Map Thread XIX

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I was thinking about Neustria keeping Germanic-speaking during middle ages and until today. So I thought "what if Lower Frankish has been established in OTL northern France during the centuries?" and I came up with this:

View attachment 485199

Paris is not Pari(j)s here, the name of Neustria's capital is Lutijs.
OTL eastern Netherlands are part of Germany in this mini-TL.

Maybe not the most super-realistic idea, but I hope you like it anyway.
Ah, and yes: Occitania (Oxitania here) is independent, since the 14th century.

Hey @The Professor it's Francrice!

This is pretty awesome, I too have long pondered what a truly Frankish northern Gaul might look like (of course there's the issue of all those Gallo-Romans being there already, but hey people switching "national identity" was more common back then, just gotta take that pesky "Roman prestige" out back and bash it over the head or something).

I wonder what would become of the rest of !Benelux....Frisians, maybe? I know you said it's part of Germany, but I wonder if Germany itself wouldn't be quite different either, especially if there's a more robust Saxon population (maybe due to all the Franks surely heading west?). Idk, just spitballing.
 
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its done, (mainland) Africa is done, now here are the nations..

  • A neo-jacobin france formed slowly after 1871 that has (terrible) internal borders for Africa, this goes for spain aswell.
  • Industrialized Ethiopia with puppets
  • A surviving Madhist Sudan which is more like an islamist nation
  • numerous fallen states in black coloring
  • a Central African Empire
  • A surviving Kanem-Bornu empire
  • "The peasants republic of Zambeziland" (the leaders wanted to come up with a name independent from the portugese)
  • "union of peasant's socialist republics" (anatolia)
  • Surviving sokoto caliphate which is also more like an islamist nation
  • hell on earth in central and eastern africa
  • Freedonia (liberia) took in a lot of american refugees from the "general's war" in the area
  • A fled french government, made up of slave labor and other things!
  • the boers took back the cape, and, in return caused multiple genocides and assimilations, eventually forcing the South Africa dominion into a boer like status, communists in the north and a surviving orange free state and such
  • Surviving Ashanti empire
  • Communists in the congo & East africa
  • The benin republic in southern nigeria, bent on exiled britishmen for slave labor and cultural extermination
so in all, isnt this africa just wonderful?
 
  • "union of peasant's socialist republics" (anatolia)

Maybe TTL version of socialism is much more agrarian based, however if "UPSR" is supposed to be much more similar to the OTL Soviet Union a name that is basically "Union of Soviet Socialist Republics" but replacing the Russian word for council (Soviet) with Arabic/Turkish word Majlis (or something with a similar meaning) might be a better idea. Just a suggestion.
 
A brief history of various states for a fictional Romance speaking people in the Balkans.
dalmatia.png


1. The first true intent of creating an independent state for the Dalmatian people came following the Napoleonic conquests of the region, where many ethnic Dalmatians willingly took up arms against their Austrian rulers, a gesture which Napoleon repaid by creating a puppet state for them.

2. Recognizing the potential for further unrest, the Austrian monarchs, following their retaking of the region, reorganized the Dalmatian government as a kingdom under their rule, though this action would cause large amounts of unrest among ethnic Croatians, who felt that the territory was wrongfully carved out from their lands.

3. When the first world war broke out, many Dalmatians were conflicted as to who they should side with, with many questioning their willingness to fight their ethnic cousins in Italy and France, and many Dalmatians felt sympathy for the Serbs. This would all boil over in the form of armed uprisings throughout ethnically dalmatian regions in both Austria and occupied Montenegro. This would also mark the first time when Catholic northern Dalmatians and Orthodox southern Dalmatians would fight along side one another.

4. Following the conclusion of the war, many Dalmatians desired for an independent state for themselves, and as such delegates to the league of nations would proposed these borders in 1921, though their request would be ignored in favor of recognizing Yugoslav and Italian ambitions.

5. Anger at their seemingly being ignored by the league would open the door for the rise of extremist ideologies to take root among the Dalmatian people, in particular Fascism. These seeds for extremsim would grow and blossom into an Italian backed armed uprising against the Yugoslav government in 1928. This uprising would cease with the signing of the Treaty of Trogir in 1930, in which Yugoslavia would officially recognize the independence of the state of Dalmatia, though the state itself was effectively an Italian puppet throughout it's existence.

6. Following the end of World War 2, Dalmatia, in return for it's aid to the Allies was granted ethnically Dalmatian territories from Yugoslavia and Italy, though it would soon come at the cost of Soviet forces forcibly establishing a Communist puppet state in the north of the country, leaving a fascist controlled rump state in the south.

7. Under increasing pressure from the Soviet backed north, and continued political isolation from the west, the leader of South Dalmatia would resign in 1951 and have a democratic and capitalist friendly government installed.

8. In 1959, Christian Communist rebels would storm the capital building of North Dalmatia and quickly capture it, at the end of the year and the beginning of 1960, the government would concede to their demands and a Christian dominated regime would be installed, a move which would see many of North Dalmatia's small Sunni minorities in the east flee to Yugoslavia.

9. In 1988, the ruler of North Dalmatia would be assassinated, and the emergency government would see itself overwhelmed by pro democracy uprising throughout the country, and by May of that year, they would resign from power and allow the rebels to move in and establish a democratic government.

10. In 1990, on the 181st anniversary of the establishment of Napoleonic Dalmatia, the two countries would unify together after 44 years of separation.

11. The religious make up of Dalmatia is best described as roughly 70 percent Catholic, 25 percent Orthodox, 2 percent Sunni, and 3 percent irreligious.

12. 80 percent of the country identifies as Dalmatian, 10 percent identify as Croatian, 5 percent as Italian, 2 percent Bosnian, 2 percent Montenegrin, and 1 percent Albanian.
 
Maybe TTL version of socialism is much more agrarian based, however if "UPSR" is supposed to be much more similar to the OTL Soviet Union a name that is basically "Union of Soviet Socialist Republics" but replacing the Russian word for council (Soviet) with Arabic/Turkish word Majlis (or something with a similar meaning) might be a better idea. Just a suggestion.
Ah thanks, I was just inferencing with these names lol, ill take up your idea of it, maybe the union of Majlis peasant republics sounds better.
 
*kills a fuck ton of innocent people and gets away with it due to the fact the slaughter was so thorough almost no cathars survived to tell the tale*

I have a friend who studies medieval French history. She told me that an increasingly popular theory is that either there were never any Cathars, or they were only a small group, and the Albigensian Crusade was basically made up in order to give France and excuse to invade Occitan and kill all their nobles and burghers.
 

Skallagrim

Banned
I have a friend who studies medieval French history. She told me that an increasingly popular theory is that either there were never any Cathars, or they were only a small group, and the Albigensian Crusade was basically made up in order to give France and excuse to invade Occitan and kill all their nobles and burghers.

That's popular only with a certain cohort of contrarians; the sort of historians who like to get attention by "shockingly revising" the mainstream narrative. It's like the whole "there was never a fall of the WRE" trend that popped up in the latter decades of the last century. That was really hip to argue for a while, and has since then been debunked as a gross misrepresentation by a number of very serious academics. But in the mean-time, a group of "bold, revisionist scholars" sold a lot of books! This is an example of the same sort of thing.

The Cathars most certainly existed, and their numbers were not insignificant. The Crusade against them was real, and indeed motivated by very genuine religious zeal on the part of those involved. The idea that Crusades were actually cynical (geo-)political ventures with a mere veneer of religion painted on as an excuse is an example of (always unwise) presentism. That is: the tendency to project current-day sensibilities backwards onto the past. In this case: projecting modern secular sensibilities backwards onto a non-secular age. But religion was important to people back then. A life and death issue-- literally.

This doesn't mean that there were no political motives involved at all: certain local power players used the religious angle in an attempt to gain more traction in a long-running struggle to secure their long-term independence from the ambitions of the French monarchy. That same monarchy certainly used "heresy!!!" as an excuse to crush those same nobles (whether they were really Cathars or not) and expand its own royal authority. The idea that France just got a kick out of "killing all the nobles ans burghers", however, is total bullshit. (If your friend thinks that, I'm afraid that she needs to study a lot more.) The Crusade against the Cathars wasn't an "excuse" in itself. Rather, it presented a few additional "opportunities", and France took those very happily.

An actual issue about the historiography surrounding the Cathars is not their existence, but our flawed insight into their true beliefs. We mostly get descriptions of those from their victorious enemies, and those accounts are likely muddled and biased. We have to rely on compare-and-contrast with the known beliefs of generally similar movements. This leaves room for a lot of interpretation (ranging from "they were a fairly isolated and quite tame off-shoot of mainline Church teachings" to "they were one exponent of a diffuse family of vaguely neo-Gnostically inspired movements").
 
ddfix88-c2930d28-de53-49a7-8a16-10a145f54a49.jpg


Here is a Map I've made of creepy american naton, its weird and overtly masonic.
Map shows the metropol of the third american republic. The plan was originaly for there to be a series of maps on the whole of the country's empire including overseas territories though I'm not sure I'll complete them all.
I kinda prefer my maps to be odd standalone snippets from alternate worlds and like the idea of speculation on how and why all the details came to be. To this end I don't really like attaching long write ups to my maps, but I'm happy to outline a rough sketch of the timeline if there is interest. I usually create low quality world maps to go with these for personal reference and to keep track of the situation.

*Seals that have been used here are not all my own work, some of the seals are my own, some edited, and other just stolen or repurposed.*

[link to deviantart version incase interested: https://www.deviantart.com/qazdr6/art/American-Third-Republic-812137400?ga_submit_new=10:1567627028]
 
ddfix88-c2930d28-de53-49a7-8a16-10a145f54a49.jpg


Here is a Map I've made of creepy american naton, its weird and overtly masonic.
Map shows the metropol of the third american republic. The plan was originaly for there to be a series of maps on the whole of the country's empire including overseas territories though I'm not sure I'll complete them all.
I kinda prefer my maps to be odd standalone snippets from alternate worlds and like the idea of speculation on how and why all the details came to be. To this end I don't really like attaching long write ups to my maps, but I'm happy to outline a rough sketch of the timeline if there is interest. I usually create low quality world maps to go with these for personal reference and to keep track of the situation.

*Seals that have been used here are not all my own work, some of the seals are my own, some edited, and other just stolen or repurposed.*

[link to deviantart version incase interested: https://www.deviantart.com/qazdr6/art/American-Third-Republic-812137400?ga_submit_new=10:1567627028]
I adore the thoughts of a grumpy Washington and his wife, with Congress and everyone loitering around their house.
 
ddfix88-c2930d28-de53-49a7-8a16-10a145f54a49.jpg


Here is a Map I've made of creepy american naton, its weird and overtly masonic.
Map shows the metropol of the third american republic. The plan was originaly for there to be a series of maps on the whole of the country's empire including overseas territories though I'm not sure I'll complete them all.
I kinda prefer my maps to be odd standalone snippets from alternate worlds and like the idea of speculation on how and why all the details came to be. To this end I don't really like attaching long write ups to my maps, but I'm happy to outline a rough sketch of the timeline if there is interest. I usually create low quality world maps to go with these for personal reference and to keep track of the situation.

*Seals that have been used here are not all my own work, some of the seals are my own, some edited, and other just stolen or repurposed.*

[link to deviantart version incase interested: https://www.deviantart.com/qazdr6/art/American-Third-Republic-812137400?ga_submit_new=10:1567627028]

Wait New Jersey is District of Adams and area around NYC is district of St. Johns? Small black republics (I am assuming) are an interesting touch. However I haven't managed to understand what subdivision the Carribbean territories are in. By the way what year is the map set in?
Edit: just realized Delaware doesn't exist as an independent entity in this map.
Edit2: huh just realized what the stars on the flag symbolise. Weirdly specific design on ther part but cool. Then again stars in the OTL Brazilian flag is also weirdly specific.

I adore the thoughts of a grumpy Washington and his wife, with Congress and everyone loitering around their house.

Mount Vernon seems to be the capital of Virginia not the American Republic.
 
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Just began project that consider to be important and serious. Making a Wheel of Time basemap. It will be much better than my original try which was entirely guesswork/freedrawing. But the new one that I just started is being traced on a pretty big and detailed map. Basically all I am doing is drawing over the coasts (later the single lake coast and the political borders too. It will also be used to more accurately depict the city States in the accurate places) and trying to turn a jpg map into an editable PNG map. My plan is to create a worlda in scope even if not in size (The map I am using is more zoomed in than a worlda considering the scale). I do not plan on showing the rivers or the mountains in the finished map at least (and also the towns and cities. Outside of independent City States being shown as a few pixels centered on the the city. Plus maybe Altara and Murandy, being nations where the monarch's power doesn't extend far from their capital, may be coloured in a way that shows this fact. The base nation colour only around the capital and as a outline inside the borders with rest of the nation being coloured like a protectorate.). Anyway I may post it when I think it is presentable even if it isn't finished before posting the finished version.
 
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