RodentRevolution
Banned
With Canada, it's 1:100.
Wait you are saying the population of the USA was close to 800 million in 1914....how in heavens name did you lose all those people?
With Canada, it's 1:100.
It was occupied 20 years after the war. They were allowed to vote only in 1895.I apologize, but in this scenario is the South independent or part of the U.S.? If the latter, then has it been successfully re-integrated into the U.S. or is it still being "occupied"?
It was occupied 20 years after the war. They were allowed to vote only in 1895.
This is when racism comes into play. In 1914, the British Empire was not going to call on black or Indian units to fight another white nation. They may be used for garrison duty to free up white Infantry regiments, but they're not being called on enter combat. Plus, there's the issue of getting all those soldiers to Canada. Doing it before the war is politically impossible (and will trigger a preemptive DoW by the US), while doing it after the war starts means fighting past the USN. Some will obviously get through. But I doubt enough would to matter.If we are talking about a war between the USA and the British Empire then surely we should be comparing their populations.
The closest to 1914 i can easily find is 1907 when the USA had 5.5% of the world population, and the British Empire had 22.4%.
Also there was a lot more support in the colonies for fighting to defend the British Empire, and it's trade routes than there was for fighting in Europe. Australia, and New Zealand supported a war with Germany mainly because they had been sold on the German Fleet being a threat to their trade routes with Britain.
Okay you got me there I mean it was a whole six weeks after the declaration of war IOTL before Indian Soldiers were deployed in the Ypres Salient, and it wasn't until October 1914 that the Indian Army took part in the Battle of La Bassee against the Germans who of course aren't really a white nation. [SARCASM OFF]This is when racism comes into play. In 1914, the British Empire was not going to call on black or Indian units to fight another white nation. They may be used for garrison duty to free up white Infantry regiments, but they're not being called on enter combat. Plus, there's the issue of getting all those soldiers to Canada. Doing it before the war is politically impossible (and will trigger a preemptive DoW by the US), while doing it after the war starts means fighting past the USN. Some will obviously get through. But I doubt enough would to matter.
Realistically the amount of butterfly netting you are going to have for the USA to change as much is proposed, and for the British Empire to carry on as if nothing has happened would put it well into ASB. With a hostile USA south of the border there is going to be a bigger British garrison, and a bigger better trained, and equipped Canadian Militia, and Regular Force Army. Also IOTL Japan was an ally of Britain and captured German Pacific Territories, ITTL it would be reasonable to expect that the Japanese would be doing doing something similar to US Pacific territory.
Spanish American War happened as OTLAmerican aquisition of the Phillipenes
A meaningless statistic. Counting Africa and India into the number is inflating it but neither of those two will be used in any war.The closest to 1914 i can easily find is 1907 when the USA had 5.5% of the world population, and the British Empire had 22.4%.
As I pointed out above the Indian Army was deployed in France six weeks after the start of WW1 and did fight there so I don't see why you believe they would not be used against the USA. In 1914 the Indian Army was the second biggest all volunteer army in the world, being slightly smaller than the British army. The Indian army in WW1 was an all volunteer force which deployed over a Million Indian Army troops served overseas in the Indian Expeditionary Forces, while at home they maintained units on the North West Frontier, and doing Internal Security work consisting of 11 Divisions, and 5 Brigades. Also India produced arms and ammunition.A meaningless statistic. Counting Africa and India into the number is inflating it but neither of those two will be used in any war.
While calculating Britain's warmaking capacity, India and Africa should immediately be dropped.
Somehow I think the US will be able to manage without a supply of pineapples for a few years, given Hawaii is going to be the frayed end of the long logistical shoestring the Japanese are going to be able to establish for a Pacific War. Their impact will be negligible, at best. There's very little of import for the US in the Pacific at this point, assuming butterflies haven't moved away American aquisition of the Phillipenes at all in which case you're claiming a few coral reefs and guano covered sandbars for the most part.
Copper, nitrates, certain grades of iron ore, those kind of important war materials. The British meanwhile had better hope they looked properly at the carbonisation of coal to oil pre-war. Of course the important point here is that it is a Brit rather than an American who has some idea of what each sides critical imports that would be affected in such a war would be despite the USA having the foremost higher education system in the world and one that makes a lot of materials on such questions freely available.
Oh, so they're talking about the South American Region/Southeast Pacific. A bit odd to make the IJN a notable part of the post them, given Japan dosen't have the power projection to operate down there. Neither would the Royal Navy be able to keep ships out their for any reasonable length of time, given the isolation from recoiling stations and other sources of resupply along with the US ability to sorted down from California to counter any attempt at a sturdy blockade. With all the other demands on the British Fleet, where can they scrape together a South Pacific force from? To say nothing of the need to protect against American commerce raiding.
And don't say France. The problems of cohalition warfare must be recognized, and France is no dependent client who'll submit their navy to British strategic command and purpose.
There is a HUGE difference in sending a single ship to patrol an area, and maintaining a fleet there. Neither the RN or USN could maintain a battle squadron, let alone a full fleet, off South America. Neither country has a major naval base close enough. The Americans are definitely closer though with the Charleston Navy Yard on the East Coast and several major ports on the west (both San Diego and Long Beach likely get developed earlier in TTL). The UK's closet major naval base is in England (Neither Halifax nor Bermuda can support a major fleet, though Halifax is likely more developed with associated Canadian industry ITTL). Even assuming that the UK does that, the US fleet is closer and the British have to fight past the USN just to get to S America from Halifax.The RN routinely had ships patrolling both the Atlantic and Pacific coasts of South America
@RodentRevolution
The British would need to deploy far more forces in the Western Hemisphere than a simple basic patrol route though. They'd have field a force capable of providing a consistent barrier to regional traffic and resist that barrier being disrupted by American operations from the Pacific Fleet (Which is nothing to sneeze at). Port Stanley can only support so big for a force for so long, especially if the supply routes of the Falklands from Britain proper are disrupted or tonnage being given priority for other areas. The Entente has a long list of tasks for its merchant fleet even IOTL, and that's only going to be a greater issue since Canadian operations now have to be supported, lack of American and Canadian commodities is going to require drawing imports (Assuming you can find them) of things such a food from further afield and in greater qualitites, and prize hull seizures at the start of the war are liable to be to the US's advantage given the balance of global merchantmen at this point, and because of this I doublt you'll be able to treat Port Stanley as a Scapa Flow or even Halifax so far as supporting operations go. California, on the other hand, can support a proper attack force easy enough (And Southern California in the 1910's won't be running out of refined petrol to keep them running).
As for France putting her fleet at the disposal of British strategic concerns, allies does not mean total unity of operation and interests on the opposite. After all, we diden't seen Japanese soldiers on the Western Front. Now, you might be able to get France to pick up some slack in the blockade to free up British ships for deployment to the Americas, but now you're dividing command and that rarely works out well for the combat quality and coordination if the Germans do sail out. The impact of the HSF on the situation in the Americas is coincidental, not Germany yielding to American interests: just by existing and acting on German naval policy they lock down a large number of British hulls, as any ship in the North Sea is a ship that isen't in North America.
There are also those Islands in the North Pacific, the Aleutians which in WW2 the Japanese decided would make a nice addition to their Empire, and staging points for an attack on Alaska. Not exactly what most people think of when they talk about Pacific Islands.Somehow I think the US will be able to manage without a supply of pineapples for a few years, given Hawaii is going to be the frayed end of the long logistical shoestring the Japanese are going to be able to establish for a Pacific War. Their impact will be negligible, at best. There's very little of import for the US in the Pacific at this point, assuming butterflies haven't moved away American aquisition of the Phillipenes at all in which case you're claiming a few coral reefs and guano covered sandbars for the most part.