On the discord a dev leaked the map for the English Catastrophe, so I thought I'd share it.
I also thought to add the leaks from the discord in case you can't see Reddit.
The New Order: Last Days of Europe Thread II
- Thread starter SirHalifax
- Start date
jparker77
Banned
On the discord a dev leaked the map for the English Catastrophe, so I thought I'd share it.
I also thought to add the leaks from the discord in case you can't see Reddit.
I hate to say it but this looks overly complex for the sake of being overly complex. Millennium Dawn went down the same road and now it’s basically unplayable to me(I can’t figure out how to get the freaking economics to work properly).
Now admittedly I have bias as a member of the TNO team but it's not really that overly complex and I think it could add quite a lot to gameplay.
Honestly, I’m surprised the SLP didn’t carve out their own faction.
The game is definitely about to become more complicated and somewhat more realistic to play, which is a very good thing in my opinion.
It wasn't realistic for countries in the mod to snowball industrially from the low 10s to the 100s of factories by 1972 and for social development to be so easy to obtain.
The differences between the various nations will become more significant now. For example a Speer Germany with stronger social policies may have an edge, and an overall stronger economy than a Bormann one. True, its military production capabilities might be lower, but it will force the player to focus on quality as opposed to quantity.
The consequences for the Russian warlords are going to be massive and,10-15% poverty rate Tomsk by 1972 will now be significantly more difficult to achieve. There is no way now, that it'll be able to pay for extensive social policies and equip a vast citizen-solider army with APCs, MBTs etc. The only thing that might do the trick will be to engineer an economic miracle and get 10% annual GDP growth.
I'm pretty excited to get my hands on the update and see how it affects gameplay. Anything that makes the mod more realistic and less "such-such is a blessed chungus" is a good thing in my view as real life never works like this.
brooklyn99
Banned
Regarding Chesterton's England. I have a theory that this would happen if the Collabs get capitulated by HMMLR only for Cornwall to end up defeating them in turn.
Considering Halder was always distrustful of the more moderate Royal Party establishment which had been dominant (as exemplified by how he arranged for PM Lord Mountbatten's assassination after the London Uprising) along with his opinion of them becoming all the more negative with their disgraceful defeat by HMMLR, he'll therefore restore the Collab Government but this time with the more reliably pro-German, ideologically acceptable Chesterton and his BUF placed at the helm.
Otherwise it doesn't seem to stand to reason that the the National Front would be an electable force, considering how bleakly the years of Nazi dominance is remembered by the populace. The post-ECW Royal Party are at least quick to work on redeeming their image for their part in it and reform themselves into a much better light. Even TNOTL Thatcher wouldn't dabble in near the same level of authoritarianism that the NF stands for.
It would be intriguing to guess how British reunification would be affected in these circumstances. Chesterton would still pursue it with the added motivation of legitimizing what would be a really unpopular Fascist regime and bettering his image in the eyes of his people by way of nationalist sentiment. Of course he wouldn't be able nor willing to negotiate with Wales and Scotland into joining his United Kingdom, which makes me wonder if the war between German-aligned England and America-aligned Scotland would transform into another full blown proxy war between the OFN and the EP.
PS: I can imagine Chesterton's path being chock full of V for Vendetta references
Considering Halder was always distrustful of the more moderate Royal Party establishment which had been dominant (as exemplified by how he arranged for PM Lord Mountbatten's assassination after the London Uprising) along with his opinion of them becoming all the more negative with their disgraceful defeat by HMMLR, he'll therefore restore the Collab Government but this time with the more reliably pro-German, ideologically acceptable Chesterton and his BUF placed at the helm.
Otherwise it doesn't seem to stand to reason that the the National Front would be an electable force, considering how bleakly the years of Nazi dominance is remembered by the populace. The post-ECW Royal Party are at least quick to work on redeeming their image for their part in it and reform themselves into a much better light. Even TNOTL Thatcher wouldn't dabble in near the same level of authoritarianism that the NF stands for.
It would be intriguing to guess how British reunification would be affected in these circumstances. Chesterton would still pursue it with the added motivation of legitimizing what would be a really unpopular Fascist regime and bettering his image in the eyes of his people by way of nationalist sentiment. Of course he wouldn't be able nor willing to negotiate with Wales and Scotland into joining his United Kingdom, which makes me wonder if the war between German-aligned England and America-aligned Scotland would transform into another full blown proxy war between the OFN and the EP.
PS: I can imagine Chesterton's path being chock full of V for Vendetta references
I thought Mountbatten was died in the first cable street revoltOn the discord a dev leaked the map for the English Catastrophe, so I thought I'd share it.
I also thought to add the leaks from the discord in case you can't see Reddit.
brooklyn99
Banned
This was presumably before the English Catastrophe got cut. So Mountbatten's lore got changed.
I may have done that to prevent him popping up again in a time period where he's really not well enough for politics.
brooklyn99
Banned
Since the Catastrophe is old-lore, could you give a closer look about it and fill us in on the three contestants? What's the division between the English Free State and the English Protectorate about? What is there to say about the English Social Republic?
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There were actually 2 distinct versions of the Catastrophe, the first you see above was the pre-rework version with three contestants.
The English Protectorate is the alliance of David Stirling and Louis Mountbatten (HMMLR's militarist elements and the English Aristocracy respectively) which would focus around a stratocratic cromwellian-esque republic under Stirling, or a restoration of the Monarchy as a facade for Mountbatten's dictatorship. In this version, the catastrophe actually starts when Stirling following Claude's death launches a coup and kills Bill Alexander, leading HMMLR to splinter.
The Social Republic is a legacy from when HMMLR had a minor but present fascist faction, which in the chaos of the catastrophe approaches the Germans with the offer of giving them a loyal (but independant) ally on the Isles in return for lots of guns. If the Catastrophe dragged on for too great a period of time, the Germans would dispense with the formalities and establish RK Brittanien. This could also occur if the OFN and Pakt agreed to a ceasefire and created what the team reffers to as "Korea Britain" where you have the east broadly under Pakt sway, whilst the OFN Mandate was set up in the west.
The Free State is a mishmash of regular HMMLR and LR elements under Orde Wingate and Edward Heath, having turned to the OFN for support in the renewed Civil War, they are a fragile alliance lacking in manpower but having technological and material superiority over their rivals (particularly in aircraft). If the war went on too long, the would eventually cede control directly to the OFN and allow the formation of the OFN Mandate of England, which could also be established if the Pakt and OFN agreed to a ceasefire.
Generally, the endings for the Catastrophe were supposed to be either Nuclear War from the crisis, Stirling and Mountbatten winning, or Korea Britain. With full RK Britain, OFN Mandate, or Social Repbulic/Free State victory being the less likely outcomes.
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However, there was a brief redesign of the Catastrophe during the rework (which never really went anywhere due to the Catastrophe being ditched along with the Burgundian support).
In this mostly theoretical rework, the Catastrophe went from 3 factions to 4. With a resurgent Collaborationist force emerging in Cornwall (replacing the Social Republic), Stirling starting in London, the Free State holding the North, and the Midlands being given to the newly created Socialist Republic of England, which was supposed to be Bill Alexander going Mao levels of anti-landlord.
Each of the factions over time had a theme to colour their focuses (which has given rise to some jokes about Stirling being a furry in the team due to some of the focus names being silly). Wolves for the Protectorate, Lions for the Social Republic/Collabs, Bears for the Communists and Wyverns for the Free State. Overall, i'm not especially sad the Catastrophe is gone, but I remember it fondly nonetheless.
Wait, I tough the burgundian support was still there
There is this event as the collabs with a HMMLR bombing, but it states that it is strange for this bombing to happen since they do not have airplanes, ain't that Burgundian planes using HMMLR colours?
....Uh no.
Thats Arthur Harris and his airforce of planes he stashed in sheds without people noticing.
brooklyn99
Banned
I appreciate you for taking the time to make this hefty post. The English Catastrophe was a fascinating concept while it lasted.
If I may inquire about old-lore Thatcher? The rumour mill goes that before being reworked she was like, comically horrible. Like, something out of a Socialist Unionist's LSD fuelled nightmares, with a possible grisly death event for her to boot. Could you give insight?
Old Thatcher (as in, pre-pre-rework Thatcher) was made when the Royal Party were Fascist by default and Enoch Powell was leading them (for some reason). Thus she was fascist as well and made to fit that mold, with predictable results for her portrayl. There was vaguely planned for there to be a "Jacobin" (the term for a agitator, not the scottish royals) revolution which could force her out (and have her exit the world Louis of France style) and bring a communist revolution to power near the end of TNO1.
I can't recall if there even were any specific plans for Thatcher after the RP got turned authdem, but if they existed they got forgotten about when the rework started, we made her the more modern version.
brooklyn99
Banned
I see. Are you able to describe some of the..."stuff" that Fash-Thatcher gets up to in that path?