Army equipment that should have seen service
- Thread starter Bougnas
- Start date
Deleted member 1487
The Madsen LAR is the posh AK whitout a market
Couple of years sonner and it could have become the standard rifle of several countries instead of the G3 or FAL
Even the stgw 57 was sold to south american countries and it was swiss clockwork , probably the only batlle rifle that could fire in full auto whit some control , and that in 7.5x55 swiss
Couple of years sonner and it could have become the standard rifle of several countries instead of the G3 or FAL
Even the stgw 57 was sold to south american countries and it was swiss clockwork , probably the only batlle rifle that could fire in full auto whit some control , and that in 7.5x55 swiss
They're planning on that anyway:
Inside the Army's NEW 6.8mm Next Gen Squad Weapon
Iraq War veteran Chris Cappy gives the Next Generation Squad Weapon rundown. These three companies are in competition to replace the M-16, M-249 SAW andtaskandpurpose.com
It won't be nearly as tough as you think, since the Creedmoor is basically a slightly shortened 7.62 NATO case; you can largely just swap out barrels in existing equipment.
Same thing could apply to some degree in per-WW2 conversions, they could shorten the chamber as they did with .30-06 to 7.62 NATO modifications:
Thanks for the info, very interesting. I'm not clear from the articles if their just changing to 6.8mm for the new SAW, or for every riflemen. Is the whole army going to 6.8mm? The Marines are going over to the M-27 Automatic Rifle, but it uses 5.56mm, are they going to convert to? Over all this should be a good move, though I thought the smart money was on the 6.5mm. I understand the ammo load for individual soldiers will only go down about 15%, a 30 round box magazine will now be 26 rounds. Since we don't know what 6.8mm round is going to be the final product, we don't know all it's characteristics, so we don't know if it tumbles, or fragments like the 5.56mm. We just have to wait for more complete data.
Deleted member 1487
AFAIK it's 6.8mm for everything, at least so far. Their plan is that thanks to modern optics they can actually use the full range of rifle unlike before when it was limited to about 300m by the Mk. 1 Eyeball. Now thanks to that and the proliferation of body armor a heavier, larger caliber bullet is needed and the 5.56 can be dispensed with. Especially as we don't generally use automatic fire anymore for rifles and have a long service volunteer army, they can focus on training to correct for issues that might come with having less, more powerful ammo that was harder to do with a draftee army.
They went 6.8mm BTW because they was the heaviest caliber that would result in tolerate recoil from a rifle and still achieve the down range performance expected of the new rifles. I think they're using the EPR bullet design.
The 6.8mm NGSW ammo is supposed to have better armor penetration than .30-06 M2 AP, primarily by increasing chamber pressure. That's the best comparison. It is definitely not an intermediate cartridge.
Is this intended to come about with the introduction of the LSAT case telescoped/caseless (not sure which route they decided to go) ammunition?
It is 40%/51% lighter than conventional ammo so the 'increase' in bullet size can be mitigated by the lower weight of the modern ammo.
Deleted member 1487
Doesn't look like, AFAIK Sig's dual part case steel base/brass body ammo is the favored choice.
Sure, but AFAIK they haven't gotten that technology to work right yet.
BlackDragon98
Banned
This magic machine:
en.wikipedia.org
And this:
en.wikipedia.org
Politicians. Much awesome tech, we can get, without them, no?
XM25 CDTE - Wikipedia
XM29 OICW - Wikipedia
Politicians. Much awesome tech, we can get, without them, no?
Basically the entire LSAT program from the 2000s was rendered obsolete when NGSW came out with with the new armor penetration requirements. AFAIK, there are no plans for new rifles and machine guns firing intermediate cartridges. The Textron bid is based on the LSAT gun and the C/T ammo, but GD is going with composite cases and Sig, who's probably going to win at this point, has a brass case with a steel base to withstand the chamber pressure. As far as the rifle is concerned, side chargers on ARs are for race guns, not fighting rifles.
Deleted member 1487
A nearly 7kg empty (8.17kg loaded) rifle??? That complex??? It was cancelled for a GOOD series of reasons.This magic machine:
And this:XM25 CDTE - Wikipedia
XM29 OICW - Wikipedia
Politicians. Much awesome tech, we can get, without them, no?
BlackDragon98
Banned
It had a grenade launcher and all the necessary accessories already in the gun, so it's worth it.
And you used kg twice BTW.
This magic machine:
And this:XM25 CDTE - Wikipedia
XM29 OICW - Wikipedia
Politicians. Much awesome tech, we can get, without them, no?
Very clever bit of kit - but from what I understand it was an answer looking for a problem to solve.
The army even sent them to the Middle east where I think they were fired a few dozen times in combat and the results were a bit Meh from what I understand.
BlackDragon98
Banned
The XM-25 was better than the XM-29.
US troops in Afghanistan called it a gamechanger and they loved it.
Taliban ambushes would have become a thing of the past with it.
Do you have more information on NGSW?
And what do you mean "side chargers on ARs are for race guns, not fighting rifles"?
Whats a race gun?
If you really want to see a soldier that carried a Bar and or had men that did (when he/they had to) but hated the thing. I can introduce you to a Sergeant that spent time on Heartbreak Ridge and elsewhere in Korea and he could not stand the bar. Said it was way to heavy. Had ammo that was to heavy and it was so distinctive sounding that you could tell it was a Bar (and thus an American) from way way way far away. And that would occasionally get you into trouble.
So he and his guys did everything they could to get their hands on carbines to take on patrols, So not everyone liked them.
So he and his guys did everything they could to get their hands on carbines to take on patrols, So not everyone liked them.
