New World: A Different Americas

[Gabingston]

So, I have had this idea floating around in my head recently for a new timeline.

• Due to various divergences throughout history, North America is made up of upwards of a dozen different countries, instead of just the big three of the U.S., Canada and Mexico.
  
• Some of these countries include a Russian Alaska, a Spanish-speaking California and Florida, The Thirteen Colonies splitting into multiple countries, most of the Southwest being Mexican and the French keeping Louisiana (or at least the Southern half of it).
• Latin America might have larger countries like Gran Colombia and Central America still existing, but Brazil being split into several countries, I'm still thinking about it.

I know that timelines like this already exist (such as https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/another-america-a-map-and-graphic-setting.442437/), but I wanted to put my own take on this concept. I know I'm probably infamous for starting tons of TL's and not sticking with them, but I hope I wouldn't get bored with this.

 

[Gabingston]

Here's my general idea for The Thirteen Colonies and the countries they would become (east of the Appalachians)

• New England is OTL's U.S. States of Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Connecticut, Vermont, New Hampshire and Maine, plus the Canadian provinces of Nova Scotia and New Brunswick
• A Mid-Atlantic country would be New York, New Jersey and Pennsylvania, with Maryland and Delaware possibly being part of this country.
• An Upper Southern country made up of Virginia, as well as possibly North Carolina, Maryland and Delaware.
• A Deep Southern country made up of South Carolina and Georgia, as well as possibly North Carolina.

I've still got to figure out what happens with the states that could go either way, please leave some suggestions.

 

[Gabingston]

I am working on a preliminary map of North America now, I will post it soon and see what you guys think.

 

[Gabingston]

Map of North America

Map of North America​

• 
  
  
  • Pink = Canada
  • Green = New England
  • Light Blue = The North (please suggest name)
  • Grey = Virginia
  • Maroon = The South (please suggest name)
  • Sandy Color = Florida
  • Bluish Purple = Louisiana
  • Light Red = Columbia
  • Dark Green = Alyeska
  • Tan = California
  • Gold = Mexico
  • Yellow-Green = Central America
  • Orange = Cuba
  • Brown = Haiti
  • Bright Blue = Dominican Republic
  • Yellow = Overseas Spanish Territory
  • Red = Overseas British Territory
  • Blue = Overseas French Territory

 

[Pragmatic Progressive]

Maroon = The South (please suggest name)

If it is communist, maybe Republic of the New African Poor?

 

[Rosella]

If it is communist, maybe Republic of the New African Poor?

What makes you think this is a good idea?

 

[Gabingston]

If it is communist, maybe Republic of the New African Poor?

Well, Dark Red could either represent Communism or Fascism, and I think it is quite possible that the Deep South could be totalitarian in some form, whether it be a Communist regime or a quasi-Fascist Apartheid regime, I don't see the Planter Class still ruling into the present day. Please leave suggestions in the comments as to how the Deep South would be (and suggest some names as well).

 

[Gabingston]

I have a general idea for how New England, The North (please suggest name) and Virginia will turn out:

• New England is a small, wealthy nation with generally center-left politics (although rural areas are more conservative), you could compare it to The Netherlands or The Nordic Countries.
• The North is the most populated out of the former Thirteen Colonies states, with a large divide between the big, left-wing cities (New York, Philly, Chicago etc.) and the conservative hinterland, although it is less polarized than OTL's U.S. is in 2019. Comparable to OTL's Northern U.S.
• Virginia was historically a poor, rural nation with a small planter class ruling, although not as corrupt as the Deep South's planter class (Virginia did have Jefferson and Washington, after all), but has become significantly more prosperous and more racially equal in the past 60 or 70 years, although there still is a racial divide.

 

[Gabingston]

In case you're wondering about my political views IRL, I'm generally center-right.

 

[kissatytto]

I don't particularly see why your political views would really matter at this point, but thanks I guess? If I could make some suggestions, they would include:

• rename "Virginia." It doesn't really make any sense for that nation to be called that, particularly when NC shared a lot of kinship with its southern sister in colonial times.
• Don't put Delaware in with "The North." For one, the borders look awkward, and also Delaware shares many more ties with Maryland than it does with any other region. Split Delmarva never looks particularly good.
• Change up Florida's borders. The borders you have there come from the USA state, which likely wouldn't end up independent once it was integrated into the USA.
• California also wouldn't have the US state borders, you'd best fix those.
• United Central America is a bit of a cop-out. Maybe split it back up, or have Mexico play some sort of role in the region.

 

[Gabingston]

I don't particularly see why your political views would really matter at this point, but thanks I guess? If I could make some suggestions, they would include:

• rename "Virginia." It doesn't really make any sense for that nation to be called that, particularly when NC shared a lot of kinship with its southern sister in colonial times.
• Don't put Delaware in with "The North." For one, the borders look awkward, and also Delaware shares many more ties with Maryland than it does with any other region. Split Delmarva never looks particularly good.
• Change up Florida's borders. The borders you have there come from the USA state, which likely wouldn't end up independent once it was integrated into the USA.
• California also wouldn't have the US state borders, you'd best fix those.
• United Central America is a bit of a cop-out. Maybe split it back up, or have Mexico play some sort of role in the region.

Working on an updated map based on the feedback, although I can't see Florida's borders being different, since the South would want a port on the Gulf.

 

[Gabingston]

I'm using a HOI4 Map as my base map.

 

[Deleted member 82792]

Maybe make the 'South' more a populist but left leaning state.

California could be more like OTL California on steroids but with a bit more Spanish and Native American in the mix. And more Chinese and Asian immigration.

Louisiana could be a mix of Quebec and Native American.

What do you guys think?

 

[Gabingston]

Maybe make the 'South' more a populist but left leaning state.

California could be more like OTL California on steroids but with a bit more Spanish and Native American in the mix. And more Chinese and Asian immigration.

Louisiana could be a mix of Quebec and Native American.

What do you guys think?

Here are my plans:
The South: Likely authoritarian, either communist or a semi-Fascist apartheid state.
California: OTL Argentina, but slightly wealthier, less corrupt and more Asian (especially Filipino) influenced.
Louisiana: French speaking, but with Hispanic, Italian, Irish, African and Native influences.

 

[Gabingston]

Here is the Viceroyalty of New Spain in 1818. As you can see, Central America is under one subdivision of the colony, the Kingdom of Guatemala. California ITTL secedes from Mexico due to it's geographic distance from Mexico City and cultural disconnect (California is more European than the mainly Mestizo Mexicans, although Mexico receives much more European immigration than IOTL), so the primarily Mayan Central Americans might secede as well due to the distance, rough terrain and cultural differences, and remain one country.

 

[Deleted member 82792]

Here are my plans:
The South: Likely authoritarian, either communist or a semi-Fascist apartheid state.
California: OTL Argentina, but slightly wealthier, less corrupt and more Asian (especially Filipino) influenced.
Louisiana: French speaking, but with Hispanic, Italian, Irish, African and Native influences.

The apartheid state sounds a little cliche, but authoritarian sounds good.

 

[Gian]

I have an idea @Gabingston, butterfly away the Acadian Expulsion and have Nova Scotia be a (largely) bilingual French-Gaelic province/state (trilingual French-English-Gaelic if it includes New Brunswick and thus the St. Johns valley).

 

[Gabingston]

I have an idea @Gabingston, butterfly away the Acadian Expulsion and have Nova Scotia be a (largely) bilingual French-Gaelic province/state (trilingual French-English-Gaelic if it includes New Brunswick and thus the St. Johns valley.

The POD is in the Late 18th century, after the Acadian Expulsion. The Cajuns still end up in Louisiana, although the majority of Louisianais today are descended from 19th and Early 20th century settlers from France, Italy, Ireland, Spain/Spanish America, Germany and Poland.

 

[Gabingston]

The apartheid state sounds a little cliche, but authoritarian sounds good.

Segregation survived until the 60s (and only ended due to federal orders) and Apartheid survived in South Africa until the 90s (and only ended due to International Pressure and the realization that White minority rule was unsustainable), so it's possible that The South would either still be segregated or that it would only have ended in the last quarter century.

 

[Gian]

The POD is in the Late 18th century, after the Acadian Expulsion. The Cajuns still end up in Louisiana, although the majority of Louisianais today are descended from 19th and Early 20th century settlers from France, Italy, Ireland, Spain/Spanish America, Germany and Poland.

Why are you (and everyone else for that matter) so averse to having an opportunity for a Nova Scotia that embraces both the Scots and Acadians? (I have to ask)