Miguel Lanius
Banned
I think a big issue in the thread is selling the concepts to audiences that were, uh, less receptive and had different concepts and ways to see these things.
Equal in law and value does not mean equal in capability.
We can understand this difference, but the ancient ones cannot.
...But again, I don't think its a coincidence that most human societies we know of, consider homosexuality a "no-no". I don't know exactly why they do, but if you don't address that issue, they will still remain.
Even the more tolerant societies would find many of our concepts of tolerance unthinkable...
...A man is stronger than a woman. Of course they will think men are better, especially because the strongest individuals are men, and they will impose that vision upon the women. They're the guys with the swords.
Many societies gave great rights to women through history, but modern-like equality is a bit reaching.
Many brutish people will indeed be grossed out by men kissing each other (men, note; sexism means lesbian porn is still popular), but to what extent is that not a culturally set standard? Medieval feudal lords, clergymen, among other groups in old Europe, if i'm not mistaken, kissed each other in various ways despite sex/gender, and few spoke out against that.
I think you're being way too simplistic on the issue of faith here. If there's no Muslim empire(s) to roughly unite the Christians of the old world around a set of issues, the legend of Prester John just won't be created as a justification for strategic alliances, and the "white" Christians will sooner rather than later becry the "black" Christians for being schismatics or closet pagans.
Oh really? Everywhere, every society developed the same beliefs and view points on women and men no exceptions?No, its how they rolled back in ancient history.
A man is stronger than a woman. Of course they will think men are better, especially because the strongest individuals are men, and they will impose that vision upon the women. They're the guys with the swords.
Many societies gave great rights to women through history, but modern-like equality is a bit reaching.
I'd go the opposite way. The dominance of one culture over others tends to breed the sort of social relations and power dynamics that gives rise to racism and makes the imposition of cultural uniformity that upholds racism, sexism and homophobia more likely.For a less racist sexist and homofobic world you would need a dominant Empire or Culture or Religion and that's contradicts the idea of equality gecause the Dominant Entity will enforce such thoughts to the One wfo have not that thoughts
That's from poverty and underdevelopment.How so? India has one of the biggest tech hubs in the world, and is a leader in tech production, still has a patriarchial system in place that sometimes leads to femicide.
Which are influenced greatly by economical situation.Also from societal attitudes
I said "greatly", not "solely".Ehhh, not so sure I agree.
To parrot myself from five months back; Unless you fundamentally change the nature of humanity this question cannot be sufficiently answered.
Now to await the ad hominens and straw positions.
But, indeed, trying to put “conservative”, “progressive” labels on a complicated phenomena does not answer the question. Quite conservative society like Russia of the XVIII was for most of the century ruled by the women and even had a woman as a Chairman of the Academy of Sciences (taking into account that the woman in question was bisexual, should it make Russia of that time “progressive”?). OTOH, while these female rulers hardly could be defined as male pig sexists (ditto for Maria Theresa), there were no females in their governments and no women in the military even if EI and CII liked to pose in the Guards uniform.
Were all these things related to the “Abrahamic religions”? One has to demonstrate how these religions were relevant to the Ancient Greece, Rome, Persia and numerous “barbaric” entities of the pre-Christian period.
As you say, a handful of female rulers doesn't make a better society for women. Exceptions made for the ruling class (and even then, just the monarchy) doesn't mean much for the rest of the population.
Some barbaric societies have alternatively been less sexist, less racist or less homophobic, indicating that there isn't really a constant here, though.