the colonization of the new world occurs in the same way, uk with the 13 colonies, portugal with brazil, spain with a mega empire, france losing its colonies etc. Basically the colonies don't change when with some fights and a little luck we could have for example the colonization of Brazil by France (the country tried to colonize the area several times) or a Canada Portugal (Portugal tried to colonize North America before colonizing with force Brazil).
What is a common thing or trope that always seem to happen?
- Thread starter Viking25
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I think it's mainly motivated by 2 camps(this and Islam):
The first is obviously people that believe in the religion and are unable or unwilling to entertain objective and impartial history.
The second is people that seem to believe in some sort of ideological darwinism were ideologies that are "superior" for whatever reason will always prevail and triumph over others, for some reason many people postulate that monotheistic religions are superior and thus judaism or some offshoot will inevitably take over other religions regardless of what happens in the political sphere.
Another idea that thies to this second opinion is the quasi-marxist idea that similar material or political conditions will ALWAYS produce similar ideologies.
I think both position are highly non-sensical and indefensible and I think oftentimes the latter opinion is used to mask the former one, but I'm highly opinionated on the subject as well.
Maybe some TLs which claim to focus on the entire era but only really talk about the wealthy elite. I do this but I never claim to be discussing the common people who lived back then.
I also think it is because of the aggressiveness that Abrahamic religions have. Both Christian and Islam have at their core that to save people you have to convert them so wars and persecutions against other religions are something moral. You are literally saving these people from hell, there is nothing more moral than keeping people from burning in hell. Only 2 religions that I know of had such fanaticism and conversion strength, Christianity and Islam. The fact that they are monotheists also helps, being easier to organize things in the holy book than having +20 more gods. Catholicism for example achieves greater local interaction with saints. (both also have a martial culture involving them)
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I think it's due to the fact that it was basically the same thing until industrialization. A farm, for example, does not change much over the centuries.
it does change, but it's not the most interesting thing to read for most people.
danteheadman
Banned
I think you're right, with one caveat: similar material and political conditions usually produce similar ideologies. That's the whole point of making realistic PODs: they change the material and political circumstances so that different outcomes can arise.
That's lazy thinking. Most religious, philosophical, and political ideologies look nothing like Christianity. There is so much potential ground to cover!
I want to see more diverse TLs. I want to read about a Roman Empire that doubles down on the god-king concept from Egyptian theology that the early Caesars utilized, creating an Imperial Cult that claims the Emperor / Empress is a living deity and the physical embodiment of Philosophy. I want to read about how averting the destruction of the Second Temple causes the Empire to embrace Mahayana Buddhism. I want to read about Julius Caesar choosing not to demonize the Celts, which enables the spread of the Druidic priestly class across Roman Europe. I want to read plausibly weird TLs that start with small changes that impact the West in huge ways!
That's I think the most true. Christian and Muslim writers (as well as post-Christian and -Muslim writers) tend to have this concept bleed into their writing, so they imagine that different ideologies also would (or should) have a similar attitude towards ideological pluralism.
Yes i'm aware and Polish nationalists spent to gain freedom and rebuild it, this idea failed as you can imagine but it does mean you can have thanks to PODs dozens of different Polish states all over the central Europe depending on where the chips fall.
That actually predates Marxism I believe and used to be the idea for Anthropology of religion.
Idea was religions evolved over time from animism to polytheism then to monotheism which they felt was the most advanced. The school has since revised it's idea and the bias of it's foundation for a more broader outlook.
You reminded me of a particularly atrocious series of books that I had the misfortune to read and in which the authors did that a lot. All its protagonists were members of the rich and ennobled elite but you were supposed to believe that they were talking about injustices and issues that affect us all.
Tax: The use in PODs of "because material conditions" as a short synonym for "because I feel like it". It just makes you look pedantic.
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the best story is with a mix of the different classes. So we have the upper class as a major focus due to its importance, but with an environment of the middle and lower classes
And also we can see things that we couldnt see if only use the upper class perspective
mickeymouse
Donor
People forgetting that Africa, South America, and Southeast Asia exist until it’s time to give their European country of choice a billion colonial possessions. Would love to see more TLs centered in those continents and regions!
basically the core of the story is about the upper class, but there are parts of the story of the middle and lower class.
ahmedali
Banned
Religion is a really sensitive thing
Therefore, it is preferable to keep anything about religion unchanged
That sounds interesting. Maybe if the plots even overlap/parallel...
I think that one of major reason for lack for Africa/South America/Southeast Africa is that there is quiet few of knowledge about these regions and most people don't know anything or very few. It is just easier write about Europe or colonial/post revolution North America. Even India, China and Middle East are easier ones.