Rumsfeldia: Fear and Loathing in the Decade of Tears

[Bookmark1995]

But even so, they suffered like everyone else. People like Brewer would have at least understood it's their fault, so their legacy, while tainted, would be rather mixed, and would spend the rest of their lives in atonement for what they've done.

​

Uh...,"tainted and mixed" doesn't really cover it. ​

The best case scenario for Brewer is "forgive but not forget."

Forgive means letting go of hatred. And considering is Brewer has suffered both deprivation and dehumanization, people might not want to ring blood from a stone and make him suffer more.

But that doesn't change the fact that Brewer and others like him willingly sacrificed American freedom and reputation for their own petty, selfish, and outright unhinged reasons. That doesn't change the fact that Brewer sacrificed his New South credentials abandoned his party for Rumsfeld.

No matter how much Brewer apologizes, his politics will forever be associated with America's downfall as a world power.

Granted, you'd probably have people who refused to believe this was their fault, and those guys would be far more willing to fight for their tattered reputation alongside their apologists.

​

​

Those people wouldn't really have much pull. Thanks to civil war, America's wealth has gone up in smoke, and it is doubtful anyone will give them much money.

One point of contention there.

Turns out, the Nazis only won 40% of the vote - and were most likely going to lose the next election. And that was after the strongarming and bully tactics. A bunch of conservative German politicians then tried to use the Nazis as pawns for their own schemes, made Hitler Chancellor, and it promptly blew up in their faces.

By the time the CVs took over, they were voted in by a broken system. When pre-war Germany's system worked better than yours, that's gotta hurt.

To repeat the Gipper's words; "America was a city on a hill. Lately, the city seems to have caught fire."

Uh...the Weimar Democracy lasted only 14 years. The American Constitution lasted for 200 years, and even survived a secession of several Southern states.

The issue is not that the Weimar Constitution worked better, it is that the American Constitution ITTL was put under strains it never faced before, plus the chief executive was someone who wanted to eliminate popular franchise in favor of a corporatocracy.

The fire Gipper describes could very well be called self-immolation, since the very American leadership slowly burned away at its own institutions.

 

[PGF]

Uh...,"tainted and mixed" doesn't really cover it. ​

The best case scenario for Brewer is "forgive but not forget."

Forgive means letting go of hatred. And considering is Brewer has suffered both deprivation and dehumanization, people might not want to ring blood from a stone and make him suffer more.

But that doesn't change the fact that Brewer and others like him willingly sacrificed American freedom and reputation for their own petty, selfish, and outright unhinged reasons. That doesn't change the fact that Brewer sacrificed his New South credentials abandoned his party for Rumsfeld.

No matter how much Brewer apologizes, his politics will forever be associated with America's downfall as a world power.

​

Those people wouldn't really have much pull. Thanks to civil war, America's wealth has gone up in smoke, and it is doubtful anyone will give them much money.



Uh...the Weimar Democracy lasted only 14 years. The American Constitution lasted for 200 years, and even survived a secession of several Southern states.

The issue is not that the Weimar Constitution worked better, it is that the American Constitution ITTL was put under strains it never faced before, plus the chief executive was someone who wanted to eliminate popular franchise in favor of a corporatocracy.

The fire Gipper describes could very well be called self-immolation, since the very American leadership slowly burned away at its own institutions.

I am just imagining a comic in this timeline of Stalin and other famous and prominent communist, socialist, anarchist etc, looking down on America either smiling seeing it destroyed or the American ones (Like Norman Thomas and others) weeping at there country being destroyed by what they warned against. Or I could just imagine Marx shaking his head and telling America. "I told you so." or something like that.

 

[Bookmark1995]

I am just imagining a comic in this timeline of Stalin and other famous and prominent communist, socialist, anarchist etc, looking down on America either smiling seeing it destroyed or the American ones (Like Norman Thomas and others) weeping at there country being destroyed by what they warned against. Or I could just imagine Marx shaking his head and telling America. "I told you so." or something like that.

Here's how I would rank the reactions of various different groups, from the most upset, to the most amused:

Centrists: "How could this have happened?"

*A person without strong political views, and thus felt no need to question the government, might be the most horrified by what occurred ITTL.

Progressives: "You destroyed democracy all because we said woman should control their bodies?!"

* Progressive Americans will hold a lot of disdain for people who basically traded freedom for hatred of abortion.

Conservatives: "This isn't what we believed! Honest!"

*People with conservative views might see the Rumsfeldians and CVs as having perverted their ideals, and lament that the two forces destroyed them for years to come.

Socialists (in the Western European mold): "How could you American boobs let this happen?"

*Moderate European Socialists would stare their noses down at Americans, while lamenting how they threw away everything good about their country.

Ultra Conservatives: "Douglas Coe was an agent of the British. Christians were the TRUE victims of the CVs ".

* I imagine that the parts of America that were pro-CV will try and pretend that they weren't. The same way OTL Austria has smothered education on the Holocaust. My family hosted an Austrian exchange student, and he didn't know about the Holocaust until he read Elie Wiesel's night.

Libertarians: "This is big government brought to its most logical conclusion."

* Libertarians will shout this to explain why America needs a weak central government.

Anarchists (though the Bozeman-Libertarians are awfully similar): "America was always an empire in disguise. The CVs and Rumsfeld just took off the kid gloves."

* A lot of anarchists see even liberal democracy as oppressive. Just before her death, Emma Goldman thought the Allies were little better than the Axis.

Black Nationalists: "I told you that America was always a nation of slaveholders."

* Black Nationalists see America as a nation always preparing for a black genocide. The persecution of black people in the civil war will make that more obvious to people.

Communists: "HAHAHA. Capitalist pigdogs got what was coming to you."

* Soviet communists might laugh seeing their enemy in ruins.​

Fascists/Nazism: "Good job Americans. Thanks for finally seeing things our way."

* For those people who despise "political correctness" and reverse racism, this America is a dream come true.

The final one is a lot more creepy, because the fact is, Americans embraced a fascism because it wore the mask of freedom and religion, or because those beliefs were no match for prejudice.

 

[PGF]

Here's how I would rank the reactions of various different groups, from the most upset, to the most amused:

Centrists: "How could this have happened?"

*A person without strong political views, and thus felt no need to question the government, might be the most horrified by what occurred ITTL.

Progressives: "You destroyed democracy all because we said woman should control their bodies?!"

* Progressive Americans will hold a lot of disdain for people who basically traded freedom for hatred of abortion.

Conservatives: "This isn't what we believed! Honest!"

*People with conservative views might see the Rumsfeldians and CVs as having perverted their ideals, and lament that the two forces destroyed them for years to come.

Socialists (in the Western European mold): "How could you American boobs let this happen?"

*Moderate European Socialists would stare their noses down at Americans, while lamenting how they threw away everything good about their country.

Ultra Conservatives: "Douglas Coe was an agent of the British. Christians were the TRUE victims of the CVs ".

* I imagine that the parts of America that were pro-CV will try and pretend that they weren't. The same way OTL Austria has smothered education on the Holocaust. My family hosted an Austrian exchange student, and he didn't know about the Holocaust until he read Elie Wiesel's night.

Libertarians: "This is big government brought to its most logical conclusion."

* Libertarians will shout this to explain why America needs a weak central government.

Anarchists (though the Bozeman-Libertarians are awfully similar): "America was always an empire in disguise. The CVs and Rumsfeld just took off the kid gloves."

* A lot of anarchists see even liberal democracy as oppressive. Just before her death, Emma Goldman thought the Allies were little better than the Axis.

Black Nationalists: "I told you that America was always a nation of slaveholders."

* Black Nationalists see America as a nation always preparing for a black genocide. The persecution of black people in the civil war will make that more obvious to people.

Communists: "HAHAHA. Capitalist pigdogs got what was coming to you."

* Soviet communists might laugh seeing their enemy in ruins.​

Fascists/Nazism: "Good job Americans. Thanks for finally seeing things our way."

* For those people who despise "political correctness" and reverse racism, this America is a dream come true.

The final one is a lot more creepy, because the fact is, Americans embraced a fascism because it wore the mask of freedom and religion, or because those beliefs were no match for prejudice.

Also I just realized America literally proved Karl Marx right kind of huh...welp I think leftism probably will take a sharp rise in the future.

 

[Bookmark1995]

Also I just realized America literally proved Karl Marx right kind of huh...welp I think leftism probably will take a sharp rise in the future.

Do you mean Rumsfeldia is the textbook version of what we call OTL "late capitalism". Did Marx predict democracy giving way to corporatism?

 

[PGF]

Do you mean Rumsfeldia is the textbook version of what we call OTL "late capitalism". Did Marx predict democracy giving way to corporatism?

I more mean late-stage capitalism becoming a thing, and somebody like Rumsfield coming to power.

 

[Bookmark1995]

I more mean late-stage capitalism becoming a thing, and somebody like Rumsfield coming to power.

I can definitely imagine ITTL Soviet Russia using America's fate as proof that their brand of socialism is "inevitable". And it would dissuade anyone from proclaiming the joy of "free markets" and moving to the right economically.

But, looking into it deeply, it is quite apt.

Rumsfeld ITTL seems like a Caligula type. His actions not only hasten the fall of a great empire, but his ability to enter power at all foreshadows that the system will enter a death spiral.

I mean, he thought freedom was "turn your nation into a prison camp, and "slaves were not oppressed, but rational economic actors", and didn't leave office until his corporate buddies decided he was messing with their bottom line.

If someone like this can get to power, then an ancient regime is entering its twilight years.

 

[PGF]

I can definitely imagine ITTL Soviet Russia using America's fate as proof that their brand of socialism is "inevitable". And it would dissuade anyone from proclaiming the joy of "free markets" and moving to the right economically.

But, looking into it deeply, it is quite apt.

Rumsfeld ITTL seems like a Caligula type. His actions not only hasten the fall of a great empire, but his ability to enter power at all foreshadows that the system will enter a death spiral.

I mean, he thought freedom was "turn your nation into a prison camp, and "slaves were not oppressed, but rational economic actors", and didn't leave office until his corporate buddies decided he was messing with their bottom line.

If someone like this can get to power, then an ancient regime is entering its twilight years.

Now I gotta ask if Rumsfield discovered his corporate backers and corporate buddies were plotting against him what would of he done? like...I legitimately don't know sense his whole focus on freedom of the economy and all that.

 

[Bookmark1995]

Now I gotta ask if Rumsfield discovered his corporate backers and corporate buddies were plotting against him what would of he done? like...I legitimately don't know sense his whole focus on freedom of the economy and all that.

Well, as I've said before, Rumsfeldia wasn't free market capitalism. Rumsfeldia could be more accurately defined as "hyper-cronyism." Rumsfeld created a system that benefited his corporate cronies.

For example, Ted Turner ITTL has been sent to prison for tax laws that Rummy was already in the process of dismantling. Rumsfeld heavily regulated the television industry (quite a regulatory move) so Hughes Network would have a virtual monopoly on television broadcasting.

To call Rumsfeld a defender of the free-market is complete bullshit. He was a demented dictator in denial, and he would shut anybody up who dared challenge his lunatic policies.

If these corporations had opposed him in early 1987, the peak of his power, then they would've suddenly not been "free market lovers" but "anti-American socialists."

But by late 1987, it appeared he had lost all his power, as even his cronies realized their profits were on the line. By that time, he apparently could do little to stop them.

 

[PGF]

Well, as I've said before, Rumsfeldia wasn't free market capitalism. Rumsfeldia could be more accurately defined as "hyper-cronyism." Rumsfeld created a system that benefited his corporate cronies.

For example, Ted Turner ITTL has been sent to prison for tax laws that Rummy was already in the process of dismantling. Rumsfeld heavily regulated the television industry (quite a regulatory move) so Hughes Network would have a virtual monopoly on television broadcasting.

To call Rumsfeld a defender of the free-market is complete bullshit. He was a demented dictator in denial, and he would shut anybody up who dared challenge his lunatic policies.

If these corporations had opposed him in early 1987, the peak of his power, then they would've suddenly not been "free market lovers" but "anti-American socialists."

But by late 1987, it appeared he had lost all his power, as even his cronies realized their profits were on the line. By that time, he apparently could do little to stop them.

So basically he would of had them all arrested and jailed and then appointed his cronies and yesmen as the heads of there corporations.

Huh...quite a dictator indeed.

 

[Bookmark1995]

So basically he would of had them all arrested and jailed and then appointed his cronies and yesmen as the heads of there corporations.

Huh...quite a dictator indeed.

Yep. Rumsfeld's flaw was thinking that his cronies had more loyalty to him then to their wallets.

 

[PGF]

Yep. Rumsfeld's flaw was thinking that his cronies had more loyalty to him then to their wallets.

honestly even if the cvers didnt take power could of the dems and WTP rolled things back enough where there back at FDR era?, could of they fixed this mess.

 

[TRH]

So basically he would of had them all arrested and jailed and then appointed his cronies and yesmen as the heads of there corporations.

Huh...quite a dictator indeed.

If he'd realized the whole world was against him, he'd have destroyed the whole world out of spite. Easy decision there.

 

[Deleted member 96212]

If he'd realized the whole world was against him, he'd have destroyed the whole world out of spite. Easy decision there.

This would be Rumsfeld if he understood how screwed he really was:

This makes me, wonder, where's Steven King ITTL? I recently finished The Stand, which had a few elements that made me think of Rumsfeldia in it.

 

[Bookmark1995]

honestly even if the cvers didnt take power could of the dems and WTP rolled things back enough where there back at FDR era?, could of they fixed this mess.

That will be one of the big questions ITTL. But as Rumsfeld has left things when he shown the door, well there was too much anger and resentment to form any kind of unity party.

 

[Bookmark1995]

If he'd realized the whole world was against him, he'd have destroyed the whole world out of spite. Easy decision there.

So it would've been like Goebbels and his wife poisoning their children to "save them" from a world without socialism, or Hitler ordering what remained of Germany to be destroyed, believing the Germans had failed him.

Rumsfeld deciding the world was unfit for "freedom", and thus declaring it had no right to live.

 

[The Jovian]

This makes me, wonder, where's Steven King ITTL? I recently finished The Stand, which had a few elements that made me think of Rumsfeldia in it.

Somewhere in Canada I imagine given his disdain for religious fundamentalism and conservatism.

 

[DG Valdron]

I imagine toward people like Brewer, there wouldn't be much sympathy. The public attitude toward Brewer would be "you reap what you sow."

If Brewer had given a shit about the Constitution, he wouldn't have been imprisoned and dehumanized. But Brewer, like many Rumsfeldians, grew up in relative comfort and safety and thus took for granted the institutions that ensured those things.

Like everybody else, he imagined that it couldn't happen here, and thus saw little problem in his grotesquely reactionary actions.

It's not as if Brewer can say 'oopsy' and all his misdeeds are undone. The fact that he eventually suffered doesn't erase the harm he did.

 

[Voltron64]

So it would've been like Goebbels and his wife poisoning their children to "save them" from a world without socialism, or Hitler ordering what remained of Germany to be destroyed, believing the Germans had failed him.

Rumsfeld deciding the world was unfit for "freedom", and thus declaring it had no right to live.

"That didn’t happen.


And if it did, it wasn’t that bad.


And if it was, that’s not a big deal.


And if it is, that’s not my fault.


And if it was, I didn’t mean it.


And if I did…


You deserved it."

(Personally, I think an addendum to that prayer should be "And since I did it...please don't kill me.")

 

[Bookmark1995]

It's not as if Brewer can say 'oopsy' and all his misdeeds are undone. The fact that he eventually suffered doesn't erase the harm he did.

In the Twilight of Hope, he actually tried to do it. He said he was "defending the family," in order to excuse his actions to Jackie Kennedy. Jackie, who lost one of her nephews to Rumsfeld (and who ended up in a mass grave), didn't take kindly to it.

He only regretted what he did after he was enslaved and dehumanized, but even so, he will probably never enjoy a political career again.

"That didn’t happen.


And if it did, it wasn’t that bad.


And if it was, that’s not a big deal.


And if it is, that’s not my fault.


And if it was, I didn’t mean it.


And if I did…


You deserved it."

(Personally, I think an addendum to that prayer should be "And since I did it...please don't kill me.")

Where did this come from, and what does it mean?