Protect and Survive: A Timeline

Thinking about the Controller again, what is frightening, to me at least, is that he could be any of us. He is an everyman.
I'm a Civil Servant and I could easily imagine myself finding out that my name had been chosen to man a government bunker. Apparently the only warning one would get would be the letter telling you to report to the assembly point.

I think I'd just have gone home instead.
 
I think that it is likely that the Controller, or his successor will simply fall apart at some stage. I think a significant proportion of his staff will too, no matter how busy they are.
Admittedly for a while so long as they are kept busy things won't be too bad as they won't be able to dwell on what is happening, or what they have done. Just imagine what sort of nightmare they will have if they are able to sleep. I think a lot of them will be hollowed out shells within a month.

The Armed Forces and Uniformed Services will have to watch for suicides. A mix of depressed, or mentally unstable people and guns don't mix well. Anyone remember the disturbed PC in The War Game? There will be a lot like him.

When those in authority start to fall apart then that will be seriously detrimental for everyone else. Much as we all hate it from time to time, having no effective government is not good.

Thinking about the Controller again, what is frightening, to me at least, is that he could be any of us. He is an everyman.
I'm a Civil Servant and I could easily imagine myself finding out that my name had been chosen to man a government bunker. Apparently the only warning one would get would be the letter telling you to report to the assembly point.

I think I'd just have gone home instead.

I agree with both statements. How can we truly blame an everyman for making mistakes when the world as he or she once knew it is now gone, perhaps forever?
 
Yup, it's not like a council Chief Executive would be some sort of Hitler in Waiting. He'll have done something like 30+ years of service as a functionary in the council, none of which will have properly prepared him for this. Yes, he will have done courses at Easingwold, but nothing will prepare someone for the realities and horrors of nuclear war.
I do wonder what has happened to his relatives. Probably gone the same way as Clive Sutton's in Threads.
 

Macragge1

Banned
I think that it is likely that the Controller, or his successor will simply fall apart at some stage. I think a significant proportion of his staff will too, no matter how busy they are.
Admittedly for a while so long as they are kept busy things won't be too bad as they won't be able to dwell on what is happening, or what they have done. Just imagine what sort of nightmare they will have if they are able to sleep. I think a lot of them will be hollowed out shells within a month.

The Armed Forces and Uniformed Services will have to watch for suicides. A mix of depressed, or mentally unstable people and guns don't mix well. Anyone remember the disturbed PC in The War Game? There will be a lot like him.

When those in authority start to fall apart then that will be seriously detrimental for everyone else. Much as we all hate it from time to time, having no effective government is not good.

The next few updates are definitely going to feature some people cracking under the strain - we're now at the point where the shock of the attack has worn off and the reality of the situation is starting to set in. It's here when I reckon people would start to get really flaky.

Thinking about the Controller again, what is frightening, to me at least, is that he could be any of us. He is an everyman.
I'm a Civil Servant and I could easily imagine myself finding out that my name had been chosen to man a government bunker. Apparently the only warning one would get would be the letter telling you to report to the assembly point.

I think I'd just have gone home instead.

Yeah, I wrote him as a normal guy just trying to get on with it - I'm glad that different people have different opinions, though - makes him a bit more interesting.

The idea of just being called up would be a real dilemma. Obviously I wasn't alive at the time, but until very recently I suppose I could have been called up as an 18 year old cadet if something fucked-up enough happened. I suppose in the event of a nuclear war, I'd be conflicted between just going home to my family and trying to cling to survival by being one of the guys with a gun that will fare slightly better.

Yup, it's not like a council Chief Executive would be some sort of Hitler in Waiting. He'll have done something like 30+ years of service as a functionary in the council, none of which will have properly prepared him for this. Yes, he will have done courses at Easingwold, but nothing will prepare someone for the realities and horrors of nuclear war.
I do wonder what has happened to his relatives. Probably gone the same way as Clive Sutton's in Threads.

God, Easingwold couldn't have even begun to prepare him. I guess the Controller's a more neutral character than the Constable, who is the most unambiguously good guy I've written - I think he needs to be there, to balance it out a bit.
 
God, Easingwold couldn't have even begun to prepare him. I guess the Controller's a more neutral character than the Constable, who is the most unambiguously good guy I've written - I think he needs to be there, to balance it out a bit.

Did the Constable not rape someone, was that someone else, or have I completely misread something?
 
The 'Hot Seat' exercise he would have gone through would have had a degree of unreality that this situation does not. No matter how stressful the exercise you know at the back of your mind that once you step out of the room the Real World is still there.

That's not the case here. The Real World is smashed, broken and destroyed, never to return, at least in his lifetime.

The Controller is a bit morally ambiguous, or at least his actions are. The Constable has also done what in the pre-war world would be questionable, but there is now a new reality and a new morality, but at least he has a conscience.
 
I'm going to add something that will sound...

...very morally dubious, but the post-attack world can not afford our moral scruples and value system.

The Controller's decision to deny food to babies and those who can not work is horrible beyond comprehension, but I have to say that it is probably the right one in the short, to medium term. This will sound appalling, but while able bodied people capable of working (including older children) are irreplaceable at the moment and food is in short supply, and they need the food to work. Babies, in short, are a drain and are expendable (God I hate myself for typing that).

Humans will, bar mass sterility, always be able to have more babies, but if able bodied people can't eat enough to work then what is left of society will fall apart. I also doubt that the very young and very old will not survive the first winter, they will also be more vulnerable to a lot of diseases that with a lack of medicines will no longer be treatable.
Just think what a killer simple infections will become, never mind something like meningitis, or typhoid.

After saying all that I do feel very dirty and like I need to wash.
 

Macragge1

Banned
Did the Constable not rape someone, was that someone else, or have I completely misread something?

Now that I re-read it, I can see why you'd think this. All that happened here was the Constable, looking for an excuse to leave the volunteer column and visit the Old Man and his Wife, pulled a random girl out of the crowd under the pretense of taking her round the corner and shooting her.

I can see how the time elapsing and the Constable's apologies could lead someone to infer there'd been a rape, but there wasn't. It's a testament to the Constable's conscience that he feels terrible even though all he's actually done is scare the shit out of the girl.

It's in the same chapter that the Constable gets his only 'kill' - to be fair though, he is killing more or less the biggest cunt that I wrote into the story.

...very morally dubious, but the post-attack world can not afford our moral scruples and value system.

The Controller's decision to deny food to babies and those who can not work is horrible beyond comprehension, but I have to say that it is probably the right one in the short, to medium term. This will sound appalling, but while able bodied people capable of working (including older children) are irreplaceable at the moment and food is in short supply, and they need the food to work. Babies, in short, are a drain and are expendable (God I hate myself for typing that).

Humans will, bar mass sterility, always be able to have more babies, but if able bodied people can't eat enough to work then what is left of society will fall apart. I also doubt that the very young and very old will not survive the first winter, they will also be more vulnerable to a lot of diseases that with a lack of medicines will no longer be treatable.
Just think what a killer simple infections will become, never mind something like meningitis, or typhoid.

After saying all that I do feel very dirty and like I need to wash.

It's horrible, it really is, but you're right. Imagine, feeling like one does just writing this as a hypothetical thing, what people like the Controller must feel like right now - it's a miracle he's lasted a month with stress like this.

Feeding and dealing with casualties are the two most contentious issues - the next few chapters will see some really bad problems stem out of people's feelings on both.

Talking about simple diseases, the line that always got me was from the 1970s Survivors - (which is brilliant) - I'm paraphrasing, but it's something about 'even a simple toothache' basically being the end of you - something about the teeth, perhaps, but it's a horrible line.
 
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It's very easy for us to sit in comfort and condemn the Controller's actions as evil, but if he tries to feed everyone then all will starve and that makes matters worse. The food has to be concentrated on those who can do most good, we can't be sentimental about the very young, the very old, the sick, or infirm. Btw that means I'm condemning myself; I have a chronic medical condition that requires regular treatment and I'd be an unacceptable drain on post-strike society, so I'd have to go.
To paraphrase Threads the more people who can't work die the more food there is for those who can.

The stress must be incredible. Just think about it, whatever decisions you take people will die in large numbers. Even if you take no decisions people are going to die. Imagine that weighing one one's conscience!

I think we've all had infections that would be killers if left untreated. The worst thing is even a simple cut could now kill someone.
 
Just run across this thread (!)...

As an Emergency Planning Officer in the mid-1980s I have to say that some features aren't correct simply because planning only really became effective after 1983, when the Emergency Planning Guidance to Local Authorities was published. I've been thorough at least a dozen courses at Home Defence/Civil Defence/Emergency Planning College Easingwold, I've trained as a Scientific Advisor and written genuine local authority plans.

The attitude we had to 'War Plan UK' and 'Threads' is probably unprintable. Sagan and others muddied the waters badly with their knee-jerk reactions. The only beneficiaries were CND - and that didn't help anybody to survive in an actual attack. Time after time, we were in the position of having to sit through no-brain lectures from characters who called us arsonists or murderers when we were doing our best to save lives by intelligent planning in a horrifying reality.

The real exercises and plans had to be thorough and to look seriously at the problems; 'Protect and Survive' was designed for tabloid readership understanding - and it still makes me wince. Fallout doesn't chirp. However, to stand out and hope for immediate obliteration is equally asinine.

Protecting staff and their families was a big headache; I did hear of a family who joined the Royal Observer Corps and UKWMO en masse, to obtain shelter and do their bit. At the same time, the Manchester District of Trafford's massive basement shelter had room for far more than the minimum staff. Bolton's was a 1950s town hall basement and far too small. There were intentions to take over and use solidly-constructed buildings as Group and Auxiliary Public Shelters - I helped write plans and procedures for Cheshire's - and a lot of building assessment work was being done in 1987-1988.

Unusual visits - I did walk along one and a half miles of cable tunnel under Manchester to the Guardian deep exchange. I also visited the UKWMO centre at Goosnargh near Preston, the best emergency centre I've seen in Britain. Also I helped prepare amateur and CB-based emergency communications. Fascinating work, but basically set aside by 1989. I still have a copy of EPGLA, though.
 

Tovarich

Banned
Now that I re-read it, I can see why you'd think this. All that happened here was the Constable, looking for an excuse to leave the volunteer column and visit the Old Man and his Wife, pulled a random girl out of the crowd under the pretense of taking her round the corner and shooting her.

I can see how the time elapsing and the Constable's apologies could lead someone to infer there'd been a rape, but there wasn't. It's a testament to the Constable's conscience that he feels terrible even though all he's actually done is scare the shit out of the girl.
I really guilty now, 'cos I thought he'd raped the girl too, on the basis of no evidence whatsoever.

Heh, it's probably a very good thing that I'm barred from ever doing jury duty!
 
A little more...

One of my first bosses in Emergency Planning was a an RAF Group-Captain who looked at the likely targetting-strategy. He had access to more military intelligence than we did, so reckoned that the UK had barely a dozen worthwhile nuclear targets. The rest could have been hit by early-generation Russian cruise missiles and bombers using conventional HE or chemical warheads. In fact, a conventional warfare phase was expected on both sides, in the air, at sea and on the ground.​

His explanation for the remarkably high numbers of deployed bombs/warheads in Russia and America was simple. There's straight machismo, but also 1. The reliability issue as warheads need reprocessing and 2. you want spare 'birds' after the 'nuclear exchange', to maintain position as a world power. By 1986 we were having to consider the possibility of a lot of nuclear 'duds' or 'broken arrows' from Russian warheads that simply failed to work. their missiles had a bare 60% launch reliability, although they improved that later.

The ROC/UKWMO had explosions occur in the unlikeliest places and I once had the chance to ask one of their bosses why. His reply was coldly simple : "We have a large number of Underground Posts that all need to be exercised, so we have to give them bombs to plot." That meant also using notional bombs that were so powerful that they were greater (in force and number) than an attack warranted. CND didn't take the point - or, more likely, wanted a 'pasteurised planet' scenario.​

When myself and some other EP nerds got together to look at this, we realised that the very coarse ROC post 'grid' meant that 1980s Russian bombs might only be spotted by one or two posts. A smaller and more accurate missile with a smaller warhead was always the development objective, on both sides. That's why the Pershings really scared Moscow - the USA had achieved an accurate weapon, not a first-strike one. First-strike with missiles was achievable by the USA by the mid-1950s, by Russia, by the mid-1960s. Fortunately, neither side was brainless enough to do it before the Soviet Union suffered economic collapse. Instead, wily old 'Ray-Gun' made Russia fold in a high-stakes game of poker. And CND were nowhere.​

In a Scientific Advisor exercise during 1982, Cheshire looked at the aftermath in considerable detail. I was having to run a switchboard that gave the decision-teams a rather unreliable 'radio' service. At one point, the Crewe & Nantwich District Controller tried to UDI, but was called to heel by the County Controller with the aid of public broadcasts. In a nutshell, he could tell the population where to go for food. However, the threat of a broadcast wasn't needed. But there was a lot of ingenuity - gas-generators for lorries and tractors, the manufacture of ether and chloroform and sedatives, the willingness to look at acid treatment of cellulose to produce sugars - for we're talking of people looking for solutions. The Rough Science programmes had nothing on what these people came up with. The closest I came was electrolysing weak brine with carbon electrodes from batteries and a bike dynamo, to make chlorine water/hypo for disinfectant and water treatment. S.urvival rate after a year was about 43%, but without action was only 5%, so there you go.​

Easingwold old hands may recall the notional county based on Nottinghamshire, which was 'Naptonshire'. I recall persuading my decision team to go with roast chicken dinners to use up the birds to feed evacuees along the roadside. Better than wasting the birds - and it kept people moving along to their billets. Billeting was to be emergency, 3 per unoccupied room, final, 1 per unoccupied room. Bad news for somewhere like Chatsworth, but roughly equivalent to the 'three rooms per family' you find in Moscow Right Now. But we anticipated having to use schools as Rest Centres for some months - maybe up to half a year.​

Regarding Emergency Feeding - I've built and used brick-built trench cookers and been at exercises where the Soyer Boilers and other kit was in use. Very effective. I was very annoyed when the stocks were dispersed/destroyed in the late 1980s to save a few million. Today we'd have to use trench cookers and the like, after the fuel for gas and liquid fuel camping cookers got used up. I still have the 1960s CD manual on Emergency Feeding.​
 
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Tovarich

Banned
Time after time, we were in the position of having to sit through no-brain lectures from characters who called us arsonists or murderers when we were doing our best to save lives by intelligent planning in a horrifying reality.

People can be bitchy, Cordite', I'm sad to say:(
The verbal - and sometimes physical! - attacks on CND members from drunken thugs were no fun either, I assure you.

A shame you weren't working for Cambridgeshire, then you could have enjoyed the sight of the Labour group leader (herself a life-long CND member) tearing her own members off a strip for bullying council staff in the way you describe - I don't think some of them even realised that's what they were doing!
 
Emergency Communications...

The UK was actually remarkably well-equipped with communications in the early 1980s, but we were worried about blast and flash damage to antennae and EMP damage to equipment. The RAYNET people reckoned that a spare radio would survive in foam or towels in the middle of a biscuit tin, which I'd have wrapped in aluminium foil and put on a wooden rack. But in 1983 I was into CB because the sets were widely available and it was fun (20 years old, m8).

The military and government had set up the microwave 'grid' avoiding the cities and major bases in the 19502-1960s. RN-1 was the main grid, RN-2 the feeders to bases (but not local authority Emergency Centre sites). RN-3 was (I think) devoted to the ROC, but it's almost 20 years since I looked up those files. There were other networks - the Army had an HF system almost useless except post-attack, as it used very long wire antennae vulnerable to EMP. There were other Army UHF systems, but that's another story.

At local authority level we had radio and line speech and telex links to Region (RGHQ), then in the County Main and Standby, ham radio 2-metre telex and speech, plus line telex and speech, down to County District emergency centres. Metropolitan Districts were supposed to be as good as a County Main. Below and alongside were the things we did for ourselves - grant aided, for converting County and District duplex (relayed) radios to simplex (direct set-to-set) on speech only. In a crisis we planned amateur 2-metre voice planned to Community Groups in the Districts, CB FM speech from Groups down to Community HQ and for in-Community work teams and recon.

The ROC were seriously worried about EMP on landlines and a third of posts would have valve radio sets. However, many ROC posts had CB and Ham radio operators who exercised quietly on relays. We at local authority had hundreds of Plessey-built PDRM-82 radiation meters for Community use, so in a crisis had a network ten times as fine as the ROC, whose readings we would plot ourselves and keep UKWMO informed. On exercises in Cheshire and Cumbria, the system worked. I was concerned about more major failures and in 1986 ran Exercise 'Outreach', an HF and VHF 2-metre that linked Liverpool, Carlisle, Newcastle, Hull, Chester, Stoke and Manchester. First time since the 1960s, maybe the last.

That's enough reminiscences. Hope it helps - the TL is intriguing.
 
Thank you, Tovarich...

...At Manchester we suffered from the 'Poisoned Dwarf', so-named by his fellow-councillors. But I still managed to get a 2-metre VHF antenna up onto Manchester Town Hall.:)

Re contacting the USA - the USAF had lots of planes in the air in the event of a crisis - TACAMO and Air Force One would be the least of it. Experiments had gone on with meteor-reflected and moon-reflected messages in case of satellites being destroyed. Even if it's only morse, something would get through to the UK. I'd put my money on US or Mexican amateurs working long-distance with morse. A landing party in NBC suits from an attack submarine has the best chance of getting through. St. Lawrence Seaway and so on into the Canadian-American border would let a party in inflatables get at least as far as Niagara Falls.

Working backwards through the TL, think that the BBC wouldn't be so crass. There would be a LOT of advice on emergency procedures. But electrical power is vital - part of our planning was for information through local authority centres. Generators and fuel would be very important. I expect that improvised wind turbines would be a growth industry, to re-charge cannibalised car batteries for domestic power.

Cannibalism? Nope, never looked at. But I did have to look at mass-disposal of dead. We're talking of smoke in the air like the Foot and Mouth (Dalbeattie had pyres all round it, so whatever the wind...) or mass-graves/pyres like the Final Solution. And I can't say I'd have wasted tears on the Moors Murderers or other mass-killers.

Babies... H'mmm... Kruschev defended Leningrad in WWII by withdrawing ration cards from ALL non-combatants. Intourist used to show the grave-mounds off and didn't understand Western horror...

However... the advice to the population was to keep in three days to two weeks of food during a crisis. This means that fallout radiation declines (using the seven-tenths rule) to a thousandth of its Attack Plus One Hour level. If several attacks occur (the exercises had them over two days) then the countdown starts after the last attack, although doserates will fall faster in some places. So maybe there would be fewer babies starved to death - although people in badly-sited fallout shelters might die from ignorance, like the Where The Wind Blows rubbish. But there would be heavy losses to wildlife.
 
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..... Everything you have said ....

Your recollections confirm my own feelings namely that an attack is a lot more survivable than some think, and that proper planning and organisation can make recovery considerably easier.

It is very obvious that Newcastle has been well and truly destroyed TTL but as I have already said some places are virtually unscathed and can act as recovery centres. The point you have made about chloroform and ether is especially interesting. The average technology level will go downwards, but this is still way better than stone age level technology and this still allows several things to be done. Advanced drugs and medicine will be in short supply that's for sure, but basic anaesthetic and disinfectants are better than nothing at all full stop.

Your point on communication makes me wonder something. In the event of a similar attack today would the Internet survive in the UK? My bet is that some of the basic underlying infrastructure would be intact and this would considerably ease communication between the various emergency committees. Communication with overseas governments would be considerably eased as well.
 
The Internet

Well, in 1989 we had the Message Switch - a crude Telnet system devised to route messages round failed nodes. Yes. And don't forget messengers - I was one of the few EPOs who made contact with Royal Mail. The Regional Manager said that he had to look after the Armed Services first, but would probably be able to run vans between the County Main, Standby and District Emergency Centres. Below that, I was looking at a Postbus service and motorbikes and pushbikes in the Communities. Public telephones were intended to continue but most residential phones would not. The Preference Schemes were aimed at keeping society alive and stopping exchange batteries from being drained by people calling Auntie Maud.

Look up Harpanet and keep googling...
 
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Regarding comms, The (US) Civil Air Patrol has a HF radio network, some of whose stations are in out of the way places. There's ARES in the US and Canada which could provide some communications, (of course, they might get federalized in the event of a major war...there are laws to that effect).
 
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