The Rebirth of the Ottoman Empire

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: Before 1900' started by Onkel Willie, Jul 4, 2010.

  1. Onkel Willie Kaiser

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2008
    Location:
    Brunssum, South Limburg, Netherlands
    So as to please AHP who wasn't pleased when I crushed the Ottomans recently in a TL, I've decided to make an Ottomanwank TL. The POD is an Ottoman victory in the Russo-Turkish war in the 1877-'78. Enjoy ;).​



    The Rebirth of the Ottoman Empire



    Chapter I: The Russo-Turkish War and Reshaping the Alliances, 1877 – 1890.


    The Russo-Turkish War was the tenth conflict between the Russian and Ottoman Empires so far and in hindsight it was a turning point in the decline of the Ottoman Empire as it scored the much needed victory it needed which restored the credibility in its viability both among its subjects and the European community. From here on, the Ottoman Empire would no longer be dismissed as ‘the sick man of Europe’. The Ottoman Empire had started to weaken from the end of the seventeenth century onward as its control over Middle Eastern trade routes was no longer relevant as European powers built their own colonial empires and set up trade routes of their own. The Ottoman defeat at the hands of the Habsburgs, Russia, the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth and Venice and the subsequent Treaty of Karlowitz in 1699 put an end to its dominant political and military position as they were no longer feared and had lost their position as dominant power in the Balkans and Central Europe. The Tanzimat reforms between 1839 and 1876 had greatly enhanced the Ottoman Empire’s strength with fiscal, political, military and democratic reforms largely based on what western states already had, but this didn’t end the restiveness of the Empire’s minorities.

    The war with Russia starting in 1877 had its origins in Balkan nationalism as well as the Russian desire to regain territory lost in the Crimean War although it had some wider causes too. In 1875 Anatolia was struck by a period of drought and famine which weakened the Ottoman Empire as it heavily burdened its finances. In 1875 the Sublime Porte was declared bankrupt and the subsequent draconic tax increases weren’t much liked by the Empire’s subjects, especially the Christian ones in the Balkans who, despite equality with Muslims, were still bound to certain aspects of dhimmi status. The result was revolt in Bulgaria and also Bosnia-Herzegovina and in the former irregular troops were dispatched and massacred the Bulgarians and allegedly “left no Christian woman in Bulgaria unspoiled”, something which was broadly measured out in western press and aroused a patriotic fervour among the Russian people who supported the Slavic peoples of the Balkans. In 1876, Serbia and Montenegro, who were de facto sovereign, declared war on the Ottomans, but were defeated and pleaded with St. Petersburg for help. What ensued was a period of more than a year of futile negotiations as Russia considered Ottoman peace conditions too harsh. The Constantinople Conference, to which the Porte was not invited, was begun which gave the Bulgarians autonomy, but the Porte discredited this agreement by means of a new constitution which gave the Bulgarians and other religious minorities equal rights to Muslims. The London Convention, a Russian initiative, tried to persuade the Ottomans to reform, but the latter felt strong and rejected the notion because it was in violation of the Treaty of Paris. The result was a Russian declaration of war in April 1877, but the Ottomans, unfortunately for Russia, had recognised which way the wind was blowing. Seeing that war was likely, the Ottoman government had shown some foresight by preparing for war against Russia and increasing the total Ottoman force in the Balkans to some 300.000 men.

    The war started with Romania letting Russia pass through its territory which resulted in Ottoman artillery bombardment of Romanian positions and towns in retaliation. The Russo-Romanian attempt to destroy Ottoman vessels on the Danube and mine it were actively hindered by the Ottomans although the momentum of the Russian offensive led to a successful crossing of the Danube by means of a pontoon bridge at Svishtov, albeit with serious casualties and the recognition by Russian commanders that they lacked the means to persecute an offensive war. Nonetheless, the Russian steamroller went on in the spur of the moment with the Ottoman main force located further east. This situation was soon corrected by Ottoman generals, mainly Oman Hadi Pasha who saw that the main Ottoman bulwark in the Danube delta had been bypassed. Russian forces reached Bulgaria and took the fortress of Nikopol, but were decisively halted at Plevna by a larger and stronger Ottoman forces equipped with the latest western weapons such as German rifles and American artillery. This force of some 35.000 men was commanded by Oman Hadi Pasha who had set up a defensive position at Plevna upon learning that Nikopol had already fallen. A Russian force some 8.000 strong attacked the Ottoman position at Plevna, but strong Ottoman forces who had entrenched themselves repelled the Russians three times which cost the Russians many men for negligible gains, although reinforcements were underway. The Russians and their Romanian allies fought bravely and hurled themselves at Ottoman redoubts around Plevna, but reaped nothing but many casualties although they heroically managed to hold onto the Grivitsa redoubt against large odds. Osman, while not ordered to attack, realized he had superior forces at his disposal and broke the Russian siege with relative ease and drove them back across the river Vit. Russian and Romanian forces were routed with heavy losses in a chaotic retreat after the rumoured death of general Dragomirov in which they lost a lot of ground, including the Nikopol fortress. Serbia, having secured Russian financial aid, intervened on behalf of the Bulgarians and for settling its own irredentist claims, but failed to go far and was rebuffed by Ottoman troops. After the short Siege of Plevna and the recapture of Nikopol and thereby Bulgaria, the Ottomans had gained the initiative and Oman Hadi Pasha was promoted after his victory and a more aggressive course than previously was followed which included Ottoman counteroffensives. The Russians were now in the inferior position and fielded a smaller force and so the Russians were forced into a defensive strategy. Ottoman counteroffensives drove off the smaller Russian forces although with some serious casualties for the Ottomans too as the Russians fought ferociously in defensive warfare. The Russians managed to hold defences on the Danube for several weeks, but eventually the Ottomans managed to establish a bridgehead on the northern bank of the river and retook Bucharest in March 1878 upon which the Russians requested on armistice, thus ending the war and starting the Conference of Adrianople in which the Ottomans were supported by the great powers who had no desire to see Russia controlling the Danube or the Bosporus.

    The Conference of Adrianople was a major setback for Russia and it reverberated into Europe’s alliance systems too since the Ottoman Empire was suddenly perceived to be much stronger than once believed. The autonomy of the principalities of Wallachia, Moldova, Serbia and Montenegro was reaffirmed, but the Ottomans stationed larger garrisons there and heavily cracked down on any rebellious stirrings. Bulgaria remained part of the Ottoman Empire without an autonomous status. Russia had had wild aspirations of establishing an autonomous pro-Russian Greater Bulgaria with access to the Aegean, but those dreams were now voided by the Ottoman successes in the war and the great powers that supported the Porte. A humiliating war indemnity equal to some 6 billion gold francs was imposed on Russia and strengthened the Ottoman financial situation. To further diminish its influence in the Balkans, the Ottomans accepted the proposal made by Austro-Hungarian Count Andrássy to establish Habsburg princes as the rulers of the autonomous principalities of Wallachia, Moldova, Serbia and Montenegro which the Habsburgs disguised as help toward Russia and Ottoman clemency although in reality it was Habsburg and Ottoman opportunism. Austria-Hungary itself had no interest in seeing Russia re-establishing itself on the mouth of the Danube which would surround Austria-Hungary. Likewise, the Habsburgs had no interest in breaking up the other multiethnic empire because it would only serve to encourage their own numerous minorities. Moreover, Russia’s ambitions would lead to a smattering of bickering little national homelands in the Balkans who would all have irredentist claims on Habsburg lands, leading to a potentially volatile situation. Lastly, the Ottomans annexed Northern Bessarabia and Akhalzic, thereby concluding the Treaty of Adrianople which left Russia humiliated and betrayed by its German and Habsburg Allies while the Ottomans reaffirmed themselves after more than two centuries of stagnation and decline and portrayed Russia as the redheaded stepchild of Europe. The Ottoman decline was over and this would cause changes in the international situation.

    Russia unilaterally withdrew from the Three Emperors’ League as St. Petersburg felt betrayed by its allies Germany and especially Austria-Hungary which had now succeeded in setting itself up as the dominant power in the northern Balkans, excluding Russia and cheating the Motherland out of what the Russian leadership saw as rightfully belonging to the Russian sphere of influence. This left the Germans and Austro-Hungarians who formed the so-called Dual Alliance or Central Powers, a name derived from their central position in Europe. Chancellor Bismarck and Andrássy now sought a military alliance with the reinvigorated Ottoman Empire and so the Porte joined the Central Powers in 1880 with Emperors Franz Josef, Wilhelm I and Sultan Abdul Hamid II signing the alliance personally under Bismarck’s supervision. The Ottomans did this because of fear for Russian revanchism and also because Austro-Hungarian support during the peace conference had led to friendly relations between Constantinople and Vienna which were strengthened by mutual interests, namely keeping Russia out of the Balkans and away from the Straits and thus the much coveted warm access to the Mediterranean Sea. The Ottoman Empire would next see a major revival as German investment flowed in. Germany itself was a growing industrial power which would soon surpass Britain, the greatest industrial power of the time. Germany had coal, iron ore a large labour force which exceeded those of Britain and France and its populace was generally highly educated too with many of the world’s greatest scientists coming from German universities. Germany rapidly industrialized, starting in the 1880s with steel industry, heavy industry, mining, but also the chemical and electronic industries growing at a rapid pace which made Germany the dominant power on the European continent. The Ottoman Empire was allowed to share in Germany’s successes as Bismarck negotiated economic treaties which formed a customs union including Germany, Austria-Hungary and the Ottomans, and stimulated German investment into its allies. One of the largest successes was the Trans-Orient Express from Tirana on the Adriatic coast to Basra through Constantinople, Anatolia, Kirkuk, Mosul and Baghdad. In the late 1890s it was expanded to Vienna and Berlin. In any case, German investment improved Ottoman infrastructure and communication which greatly increased the efficiency of the Empire’s government. Military reforms were introduced too with the Ottoman army being modelled on the Prussian model and receiving weaponry from manufacturers like Krupp and Skoda. The Ottoman Empire experienced a period of economic bloom and increasing strength undreamed of.

    These developments led to Russian ambitions being curbed by a strong military alliance which spanned the entirety of Russia’s western frontier and much of the Caucasus border. The Triple Alliance or Central Powers could thus easily contain Russia and defeat it if need be. The loss of Russia’s Austro-Hungarian and German allies with the dissolution of the Three Emperors’ League and the formation of the Triple Alliance left Russia diplomatically isolated. In France, there was increased fear of Germany’s growing power and dominance. Therefore the Russians and French seemed natural allies and made a rapprochement to each other as they now had mutual interests, namely crushing Germany. Italy, in the meantime, saw its ambitions to establish the provinces of Tripolitania, Fezzan and Cyrenaica as a colony curbed due to the formation of the Triple Alliance much like France saw its ambitions on Tunisia cut short. Russia, France and Italy formed the Triple Entente in 1881 with King Umberto I, Tsar Alexander II and President Jules Grévy making their own shows of solidarity. Britain, for the time being, remained aloof from continental affairs, but Emperor Wilhelm II’s ambition to create a German navy second to none and his overly imperialist ambitions would do all the work for France, Russia and Italy as the nineteenth century drew to a close.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2010
  2. Coffeelatte Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2010
    good start

    dude i want more:cool:
     
  3. Keb Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2010
    Location:
    amidst the ruins of an empire
    Timelines where the Ottomans win the 1877/78 war, I've seen. An honest Ottomanwank with such a late PoD, not so much.

    I, for one, am most curious to see where this will end up.
     
  4. Onkel Willie Kaiser

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2008
    Location:
    Brunssum, South Limburg, Netherlands
    Really? I haven't seen 1878 victory TLs for the Ottoman Empire on this board.
     
  5. Arkhangelsk Gay Mexamerican

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2009
    Location:
    Alta California
    You've peeked my interest OW, I guess you can say I have a thing for the Ottomans...:p

    I'm subscribed! :D
     
  6. Askelion Il Serenissimo

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2009
    Location:
    Pretty much everywhere at one point or another...
    Hooray for the Otto's!

    Good to see the Osmani dynasty get some more love on the board :)
     
  7. Cuāuhtemōc Twitter fiend

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Location:
    Brooklyn
    Somewhere in the forums, an Abdul is pleased. ;)
     
  8. Abdul Hadi Pasha Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Location:
    Pacifica (Now with 6 CVNs!)
    I approve this TL. Although it's the same topic as mine. :mad: But don't worry, mine is different. :D :cool:
     
  9. Cuāuhtemōc Twitter fiend

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Location:
    Brooklyn
    I see this time-line more as emulation than imitation. I love both time-lines. :)
     
  10. King Thomas Has Learned His Lesson

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2005
    Location:
    Whitstable,UK
    I love it, not as OTT as many wanks.
     
  11. MNP Dark Souls 3!

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2008
    Location:
    Central North America
    I'd come to the conclusion that AHP was never going to actually do it on this site. So about damn time we had this TL.
     
  12. EmmettMcFly55 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2009
    Location:
    Kingdom of the Netherlands
    Good start, as always. I'm concerned about one thing, though: TTL's alliance-systems look to be similar to what OTL turned out to be in the Great War. And while a CP victory is possible with Entente Italy, as you've proven it before (though you never finished the tale, sadly) it is more difficult than in other situations. So, I guess that some measures will have to be taken to enlarge the Central Powers. China? Japan? America... no, you've done that several times before. Ethiopia wouldn't contribute too much, and for all we know, TTL's Entente might have improved the Italian military enough to make the initial invasion in 1896 be a success. Hmm... Spain? Sweden? We'll see, I guess...

    Some more comments about Africa, though: What happened to Egypt? It wasn't seized by Britain (as an influence sphere that was still de jure part of the Ottoman Empire, not a colony yet) IOTL until 1882, so maybe the victory in the Russo-Turkish war changed that. If Egypt remains Ottoman, does that have effects on the Scramble for Africa, like less British interest in the Sudan and more interests elsewhere... there wouldn't be a Cape-to-Cairo possibility, even if it would be gained in case of a war, so Britain might colonize regions for other motives. Yes, Ottoman Egypt might make changes that would make the TTL map of Africa nearly unrecognizable. I hope you'll consider that when writing the next update.
     
  13. Onkel Willie Kaiser

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2008
    Location:
    Brunssum, South Limburg, Netherlands
    Update time. I would also like to ask someone to do a map for the 1911 world.



    Chapter II: Setting the Stage, 1890 – 1912.


    The alliance blocs as they would enter the twentieth century and future conflicts had solidified by now, but not yet fully as an Asian power was on the move. Japan had strongly reformed since the 1860s in the so-called Meiji Restoration named after Emperor Meiji. Radical fiscal, economic, political and military reforms had fundamentally changed Japan into a western oriented society and stamped out obstructive forms of conservatism and traditionalism. Japan was quickly industrializing and now had modern roads and an extensive railroad network as well as modern communications. Japan was now a constitutional monarchy on the Wilhelmine German model and also had a strong army organized on the French model. The Japanese navy, by far the most important branch of the armed forces for any island nation, was highly developed too with several modern warships. The Japanese had strived to combine western modernity with traditional Japanese values. They had abolished the han-system and ended the “four divisions of society” system, stamping down on the old elites such as the samurai. Political reform had allowed for industrialization, leading to the construction of iron smelters, shipyards and spinning mills as well as modern communications and a national railroad network. Foreign military aid had ensured that Japan had capable officers, seamen and powerful weaponry. Japan now wanted to assert itself as the leading power in Asia instead of the crumbling Chinese Empire to which Japan was technically a tributary state. Japan had had previous conflicts with China over Korea which hadn’t led to war yet, but in 1894 a Japanese diplomat was assassinated in Shanghai which sparked a war between the two. Japan cut off Chinese forces in Korea from resupply and proceeded to destroy the Beiyang fleet off the mouth of the Yalu river. The Japanese quite quickly defeated the Chinese in Manchuria too and occupied Formosa and the Pescadores Islands upon which China surrendered after some six months of Japanese military successes.

    This shocked the world as small Japan had defeated big China, but China had been weakened in the 19th century due to the unequal treaties, Opium Wars and western exploitation while Japan’s reforms had been successful. The Treaty of Shimonoseki was signed on April 16th 1895. China recognized the total independence of Korea and ceded the Liaodong Peninsula, Formosa and the Penghu Islands to Japan "forever". Additionally, China was to pay Japan 200 million Kuping taels as reparation. China also signed a commercial treaty permitting Japanese ships to operate on the river Yangtze, to operate manufacturing factories in treaty ports and to open four more ports to foreign trade. The triple intervention by Germany, France and Russia, however, forced Japan to give up the Liaodong Peninsula in exchange for another 30 million Kuping taels (450 million yen) of war reparations. This was one of the major contributing factors to the Boxer rebellion a few years later which ended with a major show of western solidarity. Western cosmopolitanism, exploitation of China, administrative dysfunction, the recent defeat and humiliation by Japan, and the numerous concessions compounded by drought and harvest failure had led to a lot of simmering unrest. The Boxers themselves, after whom the rebellion was named, were originally a village cult from Shandong province who practiced calisthenics and martial arts and were under the belief that through their perseverance they would be able to superhuman feats such as immunity to swords and bullets. The rebellion erupted in 1899 with the killing of Chinese Christians and the destruction of Christian missions. The lightly armed but fanatical boxers surrounded Beijing which induced Empress Dowager Cixi, who ruled in the Emperor’s name, to declare war on the western powers while the Boxers besieged foreign embassies and killed a German diplomat. This all led to a western intervention known as the Nine Nation Alliance which included Japan, Russia, Great Britain, France, the United States, Germany, Italy, Austria-Hungary and the Ottoman Empire. The Chinese were quickly defeated and were punished for their insolence by the great powers. China was fined war indemnities of some 500 million tael of fine silver. The reparation would be paid within 35 years. Furthermore, spheres of influence would be decided upon. Russian gained a sphere of influence in Manchuria, Japan in Fujian, Britain in Tibet, France in Guangdong and Germany in Shandong while Beijing was occupied jointly by the nine powers whose citizens were granted immunity from Chinese laws.

    Russia, for the time being, continued to expand in the everlasting imperialistic game between the great powers which would inevitably lead to a clash with Japan. Russia started to build railroads and obtained forestry concessions from Korea on the Yalu and Tumen rivers. Japan saw this as a threat since they believed Korea to be in the Japanese sphere of influence. Negotiations started by prime minister Ito Hirobumi, who didn’t believe Japan could defeat Russia militarily, broke down as the Russians simply didn’t respond and so war erupted. After a series of Japanese victories at Mukden, Shaho, Liaoyang and Port Arthur and the subsequent destruction of the Russian eastern fleet in its flight led to a Japanese victory and Japan claiming Manchuria as its sphere of influence. This brought Japan into the deadly dance of the great powers as it proved to the British that Japan was a worthy pawn to contain Russian ambitions as Russia itself was torn apart by revolution after the defeats which Tsar Nicholas II barely managed to suppress. The conflict that would engulf the world would not be ignited in the Far East though.

    In Europe tensions were rising with the ascension to the throne of Emperor Wilhelm II who strived to do for the navy what his grandfather Wilhelm I had managed to do for the army. He wanted a world class navy that could beat the Royal Navy and an empire that went with it. Imperialism in general was at an all time high in general too as the African continent was completely divided between the great powers of the world with France and Britain taking the lion’s share of the continent. France established an empire which stretched from the western coast of Africa all the way to border of Sudan in the east and from Algeria in the north to Ivory Coast in the south. The British let them have Sudan as they had no interest in it. This fulfilled France’s ambitions and increased friendly relations between France and Britain which feared growing German economic might and naval power, and of course the threatening German continental hegemony. The British during the 1880s went up the Benue and Niger rivers and expanded into what would become the colony of Nigeria while further west they created the colony of Gold Coast. The rest of the British Empire’s African lands were in the east of the continent. Kenya, Uganda, Tanganyika, Rhodesia, Namibia, South Africa and Madagascar all became part of Britain and so the British effectively dominated the continent’s east coast as well as the continent’s southern tip and the surrounding areas. Zanzibar, which had expanded into Africa, become a British ally/vassal since the Ottomans wouldn't tolerate full-fledged annexation. Germany, as a major power, went into colonization too as Bismarck, who principally didn’t want to get involved in the imperialistic struggle and wanted to focus on European matters, was forced into accepting a moderate colonial empire due to pressure from more imperialistic minded leaders in Germany. He, however, did try to avoid taking territory which the other great powers claimed for themselves to avoid a war over a silly conflict in Africa. And so Germany went up the Congo river in the early 1880s which voided Belgian King Leopold II’s dream of a personal empire in Africa which no one cared about anyway. The Congo and the Middle Congo along with Cameroon were established as a single continuous colony which was called German Central Africa. Togoland was also established as a minor colony by Germany. Several minor powers also started to mingle in the “Scramble for Africa” as it’s now known which further increased the competition and rivalry as all wanted the largest colonial empire. Portugal had Angola and Mozambique for a colonial empire while Italy conquered Somalia and Abyssinia in 1896 and tested their reformed army although the Abyssinians were noted for their tough resistance which led to Italy resorting to terror tactics in the end. They held out for nine months in a bitter struggle, but in the end King Umberto II could add the title Emperor of Ethiopia to his titles. Thus Italian East Africa was established, a large colony on the Horn of Africa. The Ottomans, who controlled Libya, Egypt and Tunisia, strengthened their grip on these regions due to the rising tensions on the southern border and Egyptian dissent was squashed in a short pacification by Ottoman armies. Ottoman forces quickly expanded the empire south, down from the river Nile and incorporated Sudan into the Empire with an Ottoman governor in charge They built the Tunis-Baghdad Railroad with German investment and help from German engineers which linked east and west. Ocean telegraph lines were built that linked Constantinople with Alexandria, Tripoli, Tunis and Khartoum.

    In the mess of conflicting interests and imperialistic rivalries, war couldn’t be avoided for very long. France wanted revenge for the loss of Alsace-Lorraine, Russia wanted to undo the humiliation of 1878 and also wanted revenge against Austria-Hungary, Italy had irredentist claims in Habsburg and wanted to conquer Libya, and lastly Britain wanted to destroy Germany’s growing naval power and cut it down to size seriously. Europe was a powder keg as evidenced by bad blood between the two alliance blocs. Imperialism, irredentism, militarism and ethnic strife were all elements of the conflict which would come to an explosion soon. Antagonism between France and Germany would lead to war over a spark in Morocco. The First Moroccan Crisis of 1905-1906 also known as the Tangier Crisis had been a diplomatic defeat for Germany. It had been an attempt by Chancellor Von Bülow to test the strength of Franco-British relations with Britain having just joined the Entente, making it the Quadruple Entente. The crisis erupted as Germany challenged France’s mandate over Morocco which led to a French mobilization followed by a German one. Italy, Russia and Britain had diplomatically supported the French position and a Germany filled with resentment was forced to back off since neither the Habsburgs nor the Ottomans could support her due to internal problems although all of the great powers knew that both Berlin and Paris had only put the issue on the backburner. Austria-Hungary was experiencing a bout of internal unrest because of the issue of language education reform in Bohemia which the Czechs supported and the Austrians didn’t, leading to a vortex of street manifestations and parliamentary crises. The Ottomans at this time experienced another Bulgarian uprising which distracted them enough for them to not want a war just yet. The Second Moroccan Crisis or Agadir Crisis of 1911-1912 was sparked by a Moroccan rebellion against Sultan Abdelhafid who was widely seen as a French puppet and was besieged in his palace in Fez. This crisis would be different from the first one.

    The French wanted to send troops to prop up their puppet ruler which Germany opposed. Germany sent gunboat SMS Panther which led to fear of war as Germany and France mobilized once again with Germany challenging the French de facto protectorate of Morocco which the Germans didn’t want to see become a de jure protectorate. The crisis continued throughout 1911 and negotiations broke down as Germany felt strong with support from Vienna and Constantinople who wanted to curb Russia’s ambitions and nip their revanchist sentiments in the bud for which they needed a war. Things came to blows when German gunship Panther got into a shootout with a French vessel and was sunk in spring 1912, leading to a German declaration of war citing French aggression although it was unclear who had started the battle to begin with. It wasn’t discovered until much later that Germany had specifically instructed their vessel to cause a conflict with “warning shots”. The results were Russian and British declarations of war on Germany which in turn led to Austro-Hungarian and Ottoman declarations of war against Russia, France and Britain. The only member of any of the alliances to remain neutral was Italy which cited France starting the war as a reason since they were only obliged to help France if it was the victim of aggression. Italy over the years had come to fear the Central Powers due to Austro-Hungarian strength which was caused because Vienna was freed of Balkan problems due to the 1878 peace in which Austria-Hungary and the Ottoman Empire jointly kept the Balkans under control. Likewise, the Ottomans could threaten Italy’s Adriatic coast with its renewed navy. The latter had purchased four German battleships between 1904 and 1911 as well as four cruisers, and had modernized its armed forces. These forces combined with the Austro-Hungarian navy could threaten the Italian navy while their armies enforced a stalemate in the Alps at the best and inflict serious defeats in the worst case. And so Italy decided to play both sides while the European continent was plunged into a war of an unseen scope.
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2010
  14. Arkhangelsk Gay Mexamerican

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2009
    Location:
    Alta California
    Here's my attempt at making a map for your TL...I kinda rushed it, I feel really uneasy about border between Ottoman Egypt and French Sudan...and I'm assuming nothing much has changed for the Americas.

    Please let me know what needs fixing OW :eek:

    1911RoOE.png
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2010
  15. Abdul Hadi Pasha Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Location:
    Pacifica (Now with 6 CVNs!)
    You've ignored the Egyptian empire in this. They controlled the whole Sudan, and the Red Sea coast of Africa all the way to what in OTL became British Somaliland - they also stretched inland into Harar.

    For all that to be lost would involve a major war.
     
  16. Cuāuhtemōc Twitter fiend

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Location:
    Brooklyn
    Yes, judging by the map, Italy has gotten Ethiopia. If they maintain good relations with the Ottomans, it can only make the transport of settlers a lot more easy though Italy might consider purchasing Libya.
     
  17. Mirza Khan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2009
    Location:
    The Mountains of the Olde Dominion
    An idea just occured to me-would a stronger Ottoman Empire be able to prevent the dismemberment of the Zanzibari empire in the 1880's-1890's, by backing Zanzibar up as an ally?
     
  18. Ridwan Asher Jungle Arab

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    In the middle of nowhere
    And also, Zanzibar Sultanate should be surviving, and have an empire (officially) stretching inland up to eastern Zaire and Eastern Zambia, holding pretty much all of Katanga.

    EDIT : Mirza has beaten me to it....

    This Ottoman Empire will never cede any of their territory for whatever reason(except a defeat in a war). Not to mention to Italy, of all people.
     
  19. Abdul Hadi Pasha Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2004
    Location:
    Pacifica (Now with 6 CVNs!)
    Probably not, but if the British don't occupy Egypt, then the Germans can't blackmail them into abandoning Zanzibar.
     
  20. Onkel Willie Kaiser

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2008
    Location:
    Brunssum, South Limburg, Netherlands
    Nice try, although Tanganyika is British and Namibia is too. I think you should make Northern Sudan Ottoman while making the south French. That would be more realistic IMO.