AHC - United Indian Subcontinent

Will a United Subcontinent Be Possible ?

  • Yes

    Votes: 85 68.0%

  • No

    Votes: 40 32.0%
  • Total voters
    125

Vikayak Devagiri

Banned
Indian Subcontinent, Along with China has been one of the most populated,richest and ancient places on earth , however, Whereas China has been united for most of history, The Subcontinent has been politically, religiously and linguistically divided for most of its history, as such is there a way possible for Indian Subcontinent, Which includes Bangladesh, Bhutan, India, Maldives, Nepal, Pakistan and Sri Lanka to be United like how China was by the 20th and 21st century ? -
  1. Politically,All of the Subcontinent must be under one rule
  2. Religiously,At least 90% of the Subcontinent must follow a single religion
  3. Linguistically,At Least 90% of the Populace must speak a single Indian based language as lingua franca
Is such unity possible in the Subcontinent ?
 

jatt_scythian

Bhutan has very little in common with the others imo.

I like the idea of a Northern state encompassing all the Indo-Aryan regions of India, Pakistani Punjab and SIndh, and Pashtunistan.
 

Madhukar_Shah

The religious unity seems the hardest part- the definition of Hinduism in its modern form is a product of British colonial categories. quite a few Of the six astika philosophies were previously regarded as separate religious communities, as well as the differences between shaivists and vaishnavas. Not to mention Islam and all the completely different other religions.

the linguistic thing is comparatively easy if you have a big empire that avoids colonisation and spreads its administrative language as a second language throughout the subcontinent. It’d most likely be Braj or Awadhi.

apart from the religious aspect, this could be achieved with a 1700s pod. With the religious aspect involved, I’d say it must have a pod at least in the 600s, most likely earlier.
 

Kaushlendra pratap singh

Banned
Madhav Deval said:
With the religious aspect involved, I’d say it must have a pod at least in the 600s, most likely earlier.
Click to expand...
Single religion in India - a man born in Kerala at end of 8 century in his lifetime of 37 years travel all the subcontinent ended the Buddhism . Established religious school at Badrainath(North) , Dawarka(west) , Puri(east) and Kanchipuram (south) . Who unified Santana religion under the umbrella of this school .
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adi_Shankara

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dashanami_Sampradaya a group of people who teach the religion to Indian People.


In the 16th century, Madhusudana Saraswati of Bengal organised a section of the Naga (naked) tradition of armed sannyasis in order to protect Hindus from the tyranny of the Mughal rulers. These are also called Gusain, Gussain, Gosain, Gossain, Gosine, Gosavi, Sannyāsi.

Warrior-ascetics could be found in Hinduism from at least the 1500s and as late as the 1700s, although tradition attributes their creation to Shankaracharya .
This Gussain also participate in Battle of Buxer in response of opening of Ram Chabutra for Hindu(Babari Masjid )
 

Sriyam Swastik

Politically and religiously integrated indian subcontinent is difficult though not impossible.
However, linguistic unity is going to be hard. Best case scenario is a variant of Braj Bhasa re-integrating with Bengali (they have a common ancestry in Magadhi Prakrit) and slowly colonising the Deccan and the South.
 

Vikayak Devagiri

Banned
jatt_scythian said:
Bhutan has very little in common with the others imo.

I like the idea of a Northern state encompassing all the Indo-Aryan regions of India, Pakistani Punjab and SIndh, and Pashtunistan.
Click to expand...
Bhutan is geographically in South Asia and the Subcontinent
and your second idea is doable, perhaps be stronger mauryan or gupta empire ?
 

Kaushlendra pratap singh

Banned
About languages people forget, there is no need of unified languages in India ( if you are Indian you somewhere hear it-Water change in km and languages in 4km) , only make a Sanskrit as a official or if Muslim so Persian/Urdu no one going to complain .
Sanskrit remain languages of official for thousand years today many village in south regularly use in there life.
Only you have to open Sanskrit class for everyone , no one going to complain against God - languages.
 
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Vikayak Devagiri

Banned
Madhav Deval said:
The religious unity seems the hardest part- the definition of Hinduism in its modern form is a product of British colonial categories. quite a few Of the six astika philosophies were previously regarded as separate religious communities, as well as the differences between shaivists and vaishnavas. Not to mention Islam and all the completely different other religions.

the linguistic thing is comparatively easy if you have a big empire that avoids colonisation and spreads its administrative language as a second language throughout the subcontinent. It’d most likely be Braj or Awadhi.

apart from the religious aspect, this could be achieved with a 1700s pod. With the religious aspect involved, I’d say it must have a pod at least in the 600s, most likely earlier.
Click to expand...
That is diffciult though, but not impossible, perhaps a defeat of Mughal Empire and a Hindu North India will butterfly most of muslims in Punjab and Bengal, as well as in Deccan. Lingustically though, could Sanskrit or Prakrit be an offical language, and religion can be done after 1700 as well, muslims only grew in the latter after of 17 - 18 century
 

Vikayak Devagiri

Banned
Kaushlendra pratap singh said:
About languages people forget, there is no need to unified languages in India , only make a Sanskrit as a official or if Muslim so Persian/Urdu no one going to complain .
Sanskrit remain languages of official for thousand years today many village in south regularly use in there life.
Only you have to open Sanskrit class for everyone , no one going to complain against God - languages.
Click to expand...
That is great suggestion, as Sanskrit is the backbone of all Indian languages in terms Grammer and Vocalbolary, it would be easy to convince them to speak sanskrit to Indian State
 

Vikayak Devagiri

Banned
Kaushlendra pratap singh said:
Single religion in India - a man born in Kerala at end of 8 century in his lifetime of 37 years travel all the subcontinent ended the Buddhism . Established religious school at Badrainath(North) , Dawarka(west) , Puri(east) and Kanchipuram (south) . Who unified Santana religion under the umbrella of this school .
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adi_Shankara

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dashanami_Sampradaya a group of people who teach the religion to Indian People.


In the 16th century, Madhusudana Saraswati of Bengal organised a section of the Naga (naked) tradition of armed sannyasis in order to protect Hindus from the tyranny of the Mughal rulers. These are also called Gusain, Gussain, Gosain, Gossain, Gosine, Gosavi, Sannyāsi.

Warrior-ascetics could be found in Hinduism from at least the 1500s and as late as the 1700s, although tradition attributes their creation to Shankaracharya .
This Gussain also participate in Battle of Buxer in response of opening of Ram Chabutra for Hindu(Babari Masjid )
Click to expand...
Yes, that is possible, am Adi Shankara type figure in 15-16 century to end Islam in the Subcontinent
 

Madhukar_Shah

Defeat the Mughals and by far the most likely result is another Persianate Muslim dynasty takes over and the Mughals are seen as part of the Delhi sultanate. Ending Islam in India is literally impossible barring genocide and mass population transfers after the 14th century. Hemu wins and after a few decades maximum, he or a successor converts in a Raja Ganesh type situation.

Sanskrit had declined precipitously as a language of government and high culture-standard indo aryan by the 15th century was Braj Bhasha or Awadhi, with the former having the religious prestige of coming from the region Krishna was born. Make no mistake, we are in the era of the vernacular.

While it is true that the Muslim population of Bengal at least only massively began to grow in the seventeenth century there is no reason to think this wouldn’t happen with a Hindu government- the Mughals sold land development rights in Bengal primarily to Hindus, who then voluntarily chose to make use of more commercially entrepreneurial Muslim adventurers, who then founded communities and islamised the population. Hindu bankers and gentry were direct causes of the islamisation of Bengal.
 
Dragonspectre

Dragonspectre

The only way I can see the subcontinent being religiously united is with the spread of Buddhism and the best way for that to happen is with the Maurya empire. Spreading a single language is a little bit difficult in India but the Maurya empire can probably make an official language for the entire subcontinent with Sanskrit or Hindi. The Mauryas managed to spread Buddhism successfully in other nations but it is in the subcontinent they ultimately failed. The descendants of Emperor Ashoka were too much entrenched in the ideas of Buddhism and forgave too many dissenters. This led to rebellious elements to form across the land and began assassinating the Mauryan monarchs. Their style of diplomacy has to change and more forceful actions should have been taken. If that is possible they can successfully decentralise their power and unify the entire subcontinent easily.
 
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Madhukar_Shah

Kaushlendra pratap singh said:
Only you have to open Sanskrit class for everyone , no one going to complain against God - languages.
Click to expand...
On the contrary, many people complained about Mughal usage of Sanskrit, as it was seen as defiling a divine language through use in a meccha government- even if there’s a Hindu dynasty in charge for a bit, there will still be many Muslims in the military aristocracy as a matter of course, so that objection will remain.
 

Vikayak Devagiri

Banned
Madhav Deval said:
Defeat the Mughals and by far the most likely result is another Persianate Muslim dynasty takes over and the Mughals are seen as part of the Delhi sultanate. Ending Islam in India is literally impossible barring genocide and mass population transfers after the 14th century. Hemu wins and after a few decades maximum, he or a successor converts in a Raja Ganesh type situation.

Sanskrit had declined precipitously as a language of government and high culture-standard indo aryan by the 15th century was Braj Bhasha or Awadhi, with the former having the religious prestige of coming from the region Krishna was born. Make no mistake, we are in the era of the vernacular.

While it is true that the Muslim population of Bengal at least only massively began to grow in the seventeenth century there is no reason to think this wouldn’t happen with a Hindu government- the Mughals sold land development rights in Bengal primarily to Hindus, who then voluntarily chose to make use of more commercially entrepreneurial Muslim adventurers, who then founded communities and islamised the population. Hindu bankers and gentry were direct causes of the islamisation of Bengal.
Click to expand...
1. Hemu Winning could lead to Hindu North India if he is both succesful as well as lucky enough to ensure a dynasty
2.Sanskrit wil never lose its prevelance as long as Hinduism exists, as such it can be used for a purpose of national language
3.Without a Muslim Mughal ruling over them, Hindus will propobaly never convert of Islam
 

Vikayak Devagiri

Banned
Dragonspectre said:
The only way I can see the subcontinent being religiously united is with the spread of Buddhism and the best way for that to happen is with the Maurya empire. Spreading a single language is a little bit difficult in India but the Maurya empire can probably make an official language for the entire subcontinent with Sanskrit or Hindi. The Mauryas managed to spread Buddhism successfully in other nations but it is in the subcontinent they ultimately failed. The descendants of Emperor Ashoka were too much entrenched in the ideas of Buddhism and forgave too many dissenters. This led to rebellious elements to form across the land and began assassination the Mauryan monarchs. Their style of diplomacy has to change and more forceful actions should have been taken. If that is possible they can successfully decentralise their power and unify the entire subcontinent easily.
Click to expand...
Perhaps Ashoka become the Qin Shi Huang of India with Sanskrit as the Language and Hinduism - Buddhism as the religion
 
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