Nobunaga’s Ambition Realized: Dawn of a New Rising Sun

[Ambassador Huntsman]

Chapter 13: Missionaries and Slavers​

Nagasaki (長崎) was one of the ports that came under the control of an Azuchi-appointed magistrate. In a peculiar situation, however, he negotiated the transfer of power from Portuguese missionaries rather than a local daimyo, as the port had been ceded to the Jesuits in 1581 by Oumura Sumitada. The process took a bit longer compared to other ports but with the mediation of Takayama Ukon (高山右近), a “Kirishitan” daimyo from Settsu province (摂津国) with close relations with the Jesuits in the Kinki region (近畿地方) Nagasaki came under the direct control of Azuchi with special privileges and exemptions for the Jesuits and the Portuguese in general by the middle of 1585 and Christianity becoming legalized throughout the entire realm.

This arrangement would not last long due to an unsettling discovery made by Nagasaki’s new magistrate, Hori Hidemasa (堀秀政). Largely undiscovered outside of Kyushu behind the enormous influence and wealth the Jesuits had grown due to the support of the various Kirishitan daimyo in Kyushu was the Portuguese slave trade of Japanese commoners to China, Southeast Japan, and even all the way to Portugal’s capital of Lisbon. Early reports among the Portuguese merchants and missionaries of the trade emerged in the form of complaints among the missionaries as early as 1555, with even King Sebastian of Portugal outlawing the slave trade in case it disrupted the missionaries’ efforts. However, his order fell on deaf ears and the trade continued, with even the missionaries coming to tolerate the slave trade without complaint.​

Portuguese ship, a commonplace sight in Nagasaki in the late 16th century
​

Upon the first witnessed instances of the slavers’ activities, Hidemasa ordered an immediate crackdown on the activity and the incriminated merchants were arrested and detained, with Hidemasa sending a messenger back to Azuchi. Although there was universal disgust and condemnation of the slave trade among the councilors in Azuchi, there were disagreements on how to respond, ranging from a simple ban on the slave trade to a wholesale crackdown on Christianity, the latter more traditional-minded vassals like Akechi Mitsuhide generally supported. Even the imperial court weighed in, siding with Mitsuhide as in their eyes a barbaric, invasive faith was the cause and therefore needed to be purged. They already had serious objections to Nobunaga’s religious indifference and his close relations with the Jesuits for commercial purposes.

Nobunaga’s divided feelings between preserving good relations with the Portuguese and maintaining absolute sovereignty and authority ultimately led to the Southern Barbarian Control Decree (南蛮規制令) in 1586, which abolished the Kyushu slave trade, rescinded the special privileges and exemptions in Nagasaki, confiscated much of the Jesuits’ landholdings in Kyushu, and barred Kirishitan daimyo from engaging in the forced conversion of non-Christians. Additionally, the Azuchi navy would be granted the absolute right to stop any ships under suspicion of illegally participating in the slave trade. As for the detained slavers, they were publicly burned alive on the harbor for all to see, with their charred corpses displayed for several days as a warning.

While effective in the short term, the decree would chill relations between Nobunaga and not only the Jesuits and Portuguese but also the imperial court permanently. The legality of the missionaries’ activities had remained intact for the most part, but their influence curbed significantly to the point where Gaspar Coelho, the Superior of the Jesuit mission in Japan, felt threatened and unsuccessfully laid plans to arm Kirishitan daimyo against Nobunaga; he was later removed by other Jesuits and would leave Japan for good, dying in 1590 [1]. Nevertheless, his disapproving feelings were certainly shared by his missionary peers. Meanwhile, the more court-aligned voices felt ever more that Azuchi was too soft and forgiving towards Europeans at the expense of Japan’s sovereignty and traditional culture and values. This dissatisfaction on both sides would sow the seeds for future distrust and conflict after Nobunaga’s time.​

Portrait of Gaspar Coelho
​

These events would also shift the balance of power in Kyushu towards the Shimazu clan, the most powerful non-Kirishitan daimyo on the island. Sourin, who himself was heavily interrogated over the discovery of the slave trade, would pass away in 1587, and Shimazu Yoshihisa (島津義久) would become a councilor in the Azuchi government, sharply decreasing the influence of Kirishitan daimyo in the central government for the time being.​

[1]: Happened IOTL in response to Hideyoshi's 1587 expulsion of Jesuits

 

[Red Angel]

I hope the Dutch actually replace the Portuguese, when they start trading of course, as well have a very good relationship with both Nobunaga and all of Japan, hell the Dutch could have a very good ally in Asia.

 

[Xel]

Damn that was unexpected but very cool, a shame he's getting such critique for it, but I think this was the best call.

 

[BBadolato]

Chapter 11: Red Seals and Iron Plates​

In 1584, Nobunaga introduced a “red seal” system where the central government in Azuchi would issue red-sealed permits to merchants and certain daimyo as licenses for foreign trade. Under this system, Nobunaga could not only control who was trading with whom overseas but also implement measures better targeted at protecting said trade from competing commercial interests. Red seals also served to regulate the presence of non-Japanese merchants in the country, particularly Europeans. In practice, the Oda regime under Nobunaga’s direction issued red seal permits pretty liberally, especially in major ports and harbors under the jurisdiction of an Oda-appointed magistrate, allowing trade between Japan and markets in Southeast Asia, Korea, and beyond to explode in volume and profit even more than where it already was headed.​

17th century red seal permit
​

In the long term, it would have significant effects both within the realm and overseas. Many feudal lords who either lacked a red seal or were inland and therefore had no access to the sea would overtime put resources and energy into developing goods, natural exports, and even local industry as well as interior trading networks to tap into the expanding trade over the next few decades. Meanwhile, the rapid commercial expansion saw an influx of not only many foreigners on Japanese soil but even more Japanese on foreign soil, especially unemployed samurai, many of whom had been displaced by the Oda themselves. Seeing opportunity, they would leave and within 10-15 years, Japanese enclaves slowly emerged in major ports from modern day Bireitou (美麗島) [1] to Ayutthaya while Japanese samurai mercenaries abounded in foreign armies.

At the same time, Nobunaga would also create the foundation of the Japanese navy through the transition of the Oda feudal navy to a specialized and professional institution under Azuchi with nominal jurisdiction throughout the realm in order to safeguard Japan’s growing commercial and maritime interests. In addition to the centuries-old wakou (倭寇) pirates that abounded throughout the seas albeit in declining numbers, independent navies like the Murakami navy had emerged as their own political entities, patrolling inland seas while receiving revenue from trade and tolls that historically even powerful clans like the Ouchi clan (大内氏) had paid.

These autonomous maritime powers were a barrier to an Oda-regulated trade system, so Nobunaga would institute both the Naval Authority Decree (水軍権限令) and the Piracy Stoppage Decree (海賊停止令). The former officially appointed Kuki Yoshitaka as the chief admiral of the new Azuchi navy and gave it the authority to enforce regulations and decrees overseas, patrol shores and coastal waters, and guard ships and ports while the latter not only officially banned piracy but also legally disbanded all independent navies. Chiefly, however, the latter did provide the ability for pirates and independent navies to join and merge into the newly bolstered Azuchi navy. With Yoshitaka, himself formerly a leader of an independent navy and later nicknamed the “Pirate Daimyo”, providing much credibility to the new navy, almost all existing navies opted to merge into the Azuchi navy. Therefore, at the outset, Nobunaga’s new maritime military force was filled with experienced sailors, samurai, and ex-pirates.​

Ceremonial portrait of Kuki Yoshitaka​

Yoshitaka, under the direction of Nobunaga, would expand the construction of “iron ships”, or Tekkou-sen (鉄甲船), iron-plated ships armed with cannons and built with holes to incorporate masses of arquebusiers and rapidly replace older ships with little use beyond being wooden fortresses that mainly saw boarding action and hand-to-hand combat. Tekkou-sen were successfully used, however, at the 2nd Battle of the Mouth of Kizugawa River (第二次木津川口の戦い) in 1578 against the Mouri navy, and afterwards Nobunaga desired their greater usage. Additionally, Yoshitaka would also assign some of his deputies to the study of Portuguese ships and in the long run would even have non-Japanese advisors on naval strategy, training, and composition.

These developments, helped by Nobunaga’s interest in commercial and maritime expansion and Azuchi’s jurisdiction over most major ports, would significantly increase Japanese power overseas and even contribute to domestic economic growth and prosperity in the long term.​

[1] ITTL’s modern day name of Taiwan, similar meaning as Formosa in Portuguese

Okay, so how exactly is Nobunaga able to muster the ability to make a navy when it's still a fleet that a has to be a raised and from sea faring clans of which there are few. If you look at the closest thing Japan had to a 'national' army be it the Mongol or Korean invasions, it was an ad hoc feudal army, not a standing one. A standing navy as it where is out of the question, but if you have multiple clans provide ships that could work, although what do you mean by no independent navies? If your saying clans the like the Kuki and Noshima Murakami basically can't be pirates anymore than that can work, if your saying there can be no navy than the Azuchi navy, then I don't think Nobunaga has the authority to do that, because it's a feudal system. Nobunaga is reliant on those clans to build ships and have capable sailors, and not all of those clans are going to be equal in what they can build or field same with the army. Unless the idea is x clan has the preference to enforce Azuchi naval laws and build ships that come with that.

Also why go to Ezo? The northeast of Japan was the ass end of nowhere, and Shikoku itself was something of a backwater region too. How exactly are you going to get settlers from other people's subjects and move them on technically another lord's lands. Unless that was a something to do chapter. Because Japanese colonization, in this period relies heavily on feudal clans, it's going to be a decentralized enterprise, and creating divisions under other clans can lead to a sort of mini-Sengoku period on the frontiers.

With the Jesuit situation, I think your making a mistake here at least with using this as a precursor to conflict you might be looking for a conflict that could never reasonably come about for a multitude of reasons. First and foremost the Imperial Court would be in little of a position to really complain about this to anyone of note, (Mitsuhide's daughter did convert to Catholicism) and if Azuchi serves in the same vein as Edo did for the Tokugawa, then the Court in Kyoto aren't even real power players. Not that the Imperial Court mattered for a very long period of time, perhaps even before the Ashikaga Shoguns. Emperor Ogimachi also owed a lot to Nobunaga and later Hideyoshi and Ieyasu, and to say nothing of the fact, no one cares enough about the Emperor to restore him to 'power' unless it would be to create another figure or a figurehead under a figurehead.

Even as time goes on the Emperor's influence is still limited and even with the Meiji restoration, the Emperor still had plenty of limits. The last real chance for any kind of true restoration of the Emperor as an independent unfettered political actor not propped up by warlords or later oligarchs ended with the Kenmu restoration, and that branch was replaced with the current branch that exists now.

Second, there wasn't really an idea of traditions and cultures, or at least a universal Japanese one that Catholicism could threaten. Religion wise you had various schools of Buddhism with Shinto elements, that was heavily decentralized and at this point their power bases as military threats at least among some schools and temples are gone. No one is really going to raise a stink of foreign influences ala the lead up to the Boshin War, or at least blame entirely on the foreigners. Catholicism got shafted in Japan, because the Tokugawa didn't trust them to not make, because some of Nobunaga's enemies in the monasteries where exactly as populist as Christianity could be.

The Boshin War was more a conflict by those wronged by the Tokugawa who had a very uneasy house of cards to deal with, because they like the Ashikaga came to power via an alliance than the brute force of Nobunaga, and bargaining of Hideyoshi. Nobunaga's government has the advantage of not being built on shaky foundations of lacking legitimacy like the Toyotomi or individual strength like the Tokugawa, but feudal Japan is still feudal Japan. So that means Nobunaga and the Oda's reach can only go so far, and any peculiars of Nobunaga's government under Nobunaga are far from assured, as Nobutada is surely not going to be the ruthless eccentric his father is.

If I had to say where conflict could emerge, it depends but it might come more from the fact a feudal state can only balance itself out for so long against it's decentralization and perhaps the necessity for it, but that might not happen for anywhere from decades to possibly centuries. Basically it's not going to be a conflict started or even encouraged by the Imperial Court, either sharks are going to smell blood in the water during a period of serious uncertainty, or absolute chaos hits country and things go south.

Three on a minor note I feel your wasting any potential by just throwing the Jesuits to the curb like this, especially when Gaspar Coelho is merely one of many Jesuits. Jesuit tactics tended to change, or vary from one another. Alessandro Valignano in particular emphasized that priest should adopt Japanese habits, clothing and customs. Also this before the Chinese Rites controversy has any chance to go squash the chances of syncretic Catholicism, although it could wildly deviate from what Rome would deem acceptable, to say nothing of what if protestants start to preach in Japan as well.

 

[souvikkundu25140017]

Will there a Buddhist Reformation to challenge christianity?

 

[Ambassador Huntsman]

Okay, so how exactly is Nobunaga able to muster the ability to make a navy when it's still a fleet that a has to be a raised and from sea faring clans of which there are few. If you look at the closest thing Japan had to a 'national' army be it the Mongol or Korean invasions, it was an ad hoc feudal army, not a standing one. A standing navy as it where is out of the question, but if you have multiple clans provide ships that could work, although what do you mean by no independent navies? If your saying clans the like the Kuki and Noshima Murakami basically can't be pirates anymore than that can work, if your saying there can be no navy than the Azuchi navy, then I don't think Nobunaga has the authority to do that, because it's a feudal system. Nobunaga is reliant on those clans to build ships and have capable sailors, and not all of those clans are going to be equal in what they can build or field same with the army. Unless the idea is x clan has the preference to enforce Azuchi naval laws and build ships that come with that.

Also why go to Ezo? The northeast of Japan was the ass end of nowhere, and Shikoku itself was something of a backwater region too. How exactly are you going to get settlers from other people's subjects and move them on technically another lord's lands. Unless that was a something to do chapter. Because Japanese colonization, in this period relies heavily on feudal clans, it's going to be a decentralized enterprise, and creating divisions under other clans can lead to a sort of mini-Sengoku period on the frontiers.

With the Jesuit situation, I think your making a mistake here at least with using this as a precursor to conflict you might be looking for a conflict that could never reasonably come about for a multitude of reasons. First and foremost the Imperial Court would be in little of a position to really complain about this to anyone of note, (Mitsuhide's daughter did convert to Catholicism) and if Azuchi serves in the same vein as Edo did for the Tokugawa, then the Court in Kyoto aren't even real power players. Not that the Imperial Court mattered for a very long period of time, perhaps even before the Ashikaga Shoguns. Emperor Ogimachi also owed a lot to Nobunaga and later Hideyoshi and Ieyasu, and to say nothing of the fact, no one cares enough about the Emperor to restore him to 'power' unless it would be to create another figure or a figurehead under a figurehead.

Even as time goes on the Emperor's influence is still limited and even with the Meiji restoration, the Emperor still had plenty of limits. The last real chance for any kind of true restoration of the Emperor as an independent unfettered political actor not propped up by warlords or later oligarchs ended with the Kenmu restoration, and that branch was replaced with the current branch that exists now.

Second, there wasn't really an idea of traditions and cultures, or at least a universal Japanese one that Catholicism could threaten. Religion wise you had various schools of Buddhism with Shinto elements, that was heavily decentralized and at this point their power bases as military threats at least among some schools and temples are gone. No one is really going to raise a stink of foreign influences ala the lead up to the Boshin War, or at least blame entirely on the foreigners. Catholicism got shafted in Japan, because the Tokugawa didn't trust them to not make, because some of Nobunaga's enemies in the monasteries where exactly as populist as Christianity could be.

The Boshin War was more a conflict by those wronged by the Tokugawa who had a very uneasy house of cards to deal with, because they like the Ashikaga came to power via an alliance than the brute force of Nobunaga, and bargaining of Hideyoshi. Nobunaga's government has the advantage of not being built on shaky foundations of lacking legitimacy like the Toyotomi or individual strength like the Tokugawa, but feudal Japan is still feudal Japan. So that means Nobunaga and the Oda's reach can only go so far, and any peculiars of Nobunaga's government under Nobunaga are far from assured, as Nobutada is surely not going to be the ruthless eccentric his father is.

If I had to say where conflict could emerge, it depends but it might come more from the fact a feudal state can only balance itself out for so long against it's decentralization and perhaps the necessity for it, but that might not happen for anywhere from decades to possibly centuries. Basically it's not going to be a conflict started or even encouraged by the Imperial Court, either sharks are going to smell blood in the water during a period of serious uncertainty, or absolute chaos hits country and things go south.

Three on a minor note I feel your wasting any potential by just throwing the Jesuits to the curb like this, especially when Gaspar Coelho is merely one of many Jesuits. Jesuit tactics tended to change, or vary from one another. Alessandro Valignano in particular emphasized that priest should adopt Japanese habits, clothing and customs. Also this before the Chinese Rites controversy has any chance to go squash the chances of syncretic Catholicism, although it could wildly deviate from what Rome would deem acceptable, to say nothing of what if protestants start to preach in Japan as well.

The Azuchi navy is initially composed of the original Oda navy and a lot of the indepenent navies (like the Murakami) and pirates who join it. While it's certainly not a national navy in the traditional sense, it still carries extensive jurisdiction and authority throughout the realm derived from the authority of the daijo-daijin. Many of the more autonomous daimyo have their own navies, albeit the Azuchi navy is ahead technologically and financially. It's a standing navy based on having extensive peacetime duties heavly focused on protecting Nobunaga's expansionary goals in the maritime and commercial sectors as well and not being a traditional samurai institution due to the historical military history and nature of pirates and independent navies like the Murakami.

As for Ezo, as of now there's no interest in actively colonizing the north at all, like you might see the Kakizaki clan gradually extend a bit north but that's about it for now. Nobunaga is more interested in the natural resources and any commercial interests, as limited as they may be right now and mainly desires an outpost from which to project and operate those interests.

In regards to the imperial court presenting their opinion, much of what they refer to when they talk about traditional values is also layered upon Nobunaga's history of having little respect for the emperor's authority and any customs (in 1582, he actually was offered the Sadaijin title, he didn't accept it because he wanted the emperor to abdicate in return and that wasn't gonna happen) and negative sentiment against his previous interactions with Buddhist temples that upset their sensibilities. It wasn't the emperor though who was intervening, it was more like the nobility like Kajuuji Harutoyo and former imperial regent Konoe Sakihisa that directly spoke to him and possibly presented the emperor's "opinion".

Also, maybe I should've worded it differently, but conflict as I mentioned is more metaphorical ie diplomatic or military, if any military conflict arises Christianity could be a direct factor or the approach to dealing with the slave trade creates a ripple variable that triggers something not directly influenced by the presence of a less restricted faith.

Finally, the Jesuits aren't really thrown to the curb, if anything compared to IOTL they're getting a significantly better deal. However, they still lose significant influence and wealth and their conversion efforts are gonna take a hit in the aftermath of the slave trade, and certainly the Jesuits aren't happy that they are kinda being punished and fear that future reprisal might come around. For sure though, Christianity in Japan is gonna go down a unique path although this won't start fully happening for a couple years.
​

Will there a Buddhist Reformation to challenge christianity?

Very unlikely, the Reformation happened in response to the establishment faith corrupting, and while Christianity doesn't become illegal in 1587, it loses some credibility as an outsider faith due to the suppression of the Portuguese slave trade.

 

[Metempsychosis]

Very unlikely, the Reformation happened in response to the establishment faith corrupting, and while Christianity doesn't become illegal in 1587, it loses some credibility as an outsider faith due to the suppression of the Portuguese slave trade.

On the other hand, consider the possible importation of Buddhist scriptures straight from India causing a new kind of 'Great Awakening' among the established Buddhist temples, rising to the challenge of not only Catholicism but all foreign religions they will encounter out there, like Islam and Hinduism. And that latter one might even inspire Shinto temples with Vedantin ideas as opposed to the traditional Buddhism.

 

[Ambassador Huntsman]

Things to note before going into this timeline:

1. As this is a Japan-centric timeline, all Japanese names will be written in the traditional "last name, first name" format.
2. Kanji iterations of terms and names will be inserted alongside the English writing the first time it's introduced.

Enjoy!!

Intro​

In 1582, Japan was on the cusp of unification and a new era of unprecedented prosperity and for the first time ever, prestige, power, and even expansion beyond its immediate borders. All of this would be initiated by one man: Oda Nobunaga (織田信長).

Born as the first son of a small daimyo in Owari province (尾張国), Nobunaga would embark upon years of rapid expansion under the banner of “Tenka Fubu” (天下布武), overthrowing the shogunate and establishing a new capital in Azuchi (安土) in Oumi province (近江国). Fueling this often brutal quest was expanding trade and new contact with the Portuguese, which brought in goods, especially guns and gunpowder. Nobunaga’s measures towards opening up and patronizing trade facilitated the growing faith of Christianity in his domain.

This story will see how Nobunaga successfully united the entirety of Japan under the hegemony of the Oda clan and how he and future rulers of Japan would forge their realm into a maritime military and economic power in the East.​

​

To everyone who has been dutifully following the timeline so far, I just added this sweet new title card for it. Enjoy, and hope ya'll are enjoying the story, much much more to come through this week!!

 

[Aluma]

Its beautiful!

 

[Ambassador Huntsman]

Daimyo in Kyushu, Chugoku, and Shikoku in 1587​

Per request, I'll be covering which daimyos control what and where. Here are the Kyushu, Chugoku, and Shikoku regions:


Kyushu:

Green: Shimazu Yoshihisa (島津義久): 1533-
Purple: Otomo Yoshimune (大友義統): 1558-
Brown: Aso Koremitsu (阿蘇惟光): 1582-
Orange: Arima Harunobu (有馬晴信): 1567-
Lavender: Omura Yoshiaki (大村喜前): 1569-
Grey: Ryuzōji Takanobu (龍造寺隆信): 1529-
Maroon: Matsura Takanobu (松浦隆信): 1529-

Chugoku:

Light Orange: Mōri Terumoto (毛利輝元) 1553-
Salmon: Oda Nagamasu (織田長益) 1548-
Forest Green: Amago Yoshihisa (尼子義久) 1540-
Emerald Green: Horio Yoshiharu (堀尾吉晴) 1542-
Lime: Nanjou Mototsugu (南条元続) 1549-
Purple: Mashita Nagamori (増田長盛) 1545-
Brown: Miyabe Keijun (宮部継潤) 1528-
Grey: Ukita Nobuie (宇喜多信家) 1573-
Pink: Hachisuka Iemasa (蜂須賀家政) 1558-
Cobalt: Tahara Chikaie (田原親家) 1561-
Orange: Kuroda Yoshitaka (黒田孝高) 1546-
Beige: Minor daimyo, castle lords

Shikoku:

Brown: Chosokabe Nobuchika (長宗我部信親) 1565-
Orange: Kawano Michinaga (河野通長) 1576- [1]
Grey: Saionji Kinhiro (西園寺公広) 1537-
Dark purple: Miyoshi Nobutaka (三好信孝) 1558- [2]
Lavender: Sogo Masayasu (十河存保) 1554- [3]
​

[1]: ITTL's Kono Michinori (河野通軌)
[2]: Salmon stripes indicating Miyoshi Nobutaka being an Oda clan member by blood as Nobunaga's son
[3]: After Miyoshi Yasunaga's death in 1585, Awa province was split between Nobutaka and Masayasu.

 

[Sol Zagato]

>Chugoku
For a moment there I thought Japan had sprouted another island.

 

[theg*ddam*hoi2fan]

I’ve just got caught up with this…excellent…

 

[BBadolato]

Chapter 14 Part 1: Daimyo in Kyushu, Chugoku, and Shikoku in 1587​

Per request, I'll be covering which daimyos control what and where. Here are the Kyushu, Chugoku, and Shikoku regions:


Kyushu:

Green: Shimazu Yoshihisa (島津義久): 1533-
Purple: Otomo Yoshimune (大友義統): 1558-
Brown: Aso Koremitsu (阿蘇惟光): 1582-
Orange: Arima Harunobu (有馬晴信): 1567-
Lavender: Omura Yoshiaki (大村喜前): 1569-
Grey: Ryuzouji Takanobu (龍造寺隆信): 1529-
Maroon: Matsura Takanobu (松浦隆信): 1529-

Chugoku:

Light Orange: Mouri Terumoto (毛利輝元) 1553-
Salmon: Oda Nagamasu (織田長益) 1548-
Forest Green: Amago Yoshihisa (尼子義久) 1540-
Emerald Green: Horio Yoshiharu (堀尾吉晴) 1542-
Lime: Nanjou Mototsugu (南条元続) 1549-
Purple: Mashita Nagamori (増田長盛) 1545-
Brown: Miyabe Keijun (宮部継潤) 1528-
Grey: Ukita Nobuie (宇喜多信家) 1573-
Pink: Hachisuka Iemasa (蜂須賀家政) 1558-
Cobalt: Tahara Chikaie (田原親家) 1561-
Orange: Kuroda Yoshitaka (黒田孝高) 1546-
Beige: Minor daimyo, castle lords

Shikoku:

Brown: Chosokabe Nobuchika (長宗我部信親) 1565-
Orange: Kono Michinaga (河野通長) 1576- [1]
Grey: Saionji Kinhiro (西園寺公広) 1537-
Dark purple: Miyoshi Nobutaka (三好信孝) 1558- [2]
Lavender: Sogo Masayasu (十河存保) 1554- [3]
​

[1]: ITTL's Kono Michinori (河野通軌)
[2]: Salmon stripes indicating Miyoshi Nobutaka being an Oda clan member by blood as Nobunaga's son
[3]: After Miyoshi Yasunaga's death in 1585, Awa province was split between Nobutaka and Masayasu.

Okay what's up with Miyoshi Nobutaka controlling half of Sanuki? IIRC That was generally Sogo territory even if the Sogo were a branch of the Miyoshi. I think you could or should change Kono Michinaga, I don't believe that fits with the usual precedent of adopting kanji from another person. Usually it would the kanji most associated and passed through the clan, in the case the Oda the kanji would be Nobu. To give another example, Takeda Katsuyori was installed as head of his mother's clan the Suwa, whose previous head was Suwa Yorishige. However the main kanji of the Takeda Clan was Nobu, Shingen was known as Harunobu, his father was Nobutora, and three brother Nobushige, Nobuzane, and Nobukado. Long story short, Michinaga could be known as Michinobu, or Nobumichi

Also as an aesthetic recommendation I would try and keep province names consistent across maps if you can. Shikoku doesn't have any and Kyushu doesn't have the kanji for province. Also the Dark Purple with Salmon seems kind of unsightly, I think you could keep the color dark purple and still keep a note to explain the main branch of the Miyoshi now are Oda by blood, or if you want a combination color maybe go with amethyst?

Also, god have mercy on your soul if your doing Dewa and Mutsu like this too, it like's a map of every constitute state of the HRE, it exists only to go spit on the idea of sane and sensible borders. Also don't be afraid to use Nobunaga's ambition for some trying to get a good sense of who ruled where, because sometimes you really do have no other source. I do think there is one amazing map floating around, that is very detailed but it's all in Japanese.

 

[Aluma]

>Chugoku
For a moment there I thought Japan had sprouted another island.

Nobunaga is just that powerful

 

[Ambassador Huntsman]

Okay what's up with Miyoshi Nobutaka controlling half of Sanuki? IIRC That was generally Sogo territory even if the Sogo were a branch of the Miyoshi. I think you could or should change Kono Michinaga, I don't believe that fits with the usual precedent of adopting kanji from another person. Usually it would the kanji most associated and passed through the clan, in the case the Oda the kanji would be Nobu. To give another example, Takeda Katsuyori was installed as head of his mother's clan the Suwa, whose previous head was Suwa Yorishige. However the main kanji of the Takeda Clan was Nobu, Shingen was known as Harunobu, his father was Nobutora, and three brother Nobushige, Nobuzane, and Nobukado. Long story short, Michinaga could be known as Michinobu, or Nobumichi

Also as an aesthetic recommendation I would try and keep province names consistent across maps if you can. Shikoku doesn't have any and Kyushu doesn't have the kanji for province. Also the Dark Purple with Salmon seems kind of unsightly, I think you could keep the color dark purple and still keep a note to explain the main branch of the Miyoshi now are Oda by blood, or if you want a combination color maybe go with amethyst?

Also, god have mercy on your soul if your doing Dewa and Mutsu like this too, it like's a map of every constitute state of the HRE, it exists only to go spit on the idea of sane and sensible borders. Also don't be afraid to use Nobunaga's ambition for some trying to get a good sense of who ruled where, because sometimes you really do have no other source. I do think there is one amazing map floating around, that is very detailed but it's all in Japanese.

I'll look into the Sogo-Miyoshi situation. Regarding Kono Michinaga, you're identifying a different precedent. When it comes to feudal lords taking up a shogun's kanji IOTL, they would generally take the secondary kanji. Ex: Ashikaga Yoshimitsu (足利義満)-Hosokawa Mitsumoto (細川満元), Ouchi Mitsuhiro (大内満弘), Akamatsu Mitsusuke (赤松満祐). What you're referring is generally the practice within a clan, although even then it varies. Ex: Tokugawa Iemitsu (徳川家光)-Ietsuna (徳川家綱), Tsunayoshi (徳川綱吉), Tsunashige (徳川綱重).

With the maps, yeahhhhhh it's difficult to find standard ones to use.

For sources and info, fortunately for this timeline I speak, read, and write Japanese pretty fluently so not an issue. That being said, especially with the maps it's a ton of work just to be as accurate as possible because different regions were subjucated at different times and land redistributions and conflicts butterflied into or out of existence also accounting for early or later deaths. Shinano and Kai are super wonky for example because the division of the former Takeda lands completely changed within a couple months because IOTL Nobunaga died and the Tokugawa, Hojo, and the Uesugi clans to an extent started expanding into those provinces and all the Oda vassals were forced out, and it's kinda hard to find a map of the area that's specifically between March and June 1582 and not anytime else in that year.

 

[Quinkana]

So the Oda are not Shoguns. However the full extent of the Kamakura-fu looks problematic enough if things hit the fan to be some kind of power base. Although since Nobunaga has both legitimacy and plenty of heirs, nothing idiotic like the invasion of Korea is going to happen is it, because I kind of question those who think it was Nobunaga's idea in the first place.

If we have anything like a Korean war equivalent it'd be directed at Hokkaido I'd think.

Also considering otl oda nobunaga's grandchild oda hidenobu was Catholic if be becomes dajo Daijin it'd definitely change things.

This tl looks very fun tho!

 

[Ambassador Huntsman]

Daimyo in Kinki, Chubu, Kanto, and Oshu regions in 1587

Kinki region:

Salmon: Oda clan lands
Beige: Misc. castle lords [1]
Lavender with salmon lines: Kitabatake Nobuoki (Oda clan descent) (北畠信意) 1558-
Orange: Kuki Yoshitaka (九鬼嘉隆) 1542-
Maroon: Tsutsui Sadatsugu (筒井定次) 1562-
Emerald green: Nagaoka Fujitaka (長岡藤孝) 1546-
Pink: Hachiya Yoritaka (蜂谷頼隆) 1534-
Brown: Nagakawa Hidemasa (中川秀政) 1568-
Blue: Takayama Ukon (高山右近) 1553-
Cobalt: Ikeda Tsuneoki (池田恒興) 1536-
Purple: Sogo Masayasu (十河存保) 1554-
Gray: Hashiba Hideyoshi (羽柴秀吉) 1537-
Forest green: Akechi Mitsuyoshi (明智光慶) 1569-

Chubu region:

Salmon/lavender with salmon stripes/beige/light orange: Same as Kinki
Green: Tokugawa Ieyasu (徳川家康) 1542-
Blue: Niwa Nagashige (丹羽長重) 1571-
Cobalt: Hojo Ujimasa (北条氏政) 1536-
Red: Anayama Baisetsu (穴山梅雪) 1541-
Pink: Kawajiri Hidenaga (河尻秀長) 1555-
Maroon: Mōri Hideyori (毛利秀頼) 1541-
Yellow: Takigawa Kazutada (滝川一忠) 1553-
Orange: Mori Nagayoshi (森長可) 1558-
Purple: Kiso Yoshimasa (木曽義昌) 1540-
Lime green: Anekouji Nobutsuna (姉小路信綱) 1560-
Light grey: Shibata Katsuie (柴田勝家) 1522-
Dark brown: Maeda Toshiie (前田利家) 1539-
Dark grey: Sassa Narimasa (佐々成政) 1536-
Light brown: Nagao Terukage (長尾輝景) 1537-
Bronze: Honma Yasukage (本間泰景) 1562-
Dark blue: Shibata Shigeie (新発田重家) 1547-

Kanto region:

Salmon: Oda Nagatoshi (織田長利) 1551-
Lavender: Hojo Ujimasa (北条氏政) 1538-
Pink: Satomi Yoshitoshi (里見義利) 1573- [2]
Yellow: Takigawa Kazutada (滝川一忠) 1553-
Forest green: Utsunomiya Kunitsuna (宇都宮国綱) 1568-
Emerald green: Oyama Hidetsuna (小山秀綱) 1529-
Lime green: Sano Ujitada (佐野氏忠) 1556-
Grey: Yuuki Harutomo (結城晴朝) 1534-
Cobalt: Nasu Sukeharu (那須資晴) 1557-
Light Orange: Oda Ujiharu (小田氏治) 1534-
Bold Orange: Satake Yoshishige (佐竹義重) 1547-

Oshu region:

Light orange: Satake Yoshishige (佐竹義重) 1547-
Bronze with dark grey lines: Ashina Morimune (蘆名盛宗) 1568- [2]
Dark grey: Date Terumune (伊達輝宗) 1544-
Light grey: Mogami Yoshimori (最上義守) 1521-
Blue: Nihonmatsu Yoshitsuna (二本松義綱) 1574-
Red: Souma Yoshitane (相馬義胤) 1548-
Orange: Ouzaki Yoshitaka (大崎義隆) 1548-
Dark blue: Kasai Harunobu (葛西晴信) 1534-
Forest green: Sakuma Morimasa (佐久間盛政) 1554- [3]
Pink: Onodera Kagemichi (小野寺景道) 1534-
Yellow: Asari Yorihiro (浅利頼平) 1557-
Maroon: Shiba Akinao (斯波詮直) 1548-
Emerald green: Tozawa Moriyasu (戸沢盛安) 1566-
Light pink: Akita Sanesue (秋田実季) 1576-
Lime green: Tsugaru Tamenobu (津軽為信) 1550-
Purple: Nanbu Nobunao (南部信直) 1546-
Beige: Misc. castle lords​

[1]: Akechi Mitsuhide, Niwa Nagahide, and Hashiba Hideyoshi held castles in northern Oumi province but would ultimately be mandated to give them up in favor of lesser vassals.

[2] ITTL's Satomi Yoshiyasu (里見義康)

[3]: Date Terumune was successful in installing his second son Date Masamichi (伊達政道) as the next head of the Ashina clan ITTL as opposed to Satake Yoshishige’s second son Yoshihiro (蘆名義広), who became clan head IOTL.

[4]: The Daihouji clan was declared extinct as its last head, Daihouji Yoshioki (大宝寺義興), died without an heir. Nobunaga would transfer Sakuma Morimasa to their previous lands from Kaga province (加賀国).​

 

[PolishMagnet]

I remade your map, let me know if there are any errors. I did not include provincial boundaries since I wasn't sure if you needed them or not.

edit: haha I see you posted the other regions. I'll add them another time

 

[GameBawesome]

I remade your map, let me know if there are any errors. I did not include provincial boundaries since I wasn't sure if you needed them or not.

edit: haha I see you posted the other regions. I'll add them another time

Amazing map. However, one problem. I think you got the Mouri Clan and Kuroda mixed up. It should be the other way around

 

[PolishMagnet]

Amazing map. However, one problem. I think you got the Mouri Clan and Kuroda mixed up. It should be the other way around

Thanks, I'll fix it when I add the other regions. The colour key was a bit confusing for some of them.