quiet on the issue. Their silence offended King Arthur and would largely shape his foreign policy over the coming years. He took the event very personally when in reality some congratulations were sent but the messenger died of the sweating sickness, similar to the one the King had caught when he first married the Queen, in Northern France while waiting to cross the English Channel to deliver the new.

The Children on King Arthur and Queen Catherine

1.Henry Tudor, Prince b. 21st Sept 1505
2.Elizabeth Tudor, Princess b. 22nd Dec 1506
3.Arthur Tudor, Prince b. 2nd Mar 1508

Also in 1508 King Arthur’s sister Mary was betrothed to Prince Charles of Castile, largely due to the influence of Queen Catherine. Mary herself had little say. This, of course, came months after France had indirectly offended King Arthur over such a minute issue, so the King did not object. The marriage date was set for 1514 and both sides were very unlikely to back out. The Tudors would indirectly gain much influence over Europe if the relationship occurred because Charles had many thrones he would likely inherit including the title King of Spain and Holy Roman Emperor, therefore any children would be blood related to the Monarch in England, not the one in France. This, of course, troubled the French who became more hostile towards the English presence in the North and frustration between the 2 nations increased for a period.

While Catherine exerted her influence in foreign affairs Arthur largely pushed his in domestic issues. He ordered his Father’s 2 former advisers Dudley and Empson imprisoned for life and began to make gradual changes which would remove his father’s influence and replace it with his own. That meant many members of the government were shuffled and replaced while remodeling occurred at some of the royal residences. Even with all the money spent on working on the construction projects Arthur was very frugal and didn’t overspend. His younger brother Henry often criticized him for doing so in his private journals and it is estimated it was this time in the year 1409 that tensions began to rise between the 2 brothers as, to his closest advisers, Henry often expressed jealousy of his older brother and nephews. The Prince also was jealous over the fact that he was 18 and unmarried. He was quite a lover though and it was reported the prince kept many mistresses, something which ashamed the very loyal King.

Henry VII had plans for Prince Henry to go into the clergy but those were stalled upon the ascension of his brother and his eventual engagement to Ursula Pole, and later Eleanor of Austria. The extreme, sudden change in direction had an effect on Henry and led him to be a bit cautious when dealing with his brother, whom he blamed for changing his life around. This, combined with his independent attitude had a great affect on the way others, including his brother, dealt with him. Privately King Arthur considered the young Henry a loose cannon and was worried of potential problems he could cause as he got older including influence over Arthur’s children in the event of the King’s death, violent rebellions, and embarrassment of the royal family. It was apparently well known at court that Arthur would later express regret at having touched his brother’s issues at all upon his ascension.

In June 1509 King Arthur announced he would be departing to assault the French and would leave the nation under the regency of his Queen. The King departed shortly after in July and landed at Calais. Eager to prove his power the young King amassed a large sum of troops and with his closest advisers began planning specific attacks and assaults. France meanwhile, was suspicious but wasn’t entirely knowledgeable of the King’s whereabouts. Many in the French court in Paris truly believed that it was just a display of force and some others even speculated Arthur was bluffing and hadn’t even crossed the channel. They were proved wrong however, just weeks later as Arthur’s troops moved forward.
 
Very interesting Spamage! I like how you‘ve made Arthur and Catherine the equivalent of Ferdinand and Isabella II. In the OTL, we can see that Catherine showed some of the ability to pull that off. Didn‘t Henry hand her the keys to the Kingdom when he went off the War in France? Apparently she protected the Kingdom pretty well against the Scots. Pretty amazing when you consider that England wasn‘t used to a women being in charge like that.

I have 2 concerns:
Would Prince Henry really be able to snag someone like Eleanor of Austria? She‘s quite a catch considering how much of a big wig her brother is and Henry is the spare who has been supplanted in the line of succession by his nephew... He may inherit the Dukedom of York (if there is one), but I doubt that‘s going to be enough for the (future) Emperor‘s oldest sister. Also Charles‘ family is also allied with England through his aunt‘s marriage to Arthur so I don‘t know if he‘d want to use up one of his most valuable female pawns on someone like Henry...

I have some concerns about Catherine‘s fertility. She seems to be knocking out the babies like a Woodville and I‘m not sure she‘d have the ability to do that. Sure you have her beginning childbearing a lot earlier and she‘s doesn‘t go through that stressful period after Arthur‘s death which may have badly compromised her health. But, I still think she had a bit of a delicate constitution, since she was often sick after Arthur‘s death in the OTL.
 
Very interesting Spamage! I like how you‘ve made Arthur and Catherine the equivalent of Ferdinand and Isabella II. In the OTL, we can see that Catherine showed some of the ability to pull that off. Didn‘t Henry hand her the keys to the Kingdom when he went off the War in France? Apparently she protected the Kingdom pretty well against the Scots. Pretty amazing when you consider that England wasn‘t used to a women being in charge like that.

I have 2 concerns:
Would Prince Henry really be able to snag someone like Eleanor of Austria? She‘s quite a catch considering how much of a big wig her brother is and Henry is the spare who has been supplanted in the line of succession by his nephew... He may inherit the Dukedom of York (if there is one), but I doubt that‘s going to be enough for the (future) Emperor‘s oldest sister. Also Charles‘ family is also allied with England through his aunt‘s marriage to Arthur so I don‘t know if he‘d want to use up one of his most valuable female pawns on someone like Henry...

I have some concerns about Catherine‘s fertility. She seems to be knocking out the babies like a Woodville and I‘m not sure she‘d have the ability to do that. Sure you have her beginning childbearing a lot earlier and she‘s doesn‘t go through that stressful period after Arthur‘s death which may have badly compromised her health. But, I still think she had a bit of a delicate constitution, since she was often sick after Arthur‘s death in the OTL.

1. Eleanor of Austria is probably a bit too big of a snag for Henry, but I'm running the assumption Catherine's influence over her family members will make the union a bit more realistic, but I will concur it is highly implausible. I've actually been looking for other marriage possibilities for henry but so for am empty handed.

2. In this timeline, as you pointed out, the stress after Arthur's death doesn't occur and neither does the sick period as she is at court instead of a lonely widow, forgotten by both her father and father in law. That of course isn't to say she will have a perfect fertile record. As you also pointed out she is younger now, so miscarriages are less likely but they still may occur.

Thanks for the comments :) glad to see people enjoying this!
 
Eleanor of Austria would be far too grand an alliance for Henry. Catherine's influence with her family was negligible. Possible marriage partners suited to his station and prospects:

- Bona Sforza (providing him with the duchy of Bari and the possibility of becoming a neutral Duke of Milan)
- Infanta Julia of Naples, a cousin of King Ferdinand, OTL married off to the Marquis of Montferrat I think
- Margaret Courtenay, his first cousin, granddaughter of King Edward IV
- Elizabeth Grey, Viscountess Lisle, one of the few heiresses around at the time
- the Infanta Anne of Navarre, or one of her many sisters, daughters of Queen Catherine III
- Maria, Duchess of Julich-Berg, a rich German heiress, mother of Henry's OTL wife Anne of Cleves.
 
Eleanor of Austria would be far too grand an alliance for Henry. Catherine's influence with her family was negligible. Possible marriage partners suited to his station and prospects:

- Bona Sforza (providing him with the duchy of Bari and the possibility of becoming a neutral Duke of Milan)
- Infanta Julia of Naples, a cousin of King Ferdinand, OTL married off to the Marquis of Montferrat I think
- Margaret Courtenay, his first cousin, granddaughter of King Edward IV
- Elizabeth Grey, Viscountess Lisle, one of the few heiresses around at the time
- the Infanta Anne of Navarre, or one of her many sisters, daughters of Queen Catherine III
- Maria, Duchess of Julich-Berg, a rich German heiress, mother of Henry's OTL wife Anne of Cleves.

Before you posted, I had indeed decided on Margaret, meaning that Henry's betrothal will end!
 
Eleanor of Austria would be far too grand an alliance for Henry. Catherine's influence with her family was negligible. Possible marriage partners suited to his station and prospects:

- Bona Sforza (providing him with the duchy of Bari and the possibility of becoming a neutral Duke of Milan)
- Infanta Julia of Naples, a cousin of King Ferdinand, OTL married off to the Marquis of Montferrat I think
- Margaret Courtenay, his first cousin, granddaughter of King Edward IV
- Elizabeth Grey, Viscountess Lisle, one of the few heiresses around at the time
- the Infanta Anne of Navarre, or one of her many sisters, daughters of Queen Catherine III
- Maria, Duchess of Julich-Berg, a rich German heiress, mother of Henry's OTL wife Anne of Cleves.

If Henry marries a Navarrese heiress, Gascony will be restored to English rule, something Henry tried at the begining of his reign.
 
[FONT=&quot]Chapter 3: Enemies at the Border[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1509-1513[/FONT]

clothofgold.jpg
[FONT=&quot]King Arthur’s Men and the King himself march south from Calais

[/FONT]
King Arthur’s men headed south at a surprisingly rapid pace. French messengers spread the word and Louis XII was forced to create an army with little time to spare and march north. Accompanying the King was his heir apparent, Francis. The men arrived at the French city of Amiens, a surprisingly long distance from Calais, and were forced to prepare the city to endure an English siege at the hands of Arthur. However, at the last minute, the King changed his plans and decided a head on battle would be a better solution to facing the threat. Many of his men were startled by the sudden change but as he was their king, they obeyed. On August 11th, 1509 Arthur’s men were seen by Louis and the same went for Louis’ men by Arthur. By the morning of the 12th it was clear a battle would occur. Louis commanded his men not to make the opening move, preferring a defensive position in the initial stages of the battle. By noon Arthur’s men charged and the French front lines were obliterated.

Seeing so many men die unexpectedly Louis XII had little options. He had underestimated the power of the English force. He regrouped what men of his army remained and they fled the field, fleeing southeast towards Ham. Tensions were high and Louis XII ultimately decided to return to Paris at the pleading of several of his generals. Shortly after arriving the King sent several diplomats to Scotland where he wanted to cash in on the Auld Alliance. The King thought that England was without its King and most of his generals so they would be easier to take under Catherine’s regency.

Meanwhile Arthur took much of the areas surrounding Calais. Amiens was accordingly sieged briefly and then captured in the aftermath of the Battle of Amiens. The King was savoring his military victories and feared little opposition as he was in the optimal position, having good relations with both Spain and the Holy Roman Empire.

Scotland heeded Louis XII’s pleas and attacked the English in October. Catherine was shocked, but showed much of the leadership signs her mother often exhibited. She officially denounced the attack and assembled a large fighting force with much of what was guarding the south. A game of somewhat cat and mouse was played in Northern England when the army arrived because the Scots were intentionally avoiding a battle. They instead were looting and seizing villages in the countryside who had no quarrel with either side of the conflict. These attacks were unwanted by the locals and swayed many from neutral to pro-English. James IV had made a big mistake. The locals eventually gave the information of the Scot’s whereabouts to Catherine’s army and so by late Novermber a surprise attack was launched on the Scottish camp. The scots fled but soon regrouped and the following morning charged into battle. Initially conditions appeared favorable and James IV was confident but my midday it was clear his men were overwhelmed. In the late stages of the battle, with relatively high casualties on both sides, James fled back to Scotland with what remained of his army. He sued for peace and was accepted by Catherine under the condition that he cede a small amount of border lands. He did and under Catherine alone England expanded.

During the winter of 1509/1510 Arthur continued his campaign in Northern France. As winter soon thawed and spring arrived it was clear that the King was beginning to over extend the amount of territory in relation to the size of his army. So, in March of 1510 the King returned to England in the midst of much joy and celebration. The dynamic couple was reunited and Catherine was pregnant by July. Her pregnancy appeared to go smoothly up until the date for the birth in December. The Queen went into labor praying for another son but was soon to be saddened when a daughter was born and began to slowly fade right in front of her mother’s eyes. The daughter was named Mary and was quickly baptized before dying just a week after birth. Many now believe the cause of death was deformation of the lungs due to the reported strange way of breathing Princess Mary had. The weight of losing their first child weighed heavily on the couple, especially Catherine who went into a state of seclusion and mourning.

The situation got worse in January 1511 when Henry’s martial contract to Eleanor of Austria was unexpectedly broken off. The Prince was already a very angry individual and got more so at the prospect of potentially never being married. He began to take several mistresses and essentially begged his brother for the choice of his own bride. Arthur refused, remembering how cold and jealous members of Henry’s household reported him to be. The relations were at an all-time low. Queen Catherine eventually tried to intermediate for she feared the sway Henry might have if her husband were to die unexpectedly as her child had just done several months prior. She took up Henry’s cause with great fervor and eventually negotiated a settlement between the two brothers that Henry could marry whom he chose, so long as she was a noblewoman from either England or one of her allies. Henry and Arthur both reluctantly accepted. The Prince searched for a wife in the foreign nations first but had no success and so in 1512 he began profiling English ladies. Finally in April he decided on Margaret Courtenay, the granddaughter of Edward IV and daughter of Princess Catherine of York. Although she was 13 he decided to wait. Margaret met King Arthur’s approval and the wedding was planned for 1515.
 
Chapter 4: The Rebirth of France
1513-1516

7489309196_68b2e67465_z.jpg

Francis I, the King of France

Queen Catherine soon recovered from her melancholy attitude following the loss of Princess Mary through birth complications and pursued, in her eyes, the only solution; having more children. Just weeks after she had successfully negotiated the marriage settlement for Prince Henry the older, the Queen began to show subtle signs of pregnancy which was attributed largely to the much more romantic turn her marriage had taken. Since Arthur’s return she had sacrificed some of the clout she held during her regency but largely she still had immense control, the only person more powerful than her being the King. She was enamored with the signals of the fact that she was with child and began preparing for another birth.

Meanwhile in Europe, Maximilian and Arthur both negotiated peace with France on their own terms. England now had a large stake in mainland Europe as parts of France which hadn’t seen English men since the Hundred Years War were back in their possession. Obviously this was a blow to Louis who saw his holdings diminishing and the future of his Kingdom indeed looked grim. Mary Tudor had just departed England for Spain where her and the young heir to much of Europe would begin courting one another. The House of Valois was surrounded by enemies from the north, east, and south and its only stable, continuous ally was a backwater, unstable country to the north of England which had faced several large defeats. The pope even wasn’t cooperating with the French monarchy and because of this heavy weight weighing down upon him Louis XII couldn’t last. His condition deteriorated throughout the summer of 1514 and on August 11th late in the evening he quietly passed away. Of course this meant that the crown of France fell to a much younger and more ambitious heir, Francis who had just recently married the King’s daughter Claude.

On August 11th, the same day as Louis XII’s death, there was to be celebration on the other side of the English Channel for an entirely different reason. Queen Catherine gave birth to a daughter, quickly named Isabella after Catherine’s famed mother and role model, around the same time that Louis passed away. Unlike her older sister Mary, Isabella was a strong baby and her piercing screams echoed throughout the chambers following the birth, much to the relief of her mother. Arthur was excited, although he would’ve hoped to secure his position further, he believed a daughter was acceptable as she could not only form a marriage alliance but she could also produce future potential male heirs if, god forbid, something happened to Henry and Arthur.

As it was 1515 and Prince Henry the young was now 10, Catherine began searching for a suitable spouse. She reportedly wished that Henry would marry Charles, the future Holy Roman Emperor, and Margaret Tudor’s children but the couple was not married and the soon to be Hapsburg King and Emperor was only a 15 year old. Therefore her eyes turned elsewhere. Catherine of Austria, Catherine’s niece and Henry’s cousin was uncommitted however, and so at the end of May in 1515 the marriage agreement was finalized and Catherine was to be sent to England “swiftly and with great haste” in order to get her accustomed to her future domain as Queen, something Catherine had had little time to do in her opinion. This would allow the future Queen Mary to be a more adept ruler if crisis ever required her to take the helm as Catherine had done since Arthur had gone to France.

Discontent somewhat continued to convulse through France as it crowned yet another King. But, unlike some of his predecessors, Francis proved to be promising. He was a Renaissance man in most senses and embraced the new styles of Artwork coming out of Northern Italy. He believed that while France has lost militarily to the Hapsburgs that it would win culturally and in another way, colonially. Francis, motivated by a fear of being pushed out of France by his enemies, actively began searching for the place to plant a second France if need be. The New World held much promise and with the option of competing with Spain on another field open, the King pounced on the opportunity. He began construction on several ports and put several explorers, namely a young 30 year old Italian Giovanni Veranzzo. He was a dreamer and following the pameny from the King took up the exploration of the New World with great zeal. In 1516 he landed in 7 separate spots up and down the coast of North America. Ultimately, in order to pursue French colonization successfully the Explorer decided on a place to plant a new city in the New World, the Bay of Francis (OTL Delaware Bay).

Francis’ next generation policy largely was successful. Although there were a few exceptions to the King’s favoritism of the upcoming populace such as the famed artist Leonardo Da Vinci, he did largely base his advisor choices on men other than his close friends. Those open government policy was somewhat unique, yet was replicated to some extent by Arthur, the King of England.

While in many aspects Arthur appeared to be a good King, he wasn’t always in the best of health. The King was out of shape and contrasted sharply to his younger brother Henry. Accompanying this was the King and his wife’s devout faith which some viewed as an asset while to others it was a detractor. He was a devout Catholic, and believed that God alone had saved his life many years ago following his marriage to Catherine, she was only too happy to agree.
 
Last edited:
I realize its been quite some time since I posted an update but I remembered this the other day and have started work on it again! :D
 

katchen

Banned
Great TL! So France gets into the New World much earlier. Well before the Reformation. We'll see how Arthur handles that, since he has no quarrel with the Pope.
 
Interesting start but there's a couple issues. First, Elizabeth of York only got pregnant because of Arthur's death in an attempt to have another son. So maybe her pregnancy with Katherine would makes sense but th e last one would be unnecessary. Two why did Henry VII died earlier then in OTL? Besides wanting to get him out of the way earlier I can't see a real reason. Third, Henry of York was destined for the Church. That only changed because he was the last son left. So with his brother surviving and having a son, I can't see him being married off. Oh and you have the wrong year with Arthur and Catherine's ilness. It was 1505, not 1555. Besides those points very good start.

This is true, but had Henry VII basically ceased conjugal relations with Elizabeth until Arthur was dead and he wanted another son? I could see that being so, given Henry VII's personality, and given how much older Elizabeth was getting, but it's also possible that this pregnancy was an accident, albeit a happy one given Arthur's death... until she died and so did the child, a girl at that.
 
This is true, but had Henry VII basically ceased conjugal relations with Elizabeth until Arthur was dead and he wanted another son? I could see that being so, given Henry VII's personality, and given how much older Elizabeth was getting, but it's also possible that this pregnancy was an accident, albeit a happy one given Arthur's death... until she died and so did the child, a girl at that.

I don't think it was an accident. Wasn't there a quote from Elizabeth of York to Henry VII after Arthurs death, something along the lines of we're both young enough to have another son/more children?
 
I don't think it was an accident. Wasn't there a quote from Elizabeth of York to Henry VII after Arthurs death, something along the lines of we're both young enough to have another son/more children?

There was indeed; she said that God had only granted Henry VII's mother, Margaret Beaufort (whom Elizabeth referred to as Henry's "My Lady Mother") one child and that she and he (Elizabeth and Henry) were young enough to have more children.

And, indeed, Elizabeth was right; her mother had given birth to her last child at 47 - at the time of conception, Elizabeth was only 36; she came from a fertile family (her mother had 12 children; her grandmother had 14!) and there were no problems in the pregnancy. Elizabeth caught childbed fever.

Her death wasn't caused by the pregnancy - that was easy as pie, she'd had 6 (or 7, depending on sources) other children - but being in the tower, where the infection could easily spread.
 
Why not have Henry sent to Ireland to remove his influence from the English court. Have him leave on the pretext of gaining control of Ireland for England and there after he gains control, he revolts and sets up his own Kingdom.
 
Top