The Man in the High Castle on Amazon Prime

Discussion in 'Alternate History Books and Media' started by xxmagex, Jan 15, 2015.

  1. stirlingdraka Female Draka Defector

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    Yes! Season 3.:):extremelyhappy::extremelyhappy:
     
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  2. nik2016 Active Member

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    Mar 6, 2016
    Season 3

    Very good news.

    A video shows that during the war Smith was a US officer also the nuke of D.C.

     
  3. rvbomally Russian Hacker

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    I want to see what Smith's counterpart is up to in the alternate 1962. Probably working in a similar capacity as his prime TL version, perhaps in the CIA or FBI?
     
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  4. rob2001 Well-Known Member

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    I'd say Smith got real lucky that night. But how in the world did he become a high ranking Nazi in the first place, if he was in the U.S. Army during the war?
     
  5. nik2016 Active Member

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    In the OTL Petain was a General of the French Army and a national hero of WW1. Also Germany was a very militaristic society and people back then had a very good respect for those who were in uniform
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2017
  6. Athelstane Anglo-Saxon Troublemaker

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    If this is in reply to Rob, I don't think Petain is a good comparison.

    Petain may have headed a collaborationist government, but he wasn't a Nazi, let alone in the SS. In fact, he often worked to hinder Nazi policies and demands where he was able.

    A better comparison in regards to France would be Joseph Darnand, a French army officer who eventually joined the SS and rose to the rank of SS Sturmbannf├╝hrer by war's end.

    I won't say it's impossible that Smith could have made the transition from US Army officer to SS officer in a Nazi occupied America. What's more impressive is that he could, with such a background, rise so quickly to such a position (head of the entire SS operation in America). But this may just be the conceit of the narrative. It would be less interesting or thought provoking with some German in the position, or with Smith reduced to some lesser functionary position.
     
  7. rvbomally Russian Hacker

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    I think it speaks to Smith's skills as a political operator. He managed to outmaneuver the pro-nuclear war conspirators, so we have proof that he's skilled in manipulating the Nazi power structure.
     
  8. Athelstane Anglo-Saxon Troublemaker

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    The SS allowed all sorts of obscure men to rise very high in their ranks - starting with failed chicken farmer Heinrich Himmler.

    The only thing that's really a surprise is that a former American army officer could do it.

    But who knows? Maybe had the Germans won the war, Joseph Darnand could have come to lead the SS in France.
     
  9. rvbomally Russian Hacker

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    Smith's dialogue with Wegener in Season One indicates that they both did some pretty heinous things. Perhaps Smith gained the Nazis' trust by being an eager participant in the occupation? Not only does it prove his loyalty, it also would make him a major target for the resistance, forcing him further into the Nazi camp.
     
  10. Skallagrim Not the Skallagrim from YouTube. Different fellow.

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    For the Nazis, it makes a lot of sense politically. If you appoint only Germans in the positions of power you will always be a foreign ruler. If you drop the idea of being a German empire, and instead proclaim yourself an empire of all Aryans, that's... inclusive. (Yes. The nazis being inclusive. A weird thought, but it just makes sense if they want to rule a world-spanning empire.) If there are Americans in charge, the American part of the Reich becomes perceived as an American affair. Not foreign, but actually patriotic. No longer are Americans a conquered people; they are part of a great brotherhood of white, racist supermen who can look down on everyone else.

    This is also easier for the Americans to accept, psychologically, than being oppressed losers. It just makes a certain amount of sense for all sides to act in this way.
     
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  11. rvbomally Russian Hacker

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    Actually, this makes a lot of sense, given what we've seen from the show. The Americans in the Pacific States regard themselves - and are treated by the Japanese - as conquered and oppressed losers, while the Americans in the Reich have eagerly adopted Nazism with their own American flavor, celebrate VA Day, and seem to think of themselves as being part of the winners of the war. With the Americans of the Reich eagerly keeping themselves in line, the Wehrmacht can focus on suppressing Africa and the Slavic lands. We never see any Wehrmacht troops in the American Reich; the border patrols were actually Americans, as opposed to the Pacific States, which is full of Japanese troops with no indication that there are Americans working in a collaborationist army. The only collaborators we see in the Pacific States are working in clerical positions. There are no collaborators there with positions of power, either; the Pacific States' leadership all come from Japan. It makes you wonder whether the Japanese have adopted a more hands-off policy among the non-Chinese portions of their Asian empire, if they haven't spun them off as independent states.
     
  12. nik2016 Active Member

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    Also in OTL at 40's 12% of US population were ethnically Germans mostly lived in N.E. of the country

    [​IMG]


    Those who were Anglo-Saxon origin (majority) still considered Germanic nation by Nazis.

    Those who had problems in Nazi Amerika were all the Non-whites, the Jews, those of Slavic background, the Communists/Socialists, the homosexuals and those who were mentally or physically ill
     
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  13. Athelstane Anglo-Saxon Troublemaker

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    Don't forget all the Scandinavians around the Great Lakes and Northern Plains - several million of them, nearly all quite aryische.

    But you're right about who the losers will be. Most of them will be dead by this point.
     
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  14. Geredis Well-Known Member

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    And while a minor matter at hand, as I recall, Smith was serving in the Pacific and that is where he distinguished himself. He wasn't engaged in the European or American fronts. It is there, in the Pacific (as I recall from a discussion he had with Tagomi, where he intentionally displayed his American war medals to the Trade Minister). Thus I think it's safe to say that the American military, directed against the Japanese, was generally considered as being more viable and politically loyal than those serving against the Germans.

    In that vein, I can see that as being very likely, even desired, for Pacific Theater veterans to join the German forces in the German-American state. Their..understanding...of the new big threat in Japan would be invaluable, and any political "problems" that these Americans may have might be humored to a greater degree due to their experience, and it is in that very same view that I can see the SS eagerly taking in as many of these people as possible. I mean, for comparison, one need only look to West Germany's eagerness to, when possible, co-opt and reintegrate many of the Wehrmacht's generals that fought in the East, because the newest and biggest threat was of course the Soviets.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017
  15. Faeelin Lord of Ten Thousand Years

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    No one's really commented on it in the show, but we don't see any black people in the German Reich...
     
  16. A_H_nikky Well-Known Member

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    At the very least they probably have been sent South but its sadly likely that something much more Final has happened.
     
  17. Pesterfield Well-Known Member

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    I heard that the population for Savannah Georgia they mentioned was half of what it should have been in the 60s.

    That does bring up a problem though, if the black population was exterminated who's working the farms? I'm betting the Southern whites wouldn't want to do it.
     
  18. paddbear Member

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    I'd imagine the American Reich moved blacks and other "undesirables" out of the cities and either into extermination camps or work camps. We can likely assume that farms utilize forced, slave labor.
     
  19. Athelstane Anglo-Saxon Troublemaker

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    If memory serves, Dick's book said that slavery had been restored in the South. No real details given.

    But I expect that the Nazis and their American proxies would probably have to kill off quite a lot of the African-American population to restore them to slavery in the 1940's anyway.
     
  20. PachPachis You fools! Capitalism has ALREADY WON!

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    I'm like 99% sure a woman mentions it on the bus to Canon City to Juliana. That the Nazis are exterminating the black people who don't flee, but the Japanese are happy to gradually deport them to the Neutral Zone, where they often immigrate to South America.