The Legacy of the Glorious (Milarqui's Cut)

[Milarqui]

ramones1986: Heh, no worries, I understand. To be frank, most of the map would be the same as Tocomocho's, because his idea to divide Castilla y León and Andalucía in two different regions made some sense. About the biggest differences would be Levante (Valencia + Islas Baleares) and Catalonia (which has a fifth province, Rosellón).
Canarias' status right now is similar to that of Philippines, in that they will soon become a Foral Region. However, one of my plans for the future will make a great difference when compared to RL (Linense is the only one that knows about it, since both of us had been planning it for the original "Legacy of the Glorious").
As for Madrid, it forms part of the Foral Region of Castilla la Nueva.
hsthompson, Goldstein: well, yeah, Valencian could be considered a dialect of Catalan, almost, but here they might be said to be different. A bit like how Galician and Portuguese sound like, yet they are different.

 

[Goldstein]

hsthompson, Goldstein: well, yeah, Valencian could be considered a dialect of Catalan, almost, but here they might be said to be different. A bit like how Galician and Portuguese sound like, yet they are different.

But differences between Galician and Portuguese are significantly higher than those of Valencian and Catalan. The phonetics are extremely different, the lexicon is quite different in too many aspects, and grammar doesn't work the same in many cases. I specifically remember a case in which a girl from La Coruña used Galician language in Lisbon and faced serious communicative barriers. Valencian and Catalan, OTOH, are no more different than Argentinean dialect is from Castillian dialect.

 

[ramones1986]

Madrid, Murcia and Baleares

ramones1986: Heh, no worries, I understand.
As for Madrid, it forms part of the Foral Region of Castilla la Nueva.

Oh, I smell some opposition here in this timeline.
Because most Manchego (informal name for people from Castilla-La Nueva) deputies will oppose the inclusion of the province of Madrid to their Region, as well as their Madrileño counterparts.
This problem is also the same in Levante (the Balearic deputies will base it on historic and linguistic claims) and Betica (Murcians will claim that their Region is distinct from the rest).

[Milarqui, just my insight on the territorial divisions of Spain. I hope you understand]

 

[Faralis]

A friend from Alicante once heard a guy in a restaurant asking "Un bocadill de jamó i ques"

So he speaks perfect Valencian then

Now a bit more seriously, before the "Rules of Castellón" Valencian and Catalan had a lot less in common, for example, my father, being from Valencia could not understand a lot of words from Canal 9 ( using said rules ) when the TV started, and said that even in Lérida he could understand it much better ... the fact that had some rules in common unified a lot more both.

Being a linguistic purist ( which I´m not ), they should include Aranés as an independent language ... but well

I think they should keep the Balearic Islands as an autonomy ... they would have friction with Valencia if the seat of the autonomy is kept there ...

I do not think it would be such a problem in Castilla la Nueva, dough ...

 

[ramones1986]

So he speaks perfect Valencian then

Being a linguistic purist ( which I´m not ), they should include Aranés as an independent language ... but well

I think they should keep the Balearic Islands as an autonomy ... they would have friction with Valencia if the seat of the autonomy is kept there ...

I do not think it would be such a problem in Castilla la Nueva, dough ...

I agree with you, Faralis.
1st, its a fact that Aranese/Aranés is a variety of Gascon/Occitan spoken in the Aran Valley. Because of the fact that they have some degree of autonomy (though considered part of Catalonia), I think that Milarqui should include it, but I think that's impossible because of the population.

2nd, the Balearic dialects are salat; it means that they used sa/es instead of la/el.

 

[Milarqui]

Here it is: the flags of the 14 Foral Regions that exist now.

For those that wonder why Murcia is part of Bética, Baleares part of Levante or Madrid part of Castilla la Nueva, you have to take into account that these are not actual territorial divisions, they are just a way to organise the national territory in order to better achieve administration of Spain.

 

[ramones1986]

For those that wonder why Murcia is part of Bética, Baleares part of Levante or Madrid part of Castilla la Nueva, you have to take into account that these are not actual territorial divisions, they are just a way to organise the national territory in order to better achieve administration of Spain.

You mean, is this somehow temporary until the legislation of the new law defining the territorial division of Metropolitan Spain?

 

[Cuāuhtemōc]

Here it is: the flags of the 14 Foral Regions that exist now.

For those that wonder why Murcia is part of Bética, Baleares part of Levante or Madrid part of Castilla la Nueva, you have to take into account that these are not actual territorial divisions, they are just a way to organise the national territory in order to better achieve administration of Spain.

It seems rather large to have the Filipinas under one sole administrative unit?

Would the Spanish split up later?

 

[Goldstein]

Here it is: the flags of the 14 Foral Regions that exist now.

Ávila and Valladolid as a part of León and not of Castilla la Vieja? I hope you have a good explaination for that.

 

[Herr Frage]

With all the posts detailing the government of Leopoldine Spain, I was wondering if we might see a post on matters to the north and east?

I am curious about the situation in France under the new Orleanist regime. Likewise on how the Corsican kingdom is being run. And of course what butterflies may come as they interact with the world.

I imagine the Orleanists will be eager to have some victory abroad to legitimize their rule. King Napoleon may also try and grab some piece of Africa to gain glory and legitimacy for his kingdom. Corsican colonies, especially ironic if they fly the old Corsican flag!

Will Germany have better luck overseas with Spain as an ally as well.

 

[Faralis]

Ops, Navarra was already a "región foral" ( technically, in OTL it never stop being one even nowadays ...), so changing its name to "Vascongadas" its a bit strange, IMHO ...

Also I should be sleeping ...

 

[Milarqui]

ramones1986: No, the division is there to stay, although right now they are only administrative. What I meant is that it is not an actual territorial division in the sense of RL Spain and the Comunidades Autónomas. These will eventually evolve into political subdivisions, all of them with the same rights and duties.

Cuāuhtemōc: I had envisoned that Philippines would be led from Manila, like it happens in RL, but, of course, with the Madrid government always watchful. The idea of separating it in three or four regions had not occurred to me. Maybe it could be something for Chapter VI or VII to talk about...

Goldstein: The reason is that I felt that Castilla La Vieja would have become too big, holding 8 provinces, which would have made the region quite big when compared to others, especially in terms of unofficial power held in the Senate. By giving Ávila and Valladolid to León, (and also not having 1-province regions) I am keeping a balance, making sure that no Foral Region has less than 2 (Extremadura) nor more than 6 (León and both Castillas) provinces.

Herr Frage: Chapter VI will deal, among other things, with the politics in Europe, ten years after the end of the Hohenzollerns' War. French relations with Corsica are non-existant, save for French demands that Napoleon IV renonces to the Corsican crown and submits to the will of the French people. And Orleanist France and Corsica will both attempt to gain lands in Africa, although, obviously, Corsica will have less reach than France. And yeah, Germany will have more luck in the colonization aspect - I'd like you to read last chapter's part II.

Faralis: Navarra and the Basque Country have been joined into one region, which is called Vascongadas.

 

[ramones1986]

Milarqui, I have suggestions:
- On Aragon, instead of Señera (the vertical red stripes), why not use a defaced version of the St. George's flag with the coat of arms on the center?

- On Levante, why not use the Señera Coronada?

- On Canarias, you forgot to put the flag on it.

 

[Milarqui]

Milarqui, I have suggestions:
- On Aragon, instead of Señera (the vertical red stripes), why not use a defaced version of the St. George's flag with the coat of arms on the center?

- On Levante, why not use the Señera Coronada?

- On Canarias, you forgot to put the flag on it.

- Aragon: I do not understand how, exactly, you suggest it. However, I guess that it might be possible to use the flag the pre-autonomic government of Aragon used, which is the same as the one I am using right now, but with a St George's cross on the left.

- Levante: If you check the wikipedia page, you can see that the current "Senyera Coronada" is a simplification of another that was actually used in the end of the 19th century, which is the one in there.

- Canarias: Canarias is not a Foral Region yet. Also, I did not make the Canarias flag yet. I would not use the one they use in RL nowadays, because that was the basis on which I made the Bética flag.

 

[ramones1986]

- Levante: If you check the wikipedia page, you can see that the current "Senyera Coronada" is a simplification of another that was actually used in the end of the 19th century, which is the one in there.

- Canarias: Canarias is not a Foral Region yet. Also, I did not make the Canarias flag yet. I would not use the one they use in RL nowadays, because that was the basis on which I made the Bética flag.

Oh, I already saw the Levante flag on Wiki, so yeah. How about a new update?

 

[ramones1986]

- Aragon: I do not understand how, exactly, you suggest it.

You notice the similarities between the flags of the provinces of Huesca, Teruel and Zaragoza in OTL Spain?

 

[Nanwe]

Here it is: the flags of the 14 Foral Regions that exist now.

For those that wonder why Murcia is part of Bética, Baleares part of Levante or Madrid part of Castilla la Nueva, you have to take into account that these are not actual territorial divisions, they are just a way to organise the national territory in order to better achieve administration of Spain.

Why would Valladolid, being the capital of Castilla, along with Avila, be a part of León?

As a Vallisoletano I'm warning you, traditionally we have a good deal of bad relationsahips with people from Leon. It'd be a horrible deal for Vallladolid and Leon too, probably.

 

[Milarqui]

ramones1986: too similar to the flag of England. Besides, the Señera makes it more of a call to times past.
Nanwe: fun fact I have just discovered, Castilla y León does not have an official capital, although, yes, Valladolid counts as the capital because the Parlamento de la Junta is there. I know that Valladolid and Ávila are historically part of Castilla La Vieja, but I made it this way because, if it remained like that, Castilla La Vieja would have 8 provinces, which theoretically would make them more "powerful". By placing Valladolid and Ávila as part of León, I ensure that things will be more balanced, as no Región Foral would have more than 6 provinces. Besides, as I said before, this is not a political arrangement, but an administrative one.

 

[Jonathan Edelstein]

In Franco's time, decolonization was the order of the day, and most of Africa was becoming independent then, so Franco looked to trying to keep Guinea and Western Sahara into remaining as a part of Spain. Now, we are at the time of the Scramble for Africa, and most European territories in there are very small, and there are not enough white European people to consider their becoming autonomous. Once infrastructure is developed well enough, and the Spanish people realise that the African people are perfectly able to engage in politics, Guinea and all Spanish territories will become Foral Regions. But not yet.

In Spanish Guinea at this time were many freed Cuban slaves who were transported between 1845 and the 1860s. There was also the beginning of the mixed-race Fernandino community, which were the offspring of Spaniards and local women (mainly Bubi on Fernando Po, Fang in Rio Muni). The Fernandinos became much more widespread during the twentieth century but there were already some of them by this point in your timeline.

I presume that the Afro-Cubans and the Fernandinos, who were Spanish-speaking, would be considered more Spanish than the Africans and would be the first to be included in self-government. So possibly Spanish Guinea could become a foral region with only the Spaniards, Cubans and Fernandinos voting at first, with the vote gradually being extended to the emancipados (assuming the Spanish government still imposes such a system) and then to all Africans.

Besides, as I said before, this is not a political arrangement, but an administrative one.

But it will become political eventually, right? The overseas Foral Regions have their own parliaments, and even if the Spanish regions are less autonomous now, it's foreseeable that some of them (like Catalonia and the Basque country) will eventually want what Puerto Rico and Cuba have. This means that every Foral Region has to be thought of as a potential autonomous canton, which means that putting provinces in with their historic rivals could cause trouble in the future.

Also, your reference to the Foral Regions having power in the Senate means that they already have some political significance. Given what Nanwe says about Valladolid and León, would the same senator be able to represent them both?

 

[Herr Frage]

And yeah, Germany will have more luck in the colonization aspect - I'd like you to read last chapter's part II.

Oh, sorry, I guess I forgot about that since it seems fairly OTL so far in that segment.