Sir John Valentine Carden Survives. Part 2.

It doesn't set off any alarms in any plagiarism checker.
Which suggests to me a good level of rewriting from the original source(s). AIUI an academic essay would have to identify these in footnotes (or endnotes in some conventions) where appropriate. But I presume that is unnecessary in the Forum with this degree of own content?
 
Which suggests to me a good level of rewriting from the original source(s). AIUI an academic essay would have to identify these in footnotes (or endnotes in some conventions) where appropriate. But I presume that is unnecessary in the Forum with this degree of own content?
Oh Yes, you miss a reference or a source and not only will your work get rejected but it had been known for students to be disciplined by having to retake a module or even a whole year and in extreme cases they have been expelled.
When preparing, half of your time is spent on research, you have to back up your work with references.
 
Oh Yes, you miss a reference or a source and not only will your work get rejected but it had been known for students to be disciplined by having to retake a module or even a whole year and in extreme cases they have been expelled.
When preparing, half of your time is spent on research, you have to back up your work with references.
Yeah, after retirement I did an Open University degree, primarily in history. And then part 1 of an MA . (started the second part but couldn't find primary sources due to pandemic closures.)

I know plagiarism is discouraged very severally here* so was wondering how much a personal summary of several sources needed them to be credited.

* Quite rightly in my irrelevant view.
 
Same here OU with a focus on 20th centaury political and military history. I have been a prolific collector of good political/military books for years which did take up the majority of the shelve space around the house, much to annoyance of my other half. Now that our children have grown up and left home, I have turned the smallest bedroom in to a office/ library. She still mutters "Haven't you got enough books!" when I buy a new book. Nothing like sitting down with a good book and mug of hot tea.

As an example the small bit about the Kenpai-tai was referenced with four sources works, two of which I have copies of.
 
Last edited:

Garrison

Donor
You should look into writing professionally it's pretty good.

True. Liberating SE Asia is one thing but going any further North than southern China is probably a bad idea until the IJN is annihilated. Beyond SOE it's probably not a good idea even then as the majority of the IJA is in China and while crap, quantity has a power all of its own.
Ideally you get the Chinese Nationalists to do the heavy lifting.
 
Same here OU with a focus on 20th centaury political and military history. I have been a prolific collector of good political/military books for years which did take up the majority of the shelve space around the house, much to annoyance of my other half. Now that our children have grown up and left home, I have turned the smallest bedroom in to a office/ library. She still mutters "Haven't you got enough books!" when I buy a new book. Nothing like sitting down with a good book and mug of hot tea.

As an example the small bit about the Kenpai-tai was referenced with four sources works, two of which I have copies of.
If you don't have Churchill's WW2 memoirs, the answer is that no, you do not have enough books yet, from a WW2 completionist point of view.... :D
I can also recommend the collection Churchill by his Contemporaries (edited by Charles Eade) if you can find a copy relatively cheap - if for no other reason than the short George Bernard Shaw contribution absolutely dripping with acid about the British Party System and European politics of the early 20th century. (E.G. '...The Kaiser, Lenin, Ataturk, Reza Khan, Mussolini and Hitler were kicking parliaments into the gutter and making the revolutionary social changes attributed to God in the Magnificat.
Our hearts were bursting with our desire for rulers who could be depended on to do nothing but call for their pipes and call for their pots and call for their fiddlers three...')
 
Last edited:
If you don't have Churchill's WW2 memoirs, the answer is that no, you do not have enough books yet, from a WW2 completionist point of view.... :D
I can also recommend the collection Churchill by his Contemporaries (edited by Charles Eade) if you can find a copy relatively cheap - if for no other reason than the short George Bernard Shaw contribution absolutely dripping with acid about the British Party System and European politics of the early 20th century. (E.G. '...The Kaiser, Lenin, Ataturk, Reza Khan, Mussolini and Hitler were kicking parliaments into the gutter and making the revolutionary social changes attributed to God in the Magnificat.
Our hearts were bursting with our desire for rulers who could be depended on to do nothing but call for their pipes and call for their pots and call for their fiddlers three...')
The thing with George Bernard Shaw very much like Ernes Hemingway, they both had a chip on their shoulders about certain people and events. While overall good works, you have to take in consideration the time they were written in and contempered works which have shown that certain things they said were either wrong or misleading. A good read is 'Mud, Blood and Poppycock' by Gordon Corrigan.
 

Garrison

Donor
The thing with George Bernard Shaw very much like Ernes Hemingway, they both had a chip on their shoulders about certain people and events. While overall good works, you have to take in consideration the time they were written in and contempered works which have shown that certain things they said were either wrong or misleading. A good read is 'Mud, Blood and Poppycock' by Gordon Corrigan.
That is a very good book on WWI, and I'm sure you've read Gary Sheffield's 'Forgotten Victory'.
 

Ramp-Rat

Monthly Donor
Six, SOE and the OSS, ITTL.



Before looking at the effect that the changes ITTL will have on the operations of the above will have, best that we define what their roles were in reality. As apposed to the fantasy that most people who get their information from Hollywood, Pinewood or airport book racks. MI6 or to give it its true name, SIS the Secret Intelligence Service is the oldest of the three, and its primary role is to gather intelligence/information on his/her majesties enemies and friends. SOE the Special Operations Executive, was set up during the war at the instigation of Winston Churchill, and incorporated Section D of SIS whose remit had been to investigate the potential for sabotage in enemy territory. It’s task was To Set Europe Ablaze, which was very incompatible with the tasks of ether MI6 or MI9, who both required the minimum of activity to carry out their tasks. And the conflicts between these services was at times intense, and the actions of SOE could and did seriously affect the work of the other two. The American OSS Office of Strategic Services , or Oh So Social as it was known to those in the know, the forerunner of today’s CIA, was a combination of SIS and SOE, carrying out both functions. Unfortunately this brought with it the conflicting requirements of an intelligent gathering service and a super special forces unit, hence why they are often called cowboys by the more mature and established intelligence agencies. Before we proceed to the effects that events OTTL might have had on the operations of the various Allied intelligence agencies, there is one vital point to take into consideration. That is the profound differences between the conduct of intelligence/sabotage operations in Europe, the Middle East, and the Far East Pacific region.

In Europe the British and to a lesser extent the Americans, could in addition to their own mixed race’ citizens, ie British father and Dutch mother, or French father and British mother. Or predominately in the American case, the first generation sons and daughters of recent immigrants, especially among their Jewish population and Greek/Italian communities. The British also had access to the large number of refugees through their various ‘Free’ government and their own national intelligence services. Such agents provided with the relevant documents were essentially free to roam around Europe at will, and could finance their operations by raising a lone with a local bank, guaranteed by London. If you want to run an intelligence operation, escape line, or sabotage/terrorist operation, the one thing that you need lots of is money. And the ability to approach senior banker business man and arrange a loan in the local currency, was a huge advantage. He provided you with a code word/phrases, which London then arranged at an agreed time was broadcast on the BBC. The principal advantage that the various agencies will enjoy ITTL, is that with the significant better performance of the British in the early years, more people will be inclined to offer their services, and take part in the clandestine activities against the Germans. No doubt mistakes such as happened in our TL, will take place, but given the greater participation, the overall value of the various attempts, will produce better results.

However once you are outside Europe, the ability to insert a British/American intelligence asset decreases significantly. Even with the best paperwork in the world, no Britton or American could operate in any Japanese controlled territory with impunity. Even a Japanese American would stand out like a sore thumb, and would be obvious to even, but the most dim whited Japanese official. So here as in the Middle East, the overwhelming majority of operations behind enemy lines, are going to have to be conducted by special forces. In the Middle East, this was a combination of the LRDG, who were the MI6 equivalent whose job was primarily to watch and report, and the SAS the SOE equivalent whose job was to do and take action. Given the very sparse population of the region, and the lack of large urban centres, this was the only possible solution. In the Far East especially Malaya, the British have formed two military units, one that is a coalition of experienced local civilians, plantation owners, mine owners/managers etc, who in combination with a military component. Are working to establish contact with the civilian communities behind the lines, and report back information both military and civilian to the military command and civilian authorities, they are trying to avoid any contact with the Japanese, or taking direct action against the Japanese. While the other group which is predominately military in composition, aims to carry out acts that aid the military by disrupting the rear areas of the Japanese forces, and complying them to deploy vital troops in protecting their supply lines. And this system will continue once the British are outside of their own territory, as they will find locals or in the case of FIC, French men who are amenable to cooperating with the British forces.

There because of the local situation, isn’t going to be much intelligence gathering in the Pacific region, other than off the coast watchers type, ie a European officer with ether local or British/American military support. You might on some of the larger islands, be able to use an established local trader, normally Chinese to gather information in a town or city, but other than that it’s a case of watching from afar and reporting back to HQ. The Philippines are the area where we might see the biggest difference, as the various changes that are happening, are going to cause significant modifications to the TL. IOTL, once his imperial majesty the MacArthur had been evacuated and the surrender announced, a local resistance movement developed, with large numbers of American expatriates hiding in the jungle, and regular and reservist officers refusing to surrender, and they too decanting into the jungle. However according to his Majesty, as he hadn’t established this resistance, it didn’t exist, nor was he going to allow the OSS to operate on his turf. ITTL, MacArthur having been evacuated, very much under a cloud, and not appointed SAC South West Pacific, as it is doubtful that this command will be created. There will be a significant time when the nascent resistance movement in the Philippines, will be in contact with both the American high command and the British high command. British and American submarines will be running trained special forces personnel along with essential supplies into the Philippines, and evacuating civilians who have managed to avoid capture. By the time that MacArthur is given command of the invasion force to relieve the Philippines, a well established, effective and supported resistance force will have been established, and the OSS will have a presence that he will have to take notice of. The OSS which had its own successful propaganda service, will have established with the American people its role in the Philippines, and Doug will not be able to ignore it. Thus we could see some very different results, with the resistance playing a much greater role in the liberation of the Philippines, and the subsequent story of this operation.

RR.
 
All good points @Ramp-Rat , although with luck Duck out Doug will have done so badly ITTL (or rather been recognised as having done badly due to compare and contrast) that he's kicked sideways into a non combat slot (to many friends for anything else to happen). Then someone competent and prepared to work with the resistance fairly can be appointed to run the liberation.

Meanwhile the Japanese have a serious problem with special forces showing up on their coasts and a bleeding sore as the Anglo-French forces grind them back to the southern Chinese border and then the Nationalist's rise. With even better luck Mao gets crushed somewhere in the middle.
 
I can't remember where I read/saw it but apparently one of the key reasons that the Japense soliders suffered logistically was the fact that the vast majority of their food ration was made up of white rice which is basically deviod of any useful nutrients/minerals that a active soldier would need. So they would be shipped kilograms of rice, as it was easy to ship, especially I suppose, on the very limited amount of shipping that the Imperial Navy lowered itself to escort for the Army, and then recieved very little to supplement it in the form of vegetables or meat especially if they couldn't forage or requisistion/steal it from the local population.

This would have meant that they would have been malnutritioned in any theater where they didn't have access to a local farming population or town/city with stores, and probably things like scuvy and other diseases like it would have set in on the frontlines. I don't know how much that would have affected fighting here, but seeing as the whole Japense force in malaya/thailand is essentially cut off form effective logistical support the affects would have probably been started to be seen.
 
I can't remember where I read/saw it but apparently one of the key reasons that the Japense soliders suffered logistically was the fact that the vast majority of their food ration was made up of white rice which is basically deviod of any useful nutrients/minerals that a active soldier would need. So they would be shipped kilograms of rice, as it was easy to ship, especially I suppose, on the very limited amount of shipping that the Imperial Navy lowered itself to escort for the Army, and then recieved very little to supplement it in the form of vegetables or meat especially if they couldn't forage or requisistion/steal it from the local population.

This would have meant that they would have been malnutritioned in any theater where they didn't have access to a local farming population or town/city with stores, and probably things like scuvy and other diseases like it would have set in on the frontlines. I don't know how much that would have affected fighting here, but seeing as the whole Japense force in malaya/thailand is essentially cut off form effective logistical support the affects would have probably been started to be seen.
Japanese military diet was rice and tinned fish, Japan had one of the largest fishing fleets in the Pacific during this time. While these two items are easy to ship, the issue was the Japanese logistical system prioritised ammunition. Their principle bulk transport was ship to train then, from there it was horse/oxen and cart, bicycle and porters who were usually press ganged. So unit had to forage which inevitably meant taking food from the local population. Who quickly learned to hide food away.
 

Ramp-Rat

Monthly Donor
All good points @Ramp-Rat , although with luck Duck out Doug will have done so badly ITTL (or rather been recognised as having done badly due to compare and contrast) that he's kicked sideways into a non combat slot (to many friends for anything else to happen). Then someone competent and prepared to work with the resistance fairly can be appointed to run the liberation.

Meanwhile the Japanese have a serious problem with special forces showing up on their coasts and a bleeding sore as the Anglo-French forces grind them back to the southern Chinese border and then the Nationalist's rise. With even better luck Mao gets crushed somewhere in the middle.
Sir being strictly pedantic, I doubt that British, French or even Dutch special forces will be turning up on the Japanese coast anytime soon. And by the time that the Allies are in a position to land special forces on Japan, the overwhelming majority will be Americans, with just a few British involved. However the landing of special forces and various intelligence gathering missions on the coast of Thailand and French Indochina, should begin before the end of 1942, to gather much needed information on the situation in these regions, and to sever the coastal railway in FIC.

RR.
 
Sir being strictly pedantic, I doubt that British, French or even Dutch special forces will be turning up on the Japanese coast anytime soon. And by the time that the Allies are in a position to land special forces on Japan, the overwhelming majority will be Americans, with just a few British involved. However the landing of special forces and various intelligence gathering missions on the coast of Thailand and French Indochina, should begin before the end of 1942, to gather much needed information on the situation in these regions, and to sever the coastal railway in FIC.

RR.
I more meant the occupied areas (Korea, China, possibly Taiwan) obviously Japan proper isn't happening but setting their Empire ablaze should give the IJA all kinds of extra trouble it needs like a hole in the head. Also gives a slim chance that as the IJA implodes the Allies might be able to seize some areas that would otherwise have gone Communist.
 
I don't think the Free French have much presence in Asia throughout the War both OTL and ITTL. TBH right now they are probably more focused on trying to get the French African and Caribbean colonies to join them like right now they probably really want Dakar with the gold reserves
 
And so eventually rationing was abolished, however the process by which it was done, meant that this was a disaster. Had Britain from 1946, slowly increased the ration in stages as more food became available, and at the same time reduced the various regulations on food production, the results would have in my opinion been far better.

RR.

What was the OTL process?
 

Ramp-Rat

Monthly Donor
What was the OTL process?
The government announced that on such and such day rationing of what ever would end, this normally caused it to be reimposed as the goods in question were rapidly sold out. Simple rule if you want to abolish rationing, slowly rase the amount available on ration, until the amount is equal or exceeds the amount that people would normally buy.
 
I don't think the Free French have much presence in Asia throughout the War both OTL and ITTL. TBH right now they are probably more focused on trying to get the French African and Caribbean colonies to join them like right now they probably really want Dakar with the gold reserves
One wonders how loyal the Indochina administration is? Paris after all is very far away and while the Japanese are currently in occupation it should quickly become clear the Allies will be knocking at the door before very long. At that point do you listen to Petain or throw in with the Allies (which would provide them with a quick route to the Southern Chinese border and - once the Japanese are fully cleared out- the use of Cam Ranh bay to ship in supplies for the Nationalists)?
 
The government announced that on such and such day rationing of what ever would end, this normally caused it to be reimposed as the goods in question were rapidly sold out. Simple rule if you want to abolish rationing, slowly rase the amount available on ration, until the amount is equal or exceeds the amount that people would normally buy.

A clear case of fuckwititus
 
Top