Separated at Birth: America and Drakia

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HistLover

Simeon said:
China having an analogous hi-tech and ambiguously atompunk reputation OTL Japan had had just been confirmed:

j11.jpg

There had been an informal taboo of sorts in Free China regarding about superweapons - specifically those pertaining to Stone Dogs and Thermonuclear Weaponry. So far, imagery pertaining to those had involved allegory that arouses the observer by unnerving them and disturbing them - and has stood up to be one of the foremost aesthetics in China's vibrant - ly or yet - conflicted pacifist and jingoist movements alike.
​
I'm relieved that the Free Chinese are perfectly sane this time. Hail SUN WUKONG and Hail the Partnership!

By that, I wonder how has robotics progressed so far in this timeline, considering that they would be incredibly useful for clean-ups of all the toxic areas this accursed world had.
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Where the ——?!?? did that picture come from?!
 

xsampa

Banned
In the über-Drakia scenario, Germany would have kept Syria and a victorious Spain Morocco, but India and the East Indies and by extension Tibet and Malaya would have become Drakian.

China would be effectively trapped between the Drakians and the Japanese in Manchuria so a war with Japan would lead to Partition of China between Drakia and Japan — likely on a defacto instead of de jure basis.
Also even über-Drakia needs allies

It is said the British Empire covered 1/3 of the Earth ITTL: Is this a reference to area, population or both?
 
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digital2

I think the world would have been turned out better off in the long run if Klein had won the presidency, although I do shudder to think about the damage it would do to American democracy. With a successful Draco-American war, the entire Middle East is liberated and the American navy isn't damaged by Perdue's reforms, which could potentially lead to a American victory in the Great Pacific War. And without Klein helping to improve the Drakian navy, we might see the Drakians getting less territory in the Great Patriotic War. I imagine with America still high on victory disease and Klein at the helm, the Final War would break out with the Colombia incident. Kobold wouldn't have time to vaccinate the Pact against the Stone Dogs plague (assuming the disease even existed back then) and I think that he would be rational enough not to use it as it would turn the entire world against him. Hundreds of millions would still die, but the death toll would be a lot less. Even in the rare chance of a Drakia victory without the Stone Dogs plague, I imagine the empire would be so damaged that things would end up falling apart within a decade.

What is Drakia's and Russia's plan for dealing with the upcoming Situationist war? Anyone with common sense should be able to see it coming and both of them are woefully outmatched by China's nuclear arsenal.
 

Scrivener

How dangerous are space guns TTL? From what I know they're essentially rapid-fire miniature nuke launchers based on the kinetic energy being delivered, but has there ever been a way developed to intercept a space gun projectile in flight?
 

The Southeast

What happened to Lucan Atrias Caesar in the end? He never had control of anything more than Sicily, correct?

Also, how are Portugal and Australia? Who are they aligned with?
 
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generalurist

digital2 said:
I think the world would have been turned out better off in the long run if Klein had won the presidency, although I do shudder to think about the damage it would do to American democracy. With a successful Draco-American war, the entire Middle East is liberated and the American navy isn't damaged by Perdue's reforms, which could potentially lead to a American victory in the Great Pacific War. And without Klein helping to improve the Drakian navy, we might see the Drakians getting less territory in the Great Patriotic War. I imagine with America still high on victory disease and Klein at the helm, the Final War would break out with the Colombia incident. Kobold wouldn't have time to vaccinate the Pact against the Stone Dogs plague (assuming the disease even existed back then) and I think that he would be rational enough not to use it as it would turn the entire world against him. Hundreds of millions would still die, but the death toll would be a lot less. Even in the rare chance of a Drakia victory without the Stone Dogs plague, I imagine the empire would be so damaged that things would end up falling apart within a decade.

What is Drakia's and Russia's plan for dealing with the upcoming Situationist war? Anyone with common sense should be able to see it coming and both of them are woefully outmatched by China's nuclear arsenal.
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You made me think, @Ephraim Ben Raphael was Stone Dogs planned to always be used from the start, or was it possible that lucky rolls would make things developed in a way where either Drakia can't use it or thinks they don't need it?

Also, I don't recall the details, what reforms did Perdue do that crippled the American navy?

On that note, a few other "what ifs" of mine:
  • Was it guaranteed that America would be too exhausted by the Pacific War to defend Brazil's territory from Drakia, or was it possible that if America rolled well they'd be able to at least white peace the 2nd Drakian-American war?
  • What if Drakia had rolled much worse and/or Britain much better in the Anglo-Drakian war? Barring a fumble what's the least territory they could end up with, and what other changes to the timeline would happen for Drakia to still be a major threat in the 20th century?
  • On the same token, would the results have been different if Britain and Drakia rolled the same difference but much lower dice (e.g. 2 vs 5 instead of 11 vs 14)
  • IIRC you took a while to figure out what to do when America rolled a nat 1 in the Pacific War. Which dice do you think would most severely throw off you plans for the story if one side rolled an unexpected crit or fumble?
  • What if Russia had somehow rolled much better than Germany in the Patriotic War? Is it possible they could have won without calling on Drakia for aid? Or in that case would Drakia jump in on their own accord?
  • Had the AfD rolled much better on Stone Dogs, such as France or such getting a crit, how far into Drakian territory would the Allied have advanced before the de facto end of the Final War, since you always imagined to it be a relatively short conflict?
  • Speaking of the final war, initially you misordered the countries and gave Japan a crit. Would Chinese nukes still have stopped them from gaining territory?
Ephraim Ben Raphael said:
-China was always going to emerge as a major power towards the end of the TL one way or another, I even contemplated a China-led Confederation of East Asia before deciding against it.
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What if they fumbled on on Stone Dogs :p ?
 

Scrivener

generalurist said:
You made me think, @Ephraim Ben Raphael was Stone Dogs planned to always be used from the start, or was it possible that lucky rolls would make things developed in a way where either Drakia can't use it or thinks they don't need it?
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Considering that the Stone Dogs were a major plot point in Vanilla Draka it's most likely that EBR planned for the Stone Dogs to be incorporated as a less pseudoscientific weapon (no radio HIV, in TTL it's basically delayed asymptomatic superflu).

Say, what was TTL's equivalent to the vanilla Eurasian War?
 

Jedi Dragon

Scrivener said:
Considering that the Stone Dogs were a major plot point in Vanilla Draka it's most likely that EBR planned for the Stone Dogs to be incorporated as a less pseudoscientific weapon (no radio HIV, in TTL it's basically delayed asymptomatic superflu).

Say, what was TTL's equivalent to the vanilla Eurasian War?
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I think that would be the Great Patriotic War.
 

xsampa

Banned
The Chinese terms for
Situationism 情景主义
Spectacle 场面
Free X 自由
Partners for Peace and Reconstruction 和平与重建伙伴
 
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Whiteshore

Whiteshore

What would have happened had the Societist manifesto rolled a 1 or another crit fail? Would some Drakian take on Rexism have taken its role as Drakia's ruling ideology?
 

Scrivener

What I like the most about TTL's Drakians is that they don't seek the enslavement of the human race.
IMO Stirling's Draka was the generic traits of an Evil Empire taken to the extreme, with their ideology simplified to an extent that all Naldoressen was saying was

- Draka = good master race
- Everyone else = ferals

Even Hitler didn't take National Socialism to that extreme; his racial ideology justified an entire sub-racial tree inside the category of "Aryan". Stirling took the basic concepts of Nazism, simplified them, and amplified the result to a ludicrous extreme.

What EBR's Drakia has done is essentially create a more insidious evil; with a more complex creed comparable to the Protestant Alt-Right/White Supremacy, Drakia has gained the ability to essentially annex large amounts of land without having to enslave every native. For instance, take the Princely States of Spain and Rhomenia; with Societism favoring the White Race, the Drakians were able to simply radicalize the Rhomenian populace into believing that they were the "Master Race".

This isn't Vanilla Draka, where everyone considered it better to detonate fusion bombs on their own soil to prevent being enslaved, this is an ideology more akin to Fascism, or Communism; one that can easily be spread into a conquered nation, turning neighbor against neighbor until there is no such thing as German or French- only Drakian. Societism, unlike Vanilla Draka, can be exported, transferred to other nations, becoming a creed that rebels can rally around and fight for. Stirling's Draka never had that; their Drakan supremacy ideology already ruined any chance of radicalization and sympathy.

The most terrifying thing about Societism isn't its cliched creed about enslaving everyone on the planet; it's the fact that even under Drakian rule, one can still live his daily life unhampered by any restrictions. Societism can become the new normal for them, where they can consider the Empire as a society equal to if not better than America or China.

And after decades of normalization under the jackboot, perhaps they really will consider themselves Drakian rather than Rhomenian.
 
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