I think the Rajput Kings are pretty autonomous under the Empire as vassals and well the Ahoms are also their vassals (the previous king's daughter is the current Emperor's wife). And some clans (I minority of them which didn't support the rebellion against the Empire which was quite a long time ago) in the erstwhile Vijayanagara Empire, may have been ruling as not quite autonomous but still as vassals of the Emperor (a majority of the rebelling lords had their fiefs seized when the rebellion was put down, am I right VV? ).
The Sun Will Rise: Mary I of England has a Son
- Thread starter VVD0D95
- Start date
I think the Rajput Kings are pretty autonomous under the Empire as vassals and well the Ahoms are also their vassals (the previous king's daughter is the current Emperor's wife). And some clans (I minority of them which didn't support the rebellion against the Empire which was quite a long time ago) in the erstwhile Vijayanagara Empire, may have been ruling as not quite autonomous but still as vassals of the Emperor (a majority of the rebelling lords had their fiefs seized when the rebellion was put down, am I right VV? ).
For the issue of Constantinople, if you're going to make it a part of the Holy Roman Empire then make it a Free Imperial City and outside of the Emperor's domains. That way the Tsar and no other European ruler will get all pissy that the Hapsburg's are ruling Constantinople and no single power can control it. As for its rulers you should have a relative of Matthias marry a daughter of Dmitri and have the them become rulers of the city. That way the two greatest powers, Austria and Russia, will have a say in how to run the city and the Romanovs can't cry foul over not having any say in its rule. Also don't be like the Latin's and make it a Catholic only state. Make it free to all forms of Christianity, though Matthias would give more autonomy and freedom to the Orthodox to prevent Protestantism from gaining a foothold.
The other option is to revive the Byzantine Empire and have an Hapsburg be the new Emperor and marry a Romanov so that once again Russia has a say.
VVD0D95
Banned
Alright interesting. I suppose first of all the Crusaders need to take Adrianople before they can be concerned about Constantinople itself.
Alright what the Ottomans are thinking about all this? They still busy in cracking the skulls of their siblings? For God's sake their capital is at stake!! Anyways haven't the Ottoman governors in Asia declared freedom or picked sides? Because TTL seems to be silent on that issue.
Mrstrategy
Banned
why did the crusades dont go to get back the middle east lands that use to be crusade states?
Mrstrategy
Banned
if they get the middle east states back is it going to be the same states as before?
VVD0D95
Banned
1616
The Imperial forces under the command of Emperor Matthias head towards the Siege of Adrianople, destroying what little resistance there is from the Turk. Joining the siege, the Emperor meets with his Russian counterpart, and there and then they discuss what will happen once the city falls, and what will happen when Constantinople falls. The result is the Treaty of the Camps which states that Dmitri’s daughter Olga, shall marry The Emperor’s brother Maximillian, Archduke of Austria, and be declared Ruler of Constantinople. Once that treaty is signed a full effort is put into taking Adrianople. As the campaign season looks as if it is about to end, the city surrenders. Though not before, the last remaining Princes of the House of Osman escape. The two emperors show peace toward the residents and pardon them, whilst also getting them to recognise Maximillian as their liege.
For the forces of Spain and England, the push into the Greek Peninsular starts well, battles are fought and won, and they soon find that the Greek Populous is more than happy to accept them as their saviours from Ottoman rule. However, as the moons go on, they soon find that they are running short of money, and of patience. Word from the Thrace is slow to come, and when it does come the aims are not coherent. Eventually, the two Kings decide to make a push toward Athens, and from there to see what will happen, though as their money trickles out, their soldiers grow increasingly restless.
Emperor Vijay, determined to break the power of the Rajputs moves further and further into their territory, laying waste to any small band of forces he comes across. And yet the desert remains the Rajput’s greatest ally, and the emperor’s greatest foe. Eventually, the Emperor is forced to seek shelter in Gwalior, taking the fort there as his residence. He sends out feelers to the various Rajput tribes, and offers a parlay. An offer that is taken up by some. There they meet and discuss their grievances, which mainly centre around the religious disputes. When the Emperor makes it clear that he will not bend on seeing himself as the incarnation of the trimurti, the Rajput rulers leave in disgust, and war begins again.
The Imperial forces under the command of Emperor Matthias head towards the Siege of Adrianople, destroying what little resistance there is from the Turk. Joining the siege, the Emperor meets with his Russian counterpart, and there and then they discuss what will happen once the city falls, and what will happen when Constantinople falls. The result is the Treaty of the Camps which states that Dmitri’s daughter Olga, shall marry The Emperor’s brother Maximillian, Archduke of Austria, and be declared Ruler of Constantinople. Once that treaty is signed a full effort is put into taking Adrianople. As the campaign season looks as if it is about to end, the city surrenders. Though not before, the last remaining Princes of the House of Osman escape. The two emperors show peace toward the residents and pardon them, whilst also getting them to recognise Maximillian as their liege.
For the forces of Spain and England, the push into the Greek Peninsular starts well, battles are fought and won, and they soon find that the Greek Populous is more than happy to accept them as their saviours from Ottoman rule. However, as the moons go on, they soon find that they are running short of money, and of patience. Word from the Thrace is slow to come, and when it does come the aims are not coherent. Eventually, the two Kings decide to make a push toward Athens, and from there to see what will happen, though as their money trickles out, their soldiers grow increasingly restless.
Emperor Vijay, determined to break the power of the Rajputs moves further and further into their territory, laying waste to any small band of forces he comes across. And yet the desert remains the Rajput’s greatest ally, and the emperor’s greatest foe. Eventually, the Emperor is forced to seek shelter in Gwalior, taking the fort there as his residence. He sends out feelers to the various Rajput tribes, and offers a parlay. An offer that is taken up by some. There they meet and discuss their grievances, which mainly centre around the religious disputes. When the Emperor makes it clear that he will not bend on seeing himself as the incarnation of the trimurti, the Rajput rulers leave in disgust, and war begins again.
Thanks for taking my advice on the Constantinople affair. Does this mean that it will be a city state or a resurrected Byzantine Empire? Also I'm surprised by the restlessness of the troops. Even with lower money they should still be dedicated to the fight as virtually every common soldier in this era was extremely devout. Going on a holy Crusade meant to push Islam off of Europe for good should motivate these men to fight to the death as they would probably imagine dying in battle would grant them a place in battle. Even with the Tenth Crusade not reaching into Anatolia it will be the most successful since the first and will give the Catholic Church a huge amount of strength for the rest of the century.
By the way when will India start reguarly interacting with Europe. I admit I haven't been commenting on it but that's mostly due to my low knowledge of Indian history. It will be kind of interesting if Hindustan manages to compete equally with the European Powers in the 19th century. Also what is happening in Japan? Is it the same as OTL or did stuff change such as the Christians gaining power? A Catholic Japan would be a pretty fun divergence with everything else that's going on. I can imagine that some Daimyos convert to Catholicism and then declare independence, later asking the Spanish to ally with them by being Spain's protectorate and then having their support in unifying Japan into a Catholic state.
By the way when will India start reguarly interacting with Europe. I admit I haven't been commenting on it but that's mostly due to my low knowledge of Indian history. It will be kind of interesting if Hindustan manages to compete equally with the European Powers in the 19th century. Also what is happening in Japan? Is it the same as OTL or did stuff change such as the Christians gaining power? A Catholic Japan would be a pretty fun divergence with everything else that's going on. I can imagine that some Daimyos convert to Catholicism and then declare independence, later asking the Spanish to ally with them by being Spain's protectorate and then having their support in unifying Japan into a Catholic state.
VVD0D95
Banned
1617
In the Greek Peninsular, Spanish and English forces push onward, not bothering to stop and take in the scenery. Their men, buoyed by fresh supplies and a new amount of money, continue to fight fiercely and loyally. Castles and towns along the central part of Thessaly fall to the combined forces, with many places surrendering voluntarily, to avoid a brutal fate. Arriving at Levadia, the forces decide to attack Athens from two directions to further confuse the Ottoman defenders. As they march, the governor of Athens, the home of what would come to be known as Democracy, throws the gates open to the invading force, and accepts banishment. The year ends with celebrations, as the crusading forces joined by Greek nobles plan to move toward the island of Morea.
In Adrianople, the Emperors of the Holy Roman Empire and the Russian Empire, agree that Maximillian will convert to Orthodoxy and provide a haven for Catholics and Orthodox Christians. The exclusion of Protestants, greatly angers the Kings of Denmark and Sweden, though there is little they can truly do about it. Eventually, the push toward the holy city of Constantinople begins, as the armies’ march, the songs and ballads of the days are being written, including one famous song penned by an anonymous soldier known simply as ‘The Heavenly March.’ Siege lines are drawn, and the siege of the city begins.
Elsewhere in the Ottoman Empire, the results of the turmoil in Europe spark governors all across the Arab peninsular and the Middle East to revolt. Governors are either killed and their soldiers executed, or they join in the revolts and begin plaguing other governors who refuse to do the same. The Persians, resting in Mesopotamia, look at this with glee, and begin their own plans to claim the Arabian Peninsula as their own.
Emperor Vijay, resting in Gwalior, takes time to assess the status of his army, as well as reports of Rajput movements. As slowly as he can, he begins assembling the forces once more. This is done as a clever ploy to lull the Rajputs into thinking he is going to do one thing, when in fact he is doing the other. The ploy works and he manages to capture three important Rajput Princes, hanging their bodies from the fortress at Gwalior, before issuing a declaration stating that any who reject the power of the Brahmins will be welcomed as valued citizens.
In the Greek Peninsular, Spanish and English forces push onward, not bothering to stop and take in the scenery. Their men, buoyed by fresh supplies and a new amount of money, continue to fight fiercely and loyally. Castles and towns along the central part of Thessaly fall to the combined forces, with many places surrendering voluntarily, to avoid a brutal fate. Arriving at Levadia, the forces decide to attack Athens from two directions to further confuse the Ottoman defenders. As they march, the governor of Athens, the home of what would come to be known as Democracy, throws the gates open to the invading force, and accepts banishment. The year ends with celebrations, as the crusading forces joined by Greek nobles plan to move toward the island of Morea.
In Adrianople, the Emperors of the Holy Roman Empire and the Russian Empire, agree that Maximillian will convert to Orthodoxy and provide a haven for Catholics and Orthodox Christians. The exclusion of Protestants, greatly angers the Kings of Denmark and Sweden, though there is little they can truly do about it. Eventually, the push toward the holy city of Constantinople begins, as the armies’ march, the songs and ballads of the days are being written, including one famous song penned by an anonymous soldier known simply as ‘The Heavenly March.’ Siege lines are drawn, and the siege of the city begins.
Elsewhere in the Ottoman Empire, the results of the turmoil in Europe spark governors all across the Arab peninsular and the Middle East to revolt. Governors are either killed and their soldiers executed, or they join in the revolts and begin plaguing other governors who refuse to do the same. The Persians, resting in Mesopotamia, look at this with glee, and begin their own plans to claim the Arabian Peninsula as their own.
Emperor Vijay, resting in Gwalior, takes time to assess the status of his army, as well as reports of Rajput movements. As slowly as he can, he begins assembling the forces once more. This is done as a clever ploy to lull the Rajputs into thinking he is going to do one thing, when in fact he is doing the other. The ploy works and he manages to capture three important Rajput Princes, hanging their bodies from the fortress at Gwalior, before issuing a declaration stating that any who reject the power of the Brahmins will be welcomed as valued citizens.
I think that the move with Maximilian converting to Orthodoxy while not a bad idea is not an only option. The best move would be to have Maximilian convert to Eastern Catholicism. Eastern Catholicism is essentially a denomination of the Catholic Church which has several parts of Orthodoxy in its creed and practice, but still practices the main sacraments and is in full communion with the Pope. It would be best for Max to convert to this as he is still technically a Catholic and it would strengthen the regional Eastern Catholic Churches in the region which have just been founded over the last century, something the Hapsburgs will want in order to gain the support of the Pope and spread Catholicism to unify the region under the influence of the HRE. I think that Dmitri might be okay with this as it does not directly spread the influence of the Pope and the Orthodox Church will still maintain greater power. Also in the agreement Olga can still practice Orthodoxy and their first son could be free to become an Orthodox. We could also have dual ceremonies such as a coronation in the Hagia Sophia (which should go to the Orthodox Church for a compromise) and have a marriage be conducted by an Eastern Catholic priest. I think that Paul's endgoal of this is to hopefully proclaim a council between Rome and Moscow/Constantinople that would begin faith dialogue to push for unification of the two churches, so he would approve of this plan. Also if Maximilian is to become Eastern Catholic then it should be of the Byzantine Rite. Whatever happens though is your choice.
By the way I've been making geopolitical plans for how Matthias might want to divide the Balkans after the Tenth Crusade. Here is my idea:
By the way I've been making geopolitical plans for how Matthias might want to divide the Balkans after the Tenth Crusade. Here is my idea:
- Archduchy of Austria and all of its HRE lands before the Crusade, including Bohemia.
- Kingdom of Hungary with the restoration of all of its previous lands and the Romanian duchies of Wallachia, Moldavia, and Transylvania. Transylvania will become a part of Hungary while Moldavia and Transylvania can either become part of Hungary or as seperate Duchies that will go to Matthias's personal control. Matthias is King of Hugnary.
- New Byzantine Empire with Emperor Maximilian and Empress Olga. All of purple is Byzantine.
- Kingdom of Croatia which is a junior in a personal union to the Kingdom of Hungary. All Croatian lands shall be administered under Matthias as King of Hungary but shall have separate autonomy.
- Duchy of Bosnia. An vassal duchy in the Holy Roman Empire that will be outside of the Hapsburgs direct lands.
- Principality of Albania. An vassal principality of the Holy Roman Empire which might have the throne being under rule by an Hapsburg but outside of Matthias's direct domain.
- Duchy of Montenegro. Duchy in Austria's domain with Matthias taking the title of Duke of Montenegro. Could also be part of Hungary
- Principality of Serbia. An vassal principality of the Holy Roman Empire that will be outside of the Hapsburgs direct lands.
- Duchy of Bulgaria. An vassal duchy of the Holy Roman Empire that will be outside of the Hapsburgs direct lands.
Why would the Crusaders just stop after taking Constantinople, Kaiser Chris? I don't think that this new Byzantine state will be tenable in the long term without possession of any lands in Anatolia at least along the coasts which had Greek majority population and some forays into Bithynia and some hinterlands to the coastal Anatolian possessions does not seem out of hand for the Crusaders at this stage, because I don't think that Russia would want Constantinople exposed to threats from the East again, given the importance that it holds in their eyes.
VVD0D95
Banned
They do need money...
And also in regards to the Balkans, would the rulers need to convert to Orthodoxy to ensure better relations with their mainly orthodox vassals?
It is a Crusade right? That means the Church is financing it. Then how can you say that they will have financial difficulties? The Church has immense wealth which is untaxed for centuries and which continues to increase through various sources.
The rulers of the Balkans will have to convert to Orthodoxy or they could prop up local Orthodox nobles as rulers of those states. After all the schism between Orthodoxy and Catholicism has been solidified since centuries and actually first I was bewildered to read that the Orthodox citizens welcomed Catholic Crusaders with open hands. Well the people who preferred the Turk's turban over the Papal tiara and opposed the Church union even when the Byzantines were in their death throes, wouldn't just accept the Catholics as their rulers.
So you must be Orthodox Christian if you have to rule here in the Balkans in peace.
VVD0D95
Banned
Church can finance a crusade, but the Kings are financing their own armies as they did otl.
And indeed.