Worth mentioning that arbitrary practices make really really good cultural markers so they're bound to persist once they arise.
Technologies or Scientific discoveries that could have been made long before (or after) they actually were.
- Thread starter Samm
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What about a clipper ship, or any late era sailing ship a couple centuries earlier? Never mind the design evolution process. If some shipbuilder had an epiphany/divine inspiration, is there anything stopping him from building one?
Expense.
Investors.
Infrastructure that could make it happen.
Lack of craftsman skilled at that sort of thing.
Materials, proper wood.
The aeolipile demonstrates a few other technologies. The steam coming out of the arms is pressurized like a rocket. The pressurized steam could lead to something like Aristarchus's flying bird which is basically a steam rocket. It also sets further developments like the steam cannon of Archimedes.
The Antikythera device is a way to measure the heavens. It is a precursor to the Orrery and would lead to the globe, the planetary orrery, clockwork mechanisms on a larger scale, big clock towers, or something like Su Song's hydromechanical clock tower. Once you have water power, it could change the direction and complexity of water power to make earlier versions of stone cutting and wood cutting mills with clockwork machinery. It could also improve navigation with better models of the heavens.
It is also a geared device. There are a number of devices that could come out of it earlier like the Odometer created by Vitruvius.
The Antikythera device is a way to measure the heavens. It is a precursor to the Orrery and would lead to the globe, the planetary orrery, clockwork mechanisms on a larger scale, big clock towers, or something like Su Song's hydromechanical clock tower. Once you have water power, it could change the direction and complexity of water power to make earlier versions of stone cutting and wood cutting mills with clockwork machinery. It could also improve navigation with better models of the heavens.
It is also a geared device. There are a number of devices that could come out of it earlier like the Odometer created by Vitruvius.
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To go with that someone could have developed basic probability for things like dice. Only a few people understood probability for gambling for a long time. It gave them a tremendous advantage.
Sulfanilamide (the first broad-spectrum antibiotic) was first synthesized in 1908 and used as an intermediate for some dyes before its use as a drug was discovered in 1935. It's synthesis is also simple enough that it could have been made fairly at any time after 1850, give or take a decade or two in either direction.
Nobody's said that traditional practices are perfect, just that they usually exist for a reason, and that outsiders making sweeping changes without understanding said reason are apt to make things worse.
Nitrocellulose.
I remember somebody had once made a WI here about some Arabian alchemist accidentally inventing it in the early middle ages.
I suppose nitro-glycerine could likewise also be discovered ahead of schedule.
On a different note, spinning wheels. I always wondered why it took so long to build such a simple device.
I remember somebody had once made a WI here about some Arabian alchemist accidentally inventing it in the early middle ages.
I suppose nitro-glycerine could likewise also be discovered ahead of schedule.
On a different note, spinning wheels. I always wondered why it took so long to build such a simple device.
Discoveries and technologies can be made/developed at any time after the necessary pre-existing technologies exist. For example you can not discover the moons of Jupiter without some form of telescope. However what we are interested in is technologies or discoveries that spread beyond the initial observer or developer. That requires some obvious advantage that is worth copying or some easy way of preserving and transmitting information so it might survive to find a person who is interested or can find a use for it.
I suggest enough people are curious that lots of discoveries are made as soon as the requisite technology exists BUT in most cases the information is not in an environment that the meme can propagate. Once you have writing (especially printing) and enough surplus in society to support people who can spend their time on things not directly related to survival then the sum total of technology and knowledge will expand.
To turn these into science you need to have the scientific method which was it's self a technology (based on pre-existing technologies) designed to make testable statements about the world but that is a whole other subject.
So I assume what we need to find are discoveries or technologies that people find useful in a particular society and that have the prerequisite technologies existing in that society but that were not thought of. That is difficult because it is hard to work out what would have been useful and what are the prerequisites.
I suggest enough people are curious that lots of discoveries are made as soon as the requisite technology exists BUT in most cases the information is not in an environment that the meme can propagate. Once you have writing (especially printing) and enough surplus in society to support people who can spend their time on things not directly related to survival then the sum total of technology and knowledge will expand.
To turn these into science you need to have the scientific method which was it's self a technology (based on pre-existing technologies) designed to make testable statements about the world but that is a whole other subject.
So I assume what we need to find are discoveries or technologies that people find useful in a particular society and that have the prerequisite technologies existing in that society but that were not thought of. That is difficult because it is hard to work out what would have been useful and what are the prerequisites.
The problem with that theory would be that it's kind of hard to disprove. So it might kind of last longer than miasma.
How are you going to prove that supernatural things aren't affecting you.
In modern societies, yes. Torpedo gyroscopes from 1893 to the 1940s were similar to gimbaled aeolipiles:
Source
The compressed air or steam would pass from the frame into the outer gimbal through the outer bearing. From there it would pass through the outer gimbal (the gimbals are hollow), into the inner gimbal through the bearing, and finally be directed against the notched main wheel to make it rotate. This is much the same way steam would be directed through the aeolipile bearing and then directed to rotate the ball. These gyroscopes would function in any orientation for as long as there was steam flowing through them.
The problem is that preindustrial societies have no use for a gyroscope, so this would have no effect. For all we know Hero may as well have added a bunch of gimbals (made of pipe) to the aeolipile as an experiment and discarded it because it was useless.
Nothing held reflectors back that much, any society that discovered bronze could make speculum metal for mirrors, but the math to know the correct shape and distances would take a good amount of effort. For refracting telescopes it's the same thing, the earliest known lenses (purely decorative) date to 2200 BC in Egypt and there are lenses from Crete dated to 500 BC that were most likely used as magnification lenses given their quality. (Also this has more information on ancient lenses.) But while they were probably good enough for telescope lenses there is no evidence that they ever built telescopes.
I read an SF story set in post-apocalyptic California where people in the mountains used hang gliders for scouting in warfare.
It would take a fairly lucky set of events but I wonder if functional hang gliders could be developed using pretty primitive tech and if there would be a use for them.
It could start as something used for entertainment or as an awesome display in ceremony or to frighten and impress enemies, and then develop from there
It would take a fairly lucky set of events but I wonder if functional hang gliders could be developed using pretty primitive tech and if there would be a use for them.
It could start as something used for entertainment or as an awesome display in ceremony or to frighten and impress enemies, and then develop from there
There is this TL going on right now about earlier development of concentrated solar. It's pretty awesome.
Solar Dreams: a history of solar energy (1878 - 2025)
Prologue: Daydreaming November, 1878 Paris, France Constantino Serrano, Captain in the Chilean Army and Military Attaché was thirsty. He could endure a march of a day without much trouble, but the energy of his company still left her expended. Mademoiselle Dominique Demolle, a charming...
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Simple discoveries that would radically change ancient times or middle ages?
What are some simple scientific or technological discoveries that, if they were invented in ancient times or middle ages, would have led to drastic changes?
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Pre-industrial era inventions that could have been invented in the middle ages
As title says. I'm writing an alternate history (with some fantasy) book and i need some ideas to have the late middle ages look more modern. I need a list of advancements that could have been made without resorting to an industrial revolution. So, what are some pre-1750 inventions that could...
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Also, picric acid. Can be made (very inefficiently) by nitrating protein-rich materials like horn and feathers, with phenol from coal tar being much better once it's available. Much more stable in storage than nitroglycerin and nitrocellulose, and far less sensitive to shock and friction than the former. Additionally, it forms picrate salts that are much more sensitive (so they could be used as detonators/blasting caps to set off the main charge), and is also a very vibrant yellow dye that will bind very well to protein-based fibers like wool.