I live and learn every day, although sometimes I wish I could forget it.
Thanks. I think.
Sir John Valentine Carden survives.
- Thread starter allanpcameron
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Thanks. I think.
A lot of the Dock Workers were women, for a given value of the concept.
For all the stories you hear about the NKVD using the allure of Russian womanhood to subvert western men, according to edgeworthy senior they looked a fairly grim lot. Even to sailors who had been stuck aboard ship for months.
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Long hours, low pay and even hinting you wanted better conditions or a new job would see you in the camps. I can see why they'd be in a grim mood all the time. I also don't doubt the NKVD removed all the actual whores from the area as clearly a superior socialist country wouldn't have such things.
Well given that ancestors was married it didn’t work and TBH he didn’t have a particular good opinion on the USSR the way the great Uncle who knew him rather well told it.
5- 15 March 1941. Sudan.
allanpcameron
Donor
5- 15 March 1941. Sudan.
The Matilda II Infantry Tanks of 42nd Bn RTR hadn’t been designed for the kind of terrain that they’d found themselves in. The 4th and 5th Indian Infantry Divisions had been using the tanks for roles that no one had ever thought of. The fighting was primarily an infantry battle, but the Infantry Tanks found themselves being used in all sorts of jobs to support them. Each of the Divisional Commanders had taken over a tank for their own particular use. The gunner and loader in these tanks were left behind, the gun and its ammunition removed and extra radios fitted. As an armoured command post, the tanks provided the generals with mobility and communications. Trying to make sure that each Brigade and Battalion Commander didn’t think this was something to copy was a bit of a fight, but the tanks had other roles that they were needed for.
Tank commanders found themselves carrying artillery ammunition forward, one sergeant still had the shakes after having to fill the tank with crates of dynamite to carry it forward to engineers. The tanks ranged about the battlefield trying to draw the fire of Italian gunners, so that their positions could be spotted and attacked. One driver, with an artistic flair, had drawn a mountain goat on the side of his Matilda, as he felt his tanks was going up and down valleys, halfway up mountains, doing things that any sensible goat would avoid.
The mileage covered by the tanks in the weeks before the Keren battle was extraordinary, especially taking into account the difficult terrain. Without doubt the fitters, the Light Aid Detachment and echelon vehicles had worked marvels at keeping the tanks on the road. Six of the tanks had been put out of action, four by enemy action, the other two had mechanicals that would need a fully equipped workshop to fix, and so had been stripped for valuable spares.
The work at clearing a path through the Dongolaas gorge to allow the tanks through the road to Keren involved both Indian Divisions attempting to take the hills on each side of the gorge, then for the engineers to dismantle the formidable roadblock. All this was finally achieved, with Colonel Bernard Fletcher of the Highland Light Infantry commanding the column, led by C Squadron’s Matildas, and the Bren gun carriers of both divisions broke through, and within an hour had taken control of Keren. The Italians who hadn’t surrendered were withdrawing towards Asmara though the Habi Mantel gorge. Fletcher Force, knowing how easy it would be for that gorge to become as fortified as Dongolaas had been, gave chase. At Ad Teclesan the British forces encountered the Italian rear-guard. Elements of the 9th Indian Infantry Brigade had been carried forward to support the tracked vehicles, and the Italian position fell quickly, the Matilda Infantry Tanks’ heavy armour once more proving its worth.
The next day the town of Asmara surrendered to the advancing British tanks, which after some time to fix themselves up, and refuel and rearm, joined the 7th Indian Brigade on the road to Massawa. General Heath sent an ultimatum to Admiral Bonetti, commanding at Massawa, by the unusual means of ringing up his headquarters on the undamaged telephone line. Bonetti, after consulting with Rome, refused to surrender. On 12 March the 7th Indian Infantry Brigade Group reached the northern part of the Massawa defences, and joined by Indian 10th Brigade and the Free French Brigade d' Orient. Early on 15 March an attack by the 7th Indian Infantry Brigade Group was pinned down, but a simultaneous attack by 10th Indian Infantry Brigade and C Squadron 42nd Battalion Royal Tank Regiment bit deeply into the western defences and the Free French troops broke into the south-western sector. Early in the afternoon Admiral Bonetti surrendered with 9,590 men and 127 guns, though not before doing as much damage to the harbour as he could.
With the fighting in Eritrea almost finished, the 4th Indian Division was given orders to return to Egypt. The 5th Indian Division, with the remaining Infantry Tanks were to open up the road between Asmara, Dessie and on to Addis Ababa. This would allow the forces of General Cunningham advancing from Kenya towards Addis Ababa to move unite with 5th Indian Division, completing the destruction of Italian East Africa.
NB Obviously this is about a month ahead of OTL schedule. I am using this quote from here as the basis for the speeding up:
The Matilda II Infantry Tanks of 42nd Bn RTR hadn’t been designed for the kind of terrain that they’d found themselves in. The 4th and 5th Indian Infantry Divisions had been using the tanks for roles that no one had ever thought of. The fighting was primarily an infantry battle, but the Infantry Tanks found themselves being used in all sorts of jobs to support them. Each of the Divisional Commanders had taken over a tank for their own particular use. The gunner and loader in these tanks were left behind, the gun and its ammunition removed and extra radios fitted. As an armoured command post, the tanks provided the generals with mobility and communications. Trying to make sure that each Brigade and Battalion Commander didn’t think this was something to copy was a bit of a fight, but the tanks had other roles that they were needed for.
Tank commanders found themselves carrying artillery ammunition forward, one sergeant still had the shakes after having to fill the tank with crates of dynamite to carry it forward to engineers. The tanks ranged about the battlefield trying to draw the fire of Italian gunners, so that their positions could be spotted and attacked. One driver, with an artistic flair, had drawn a mountain goat on the side of his Matilda, as he felt his tanks was going up and down valleys, halfway up mountains, doing things that any sensible goat would avoid.
The mileage covered by the tanks in the weeks before the Keren battle was extraordinary, especially taking into account the difficult terrain. Without doubt the fitters, the Light Aid Detachment and echelon vehicles had worked marvels at keeping the tanks on the road. Six of the tanks had been put out of action, four by enemy action, the other two had mechanicals that would need a fully equipped workshop to fix, and so had been stripped for valuable spares.
The work at clearing a path through the Dongolaas gorge to allow the tanks through the road to Keren involved both Indian Divisions attempting to take the hills on each side of the gorge, then for the engineers to dismantle the formidable roadblock. All this was finally achieved, with Colonel Bernard Fletcher of the Highland Light Infantry commanding the column, led by C Squadron’s Matildas, and the Bren gun carriers of both divisions broke through, and within an hour had taken control of Keren. The Italians who hadn’t surrendered were withdrawing towards Asmara though the Habi Mantel gorge. Fletcher Force, knowing how easy it would be for that gorge to become as fortified as Dongolaas had been, gave chase. At Ad Teclesan the British forces encountered the Italian rear-guard. Elements of the 9th Indian Infantry Brigade had been carried forward to support the tracked vehicles, and the Italian position fell quickly, the Matilda Infantry Tanks’ heavy armour once more proving its worth.
The next day the town of Asmara surrendered to the advancing British tanks, which after some time to fix themselves up, and refuel and rearm, joined the 7th Indian Brigade on the road to Massawa. General Heath sent an ultimatum to Admiral Bonetti, commanding at Massawa, by the unusual means of ringing up his headquarters on the undamaged telephone line. Bonetti, after consulting with Rome, refused to surrender. On 12 March the 7th Indian Infantry Brigade Group reached the northern part of the Massawa defences, and joined by Indian 10th Brigade and the Free French Brigade d' Orient. Early on 15 March an attack by the 7th Indian Infantry Brigade Group was pinned down, but a simultaneous attack by 10th Indian Infantry Brigade and C Squadron 42nd Battalion Royal Tank Regiment bit deeply into the western defences and the Free French troops broke into the south-western sector. Early in the afternoon Admiral Bonetti surrendered with 9,590 men and 127 guns, though not before doing as much damage to the harbour as he could.
With the fighting in Eritrea almost finished, the 4th Indian Division was given orders to return to Egypt. The 5th Indian Division, with the remaining Infantry Tanks were to open up the road between Asmara, Dessie and on to Addis Ababa. This would allow the forces of General Cunningham advancing from Kenya towards Addis Ababa to move unite with 5th Indian Division, completing the destruction of Italian East Africa.
NB Obviously this is about a month ahead of OTL schedule. I am using this quote from here as the basis for the speeding up:
If twelve tanks shortened the campaign by many weeks, then 30 should hopefully do even more so.
Well that's a waste of a tank and should be handicapping the British rather than aiding. A general commanding multiple brigades in combat and co ordinating supporting arms needs to be in a proper headquarters with his staff around him. No commander above battalion level should be in a tank and even that is open to question. They ought to be in one of these, the didn't enter service until later in 1941 in OTL and probably can't be bought forward as it was a result of lessons learned during the Fall of France.
British divisional commanders using tanks as their HQ's may have happened in OTL thought I haven't heard about it and it seems unlikely because before they had armoured command trucks they used unarmoured improvised lorry based vehicles which had sufficient space for staff and radios.
If any here has not read the Assault on Keren and the infantry assaults on the 3 sub peaks of Mount Sammana that dominated the cross roads its an eye opener
Especially when you consider that the Attackers were outnumbered nearly 2 to 1 by the defenders
That it is virtually unknown is tragic IMO
Yes the AEC Matadors - didn't Rommel use a couple as his mobile CP?Well that's a waste of a tank and should be handicapping the British rather than aiding. A general commanding multiple brigades in combat and co ordinating supporting arms needs to be in a proper headquarters with his staff around him. No commander above battalion level should be in a tank and even that is open to question. They ought to be in one of these, the didn't enter service until later in 1941 in OTL and probably can't be bought forward as it was a result of lessons learned during the Fall of France.
British divisional commanders using tanks as their HQ's may have happened in OTL thought I haven't heard about it and it seems unlikely because before they had armoured command trucks they used unarmoured improvised lorry based vehicles which had sufficient space for staff and radios.
He did they took three of them but only used two I think also the British troops nicknamed them Dorchester after the hotel.
allanpcameron
Donor
I extrapolated from the comment: Lt Glover, a troop leader, recounted that “the battle itself was an absolute infanteer’s triumph, but the Divisional Commanders were using Matildas as armoured jeeps…”
Well if it's OTL fair enough, it's still a stupid idea imho which was not copied by any other commanders later in the war. Though that comment could be interpreted as the greedy divisional commander having a proper truck mounted headquarters and then using the Matildas for front line visits and inspections, presumably because the rough terrain meant conventional staff cars couldn't get near the front. Which is still a waste of a tank but makes more sense.
Looking at pictures of the battlefield today and some from the time OTL I’d really hate to try and take a command truck or a staff car through it. The whole battlefield is a mess of scrubland, with rocky terrain thrown in, I don’t think anything but a tank, a universal carrier or maybe a 4x4 could have gotten and not torn sometimes important out of it
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