That's the appeal, since Papal States-united Italy is a great villain nation since they will inevitably have contradictions between religious and secular goals. Their existence in 19th century Europe means they will be the avatar of reactionary politics.The Pope uniting Italy is fun as a meme, but in reality would’ve been a theocratic nightmare. Bear in mind that even within the OTL Papal States the government was a tyrannical and oppressive thing, such as the infamous time it paved over half of the old town of Perugia to build a fortress to secure its own domination of Umbria.
It is also almost definitionally impossible. A united Italy would be a significant Power, which would destroy the universal role of the Roman Papacy on a fundamental level. Unless you go the modern Iranian way, with all its political and theological problems.I think the Pope uniting Italy is most interesting one.
Wholeheartedly agree. Bonus points if Visconti Italy is combined with a permanent Avignone papacy in my (admittedly wet) dreams...Confederation of equals or bust - whether it's born out of the Lombard League of the late Middle Ages, of the Italic League of the Renaissance, or out of the revolutions of 1848. That said, Milan looks like the most plausible option, if only because the Visconti got close to unifying northern Italy in OTL, but a luckier Matilda of Tuscany might've been able to unify most of Italy as early as the 11th century.
A Visconti Italy is where the smart money should go, but I have a special place in my heart for a consolidation of the Canossa domains in the 11th century: however, it would require Bonifacio of Canossa surviving a little longer, say another 5 years or so, in order to secure the inheritance of his son Federico (Matilda would meet significant difficulties , and her marriage with Godfrey the Hunchback never worked).Confederation of equals or bust - whether it's born out of the Lombard League of the late Middle Ages, of the Italic League of the Renaissance, or out of the revolutions of 1848. That said, Milan looks like the most plausible option, if only because the Visconti got close to unifying northern Italy in OTL, but a luckier Matilda of Tuscany might've been able to unify most of Italy as early as the 11th century.
Oh boy - can you immagine what mussolini could have done with that?I'm a sucker for the House of Medici, so I voted for Tuscany. Although an Italy that is somehow unified by the Palaiologos dynasty in Montferrat would be extremely interesting, too.
What about a Napoleonic Italy that became independent under the Beauharnais family after Nap’s death, like he intended?Okay, maybe should’ve been more specific. I meant foreign nations that rule from another country, and not in the Italian State. So things like Napoleonic Kingdom of Italy isn’t an option, since Napoleon ruled from France, but something like the Bourbon Kings of Two Sicilies or Murat’s Naples, since they rules in their country, is acceptable
Maybe you could have a late unification where the Pope is the Figurehead head of state, but i agree it would be untenable.It is also almost definitionally impossible. A united Italy would be a significant Power, which would destroy the universal role of the Roman Papacy on a fundamental level. Unless you go the modern Iranian way, with all its political and theological problems.
Extremely problematic, to put it mildly.Maybe you could have a late unification where the Pope is the Figurehead head of state, but i agree it would be untenable.
Venice would be really interesting, although it seems tough. Maybe a POD might be a venetian victory at Agnaldello in 1509, although it seems hard for Venice to beat the forces of the Leaugue of Cambrai alone. Maybe said victory + a nice Venetian diplomacy may draw either the Empire or Spain to Venice's side? If when the dust settles Venice annexes the whole Duchy of Milan, that seems a good start.I would go with either:
1) Republic of Venice. Italy becomes a mega-Venice and inherits all of Venice's traditions. It becomes a major trading and seafaring nation which leads it to become a major economic and colonial power.
2) Kingdom of Naples - the south's largest city being the centre of a southern-ruled Italy would make an interesting TL.
I debated that too, since I think Eugene was definitely expecting the Iron Crown at some point, and Nap seemed prepared to bestow it on him... unfortunately, with subsequent events not panning out so well, we'll never know...What about a Napoleonic Italy that became independent under the Beauharnais family after Nap’s death, like he intended?