沒有國民黨就沒有中國, Without the Kuomintang there would be no China, A Republic of China Story

I could also see them giving the Hui Chinese and their former Ma Warlords more freedom and authonomy in the West against Communist Insurgencies and also use Three Principles with Islamic Characteristics not only in Afghanistan but also Persia/ Iran, Iraq the Central Asian Soviet Republics if it has proven it works to drive out the Soviets.
That said, I could see the Ba'athists and Nasserists in the Arab World seeking correspondence with the Kuomintang. Plus I would like to see Saddam and Assad never taking power, instead leaving the Ba'athists under Michel Aflaq and the other ideological-minded people, rather than having the Ba'athists under the rule of these brutal opportunistic despots who dragged Ba'athism through the dirt.

Having done a quick reading of Ba'athism and Nasserism, these Arab Nationalist Ideologies do give me Kuomintang with Arab vibes. Although their reputation isn't exactly the best given how cruel tyrants like Saddam Hussein and Assad usurped power from the original Ba'athists and took over the Ba'ath.
 
Last edited:
At least one band member will visit China, I'll promise you that.
Hope the fans did not fall for this Sinizised album sale look when meeting the original. At least for television, in radio there would be not much problems with the marketing at home, let alone the Beetles finding out:
221126158513.jpg

Can't wait for that chapter, I like the Beatles, unliek my aunt and grandma who hate them with a burning passion, but I don't know why.
 
Last edited:
謝謝!我很高興你喜歡它。隨著 TL 進入 1980 年代,將會有更多的台灣政治人物和名人出現。
If you want make some Taiwanese politicians from OTL appear in next more chapter, you may need to consider one thing:Many Taiwanese politicians or their parents came to Taiwan with the KMT because the KMT lost the civil war, such as James Soong, who came to Taiwan in 1948 because the Communist Party was about to win
 
If you want make some Taiwanese politicians from OTL appear in next more chapter, you may need to consider one thing:Many Taiwanese politicians or their parents came to Taiwan with the KMT because the KMT lost the civil war, such as James Soong, who came to Taiwan in 1948 because the Communist Party was about to win
James Soong will definitely be in this TL. Li Ao is another one I have big plans for. In addition, people born in Taiwan like Lee Tung-hui and Lin Yang-kang will play very important roles later on.
 
In regards to Taiwan, as best as I can tell at the time of the POD, Taiwan had a population of about 6M and all of China was about 550M. (so a little over 1%). Taiwan will be *considerably* less important iTTL, to the point that people even in China may not be that annoyed if an outline of China is shown to indicate the country and *doesn't* include China. Compare iOTL if an outline of France doesn't include Corsica or an outline of Italy doesn't include Sardinia.


The primary question is whether the February 28 (1947) incident happened. There is a Chen Yi mentioned as the governor of Zhejiang and that he didn't implement Land Reform, and yet it does say that Land Reform went more easily on Taiwan. (I'm not sure if *that* Chen Yi is the Chen Yi was iOTL governor of the Island in 1947.)

So the question is how is the national government viewed from Taiwan. (and what level of interest in Taiwanese independence is there?)
 
In regards to Taiwan, as best as I can tell at the time of the POD, Taiwan had a population of about 6M and all of China was about 550M. (so a little over 1%). Taiwan will be *considerably* less important iTTL, to the point that people even in China may not be that annoyed if an outline of China is shown to indicate the country and *doesn't* include China. Compare iOTL if an outline of France doesn't include Corsica or an outline of Italy doesn't include Sardinia.
Probably. Taiwan will get its own chapter some time in the future.
The primary question is whether the February 28 (1947) incident happened. There is a Chen Yi mentioned as the governor of Zhejiang and that he didn't implement Land Reform, and yet it does say that Land Reform went more easily on Taiwan. (I'm not sure if *that* Chen Yi is the Chen Yi was iOTL governor of the Island in 1947.)
Same Chen Yi, who was removed from his post as governor of Taiwan just like OTL. TTL he died in 1959 (not mentioned in the TL). The February 28 incident doesn't happen, but some similar events do happen.
So the question is how is the national government viewed from Taiwan. (and what level of interest in Taiwanese independence is there?)
There's a little bit more opposition to the KMT in Taiwan than in the country as a whole. The two legal opposition parties, the China Youth Party and the China Democratic Socialist Party, have a strong presence on the island.

There is some support for Taiwanese independence, and activists have been arrested. About a third are sympathetic, with support being higher the further you get from Taipei.
 
There is some support for Taiwanese independence, and activists have been arrested. About a third are sympathetic, with support being higher the further you get from Taipei.
Is it coming from the indigenous Taiwanese peoples or from the Han Chinese immigrants? Seems very weird for the Han to be asking for independence from their own government (and one they benefit the most from).
 
Is it coming from the indigenous Taiwanese peoples or from the Han Chinese immigrants? Seems very weird for the Han to be asking for independence from their own government (and one they benefit the most from).
A bit of both, but mostly Han immigrants (obviously not from people who arrived after 1945). There were a lot of people in Taiwan who actually liked Japan and were unhappy with being part of China.
 
A bit of both, but mostly Han immigrants (obviously not from people who arrived after 1945). There were a lot of people in Taiwan who actually liked Japan and were unhappy with being part of China.
So, the "indigenous" Han (i.e those whose ancestors moved to the island during the Qing Dynasty) are the main pro-independence faction on the island?
 
You have to be careful when referring to the "indigenous Taiwanese peoples". In Taiwan iOTL there are really three groups.
1) Those who moved from the Mainland from 1945-1950 (and their descendants)
2) Those of mainland descent who moved to the Island before the Japanese took it over.
3) Those whose ancestors were on Taiwan prior to the 1600 "colonization" (and yes, that term does get political) (such as the Amis and the Bunu

There are a *lot* fewer in category 1 iTTL, but Chen Yi is definitely one of them
 
六十四, Religion in China
Religion has played a powerful role in shaping the history of every country; China is no exception. China’s long history has been influenced both by native religions (Chinese folk religion, Confucianism, Daoism) and religions brought to the Chinese people by foreigners (Buddhism, Christianity, Islam). These religions would be in favor with the government at some times and out of favor at other times. In the 20th century, religious freedom was guaranteed by the Constitution of the Republic of China. That didn’t mean that religious groups were completely free from discrimination or government harassment, however. But, compared to much of the rest of the world, China was a beacon of religious liberty. Thousands of people fled to China in order to practice their faith during the latter half of the 20th century.

Belief in traditional Chinese religion was declining in the 20th century. Some were abandoning religion altogether, while others were converting to other religions (mostly Christianity). There were many organizations created to promote Confucianism. The Chinese Confucian Society Society was founded in 1956 and was the largest organization to promote Confucianism. The organization’s most notable work was training professors and other educators in Confucian ideals. Chen Lifu would be a member until his death, which was somewhat ironic considering his rivalry with Confucius’ descendants. Confucianism is a very different religion than Western religions, and is often called a philosophy instead of a religion. Many Chinese practiced Confucianism alongside other religions. Confucian ideals heavily influenced Chinese people of all faiths.

Buddhism was, and still is, the largest religion in China according to most estimates. Buddhism is prevalent throughout most of China, and each Chinese province is home to many Buddhist temples. These temples became a big draw for tourists as foreigners began to visit China in large numbers in the 1970s. This led to increased interest in Buddhism and Eastern religion in general in Europe and North America. The Chinese government saw Buddhism as a useful tool in the fight against Communism. The Buddhist Anti-Communist League was founded in 1965 after a Legislative Yuan initiative masterminded by Chen Lifu to organize religious opposition to Communism. The organization was originally led by Shi Jian, a member of the Legislative Yuan from Liaoning. The Buddhis Anti-Communist League would later be taken over by Chen Li-an, the son of former Premier Chen Cheng.

1660831710453.jpeg

(Chinese Buddha statue)

Buddhism was the religion of the overwhelming majority of the population in Tibet. The Dalai Lama was an important spiritual figure for Tibetan Buddhists. At first, the Dalai Lama was upset about the Chinese invasion and annexation. He was even in contact with the May 5 coup plotters. However, by 1970, he had come to peace with the fact that independence was impossible, and figured out that cooperation with Nanking was in his best interests. In 1953, a group of dissident monks found a six-year-old boy who they proclaimed to be the true Dalai Lama in Golmud, Qinghai. These monks acted as his handlers until the boy reached adulthood. His true origins are shrouded in mystery, though it is believed that he was the illegitimate child of a Tibetan Buddhist mother and a Hui Muslim father in 1947. He would be known by the name Chun Kaiming, a name that would be made famous in China and abroad.

China’s Muslim population was concentrated in the west, though Chinese Muslims are found all around the country. The Hui were around 1% of China’s population, but they served, and continue to serve, in the Chinese armed forces at much higher rates than the general population. The Hui Muslims had great relations with the Chinese government. Relations with the Uyghurs were not as good, but there were plenty of Uighur leaders in the KMT. The overwhelming majority of Chinese Muslims were Sunni. During the 20th century very few people converted to Islam in China, and very few Chinese Muslims converted to other religions. Chen Lifu was eager to organize Muslim opposition to Communism. He put general Ma Bufang in charge of this effort, and he secured the help of Saudi Arabia in this endeavor. The Saudis in turn funded the construction of mosques and trained clerics in China.

While Muslims had a disproportionate influence in the military, Christians had a disproportionate influence in politics. Sun Yat-sen and Chiang Kai-shek were both Christians, as were many other Chinese politicians (including politicians who opposed Chiang and/or the KMT). Like with Buddhists and Muslims, the KMT used Christianity to further its anti-Communist goals. Christianity was growing, especially Protestant Christianity. While Catholics were traditionally the majority of Christians in China, by the 1970s Catholics and Protestants were about even in numbers. A small Orthodox Christian community existed, mostly from Soviet defectors and other Chinese of Russian descent. Christians also fled North Korea into China to freedom, as the border there was easier to cross than with the South. The growth of Christianity was partly from missionaries, but the Christian faith was increasingly being spread to Chinese people by other Chinese people. Christians were a minority of the Han population, but the majority of the Lisu people in Yunnan and the Taiwanese Aboriginals. The most famous Chinese Christian preacher of that era was Watchman Nee who died in 1972.

1660831828266.jpeg

(Watchman Nee)

Other smaller religions were practiced. There were tend of thousands of Jews in China, though many of them were foreigners working in the country. There was once a large Jewish population (largely consisting of refugees) in the Northeast, particularly Harbin, but most of them moved to Israel in the 1940s. Morris “Two-gun” Cohen, a Jewish general in the Chinese Army, was given a state funeral when he died in 1970. The mid-20th century saw the LDS Church began to proselytize in earnest. When Mormon missionaries entered Ma-controlled territory, they were encouraged to proselytize only to non-Muslims there. Jehovah’s Witnesses came as well. While Mormons were usually tolerated, the government was hostile to Jehovah’s Witnesses, in a large part due to their pacifism. Proposals to outlaw the religion were not enacted, though missionaries were often deported.

1660831878310.jpeg

(Morris "Two-gun" Cohen)
 
OTL cultural revolution destroyed a lot Buddhist art traditional art and temple, I feel upset, sad, hopeless when I think about this history. If you want to see more traditional Chinese culture, welcome to my country Taiwan. Finally I want to thank you in ATL for saving the antiques that were destroyed in OTL
 
I wonder if China will just make a state Christian church, kinda like the Anglican church or whatnot, to be able to stuff alot of Chinese influence
 
Top