The House of Palaiologos, Against the Tide: An Eastern Roman Timeline
- Thread starter Avitus
- Start date
Grouchio, I'm fairly certain that some level of European meddling in the America's was inevitable by my PoD, but at the very least I intend on eliminating the Anglo-American style of colonizing that involves driving the natives into poorer and poorer regions, though I think that the French and Spanish methods would be hard to avoid happening at some point.
I realized I forgot to add a map for 1490, so here is one for 1491 to show the changes after the latest update.
Legend:
1. Kingdom of Portugal
2. Archduchy of Brittany
3. Principality of Wales
4. Republic of Florence
5. The Papal States
6. Sicilian Bishopric
7. Republic of Venice
8. Kingdom of Naples
9. Duchy of Austria
10. Duchy of Bavaria
11. Electorate of Saxony
12. Electorate of Brandenburg
13. Teutonic and Livonian Orders
14. Knights of St. John
15. Kingdom of Cyprus
16. Mamluk Sulanate
17. Empire of Trebizond and Principality of Theodoro
I realized I forgot to add a map for 1490, so here is one for 1491 to show the changes after the latest update.
Legend:
1. Kingdom of Portugal
2. Archduchy of Brittany
3. Principality of Wales
4. Republic of Florence
5. The Papal States
6. Sicilian Bishopric
7. Republic of Venice
8. Kingdom of Naples
9. Duchy of Austria
10. Duchy of Bavaria
11. Electorate of Saxony
12. Electorate of Brandenburg
13. Teutonic and Livonian Orders
14. Knights of St. John
15. Kingdom of Cyprus
16. Mamluk Sulanate
17. Empire of Trebizond and Principality of Theodoro
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Wouldn't the Electorate of Brandenburg be further south a bit? I was hoping to see a independent Bohemia as well.But I loved your last update.
Probably, so I shifted them a little. All of my HRE nations are very approximate, so if you have any particularly good map sources or suggestions I'll be sure to look into them.
Now I am wondering rather di Syracusa will be part of Venice's destruction, or he will destroy its future in regards to New World colonies.
I liked the section on the ship with the sailors going a bit crazy. And Benedetto sounds a bit like Spartacus.
Charles and his allies have stalled. I think the winter retirement will prove their undoing. By the time spring comes the smoldering in France could become a true revolt with the kingdom invaded as well.
I imagine King Charles does not appreciate the peril the revolt poses?
And with the truly devout and pacifistic Charlotte imprisoned, Gaston gets to radicalize the movement into violent revolt. I imagine the Duke of Burgundy and his coconspirators will find Gaston more amenable to their plans for bedlam in Charles homefront.
And independence or Brittany too! The celtic nations are certainly having a better go of it. Though I wonder if the independence will last.
I liked the section on the ship with the sailors going a bit crazy. And Benedetto sounds a bit like Spartacus.
Charles and his allies have stalled. I think the winter retirement will prove their undoing. By the time spring comes the smoldering in France could become a true revolt with the kingdom invaded as well.
I imagine King Charles does not appreciate the peril the revolt poses?
And with the truly devout and pacifistic Charlotte imprisoned, Gaston gets to radicalize the movement into violent revolt. I imagine the Duke of Burgundy and his coconspirators will find Gaston more amenable to their plans for bedlam in Charles homefront.
And independence or Brittany too! The celtic nations are certainly having a better go of it. Though I wonder if the independence will last.
Grouchio, The Georgians were united and reasonably strong in 1453 OTL, but about a decade later they broke down intocivil war and their neighbors never gave them a chance to recover. TTL different circumstances in the area allowed them to recover, though Tiblisi was sacked by the Ak Koyunlu during their civil war. A well timed alliance with the Ottomans allowed them to take revenge on the Koyunlu and take a fair portion of Armenia, while the collapse of the Golden Horde at Moscow's hands allowed them to conquer a fair ammount of relatively poor land in the northern Caucasus. Azerbajian is still free of them,and among their neighbors they are still weaker than all but Trebizond. Think of them as Serbia, but without the Wolf King.
Herr Frage, I hadn't even thought about Brittany being Celtic too. Still, OTL all the celts wound up with is most of Ireland, so a little love for them is okay I think. I just had noticed that Brittany was a very strong independant minded Duchy at the time (they waged multiple unsuccessful wars for greater autonomy in the OTL reign of Francis II), and kinda thought that nobody does much with them on here so they could use some attention.
I liked seeing Benedetto being hungry and stir crazy as opposed to angsty and oppressed. At this point, he has a three dimensional enough view of the Venetians to accept them as ordinary people. Of course, he's still only about 21, and has some pretty life-changing events coming up for him in the new world.
And Gaston, well, he's more willing to use violence than the good Lady Savoy, but if the last update showed us anything its that he has difficulty following orders, and leaves something to be desired in foresight as well.
As for Charles, at this point everyone thinks that the revolt is over and that John is still rotting in Marsielles, and to be fair they did capture the revolt's leader and drive her followers into exile, and John is still in Marsielles, it's just that there is more to each situation than meets the eye, and Charles gives Philip too much credit for his ability to spot these potential threats.
Tongera, It is still practiced, but without the majority Christian areas like Bulgaria and Macedonia it is much less relevant, and many of the Janisarries are now purchased slaves of various religious backrounds.
Religion in diplomacy is usually minimal, but to a large extent it depends on the ruler. It matters in every dealing for King Alphonso XII of Castile, but not much for most of the other currently reigning monarchs. Of course, at the moment the Byzantines have to be very Catholic friendly whether they want to or not, since they have Hungary and Venice poised to strike if they show any signs of aiding Islam enough to justify a land grab against them.
Herr Frage, I hadn't even thought about Brittany being Celtic too
. Still, OTL all the celts wound up with is most of Ireland, so a little love for them is okay I think. I just had noticed that Brittany was a very strong independant minded Duchy at the time (they waged multiple unsuccessful wars for greater autonomy in the OTL reign of Francis II), and kinda thought that nobody does much with them on here so they could use some attention.I liked seeing Benedetto being hungry and stir crazy as opposed to angsty and oppressed. At this point, he has a three dimensional enough view of the Venetians to accept them as ordinary people. Of course, he's still only about 21, and has some pretty life-changing events coming up for him in the new world.
And Gaston, well, he's more willing to use violence than the good Lady Savoy, but if the last update showed us anything its that he has difficulty following orders, and leaves something to be desired in foresight as well.
As for Charles, at this point everyone thinks that the revolt is over and that John is still rotting in Marsielles, and to be fair they did capture the revolt's leader and drive her followers into exile, and John is still in Marsielles, it's just that there is more to each situation than meets the eye, and Charles gives Philip too much credit for his ability to spot these potential threats.
Tongera, It is still practiced, but without the majority Christian areas like Bulgaria and Macedonia it is much less relevant, and many of the Janisarries are now purchased slaves of various religious backrounds.
Religion in diplomacy is usually minimal, but to a large extent it depends on the ruler. It matters in every dealing for King Alphonso XII of Castile, but not much for most of the other currently reigning monarchs. Of course, at the moment the Byzantines have to be very Catholic friendly whether they want to or not, since they have Hungary and Venice poised to strike if they show any signs of aiding Islam enough to justify a land grab against them.
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You reckon this can turn into the new Age Of Miracles? I also agree about Avitus writing style improvement.
Some vague speculations for the future.
Brittany's rise as a maritime power and trading powerhouse will occur as Venice declines. Brittany will work with Portugal to try and shut Venice out of the Atlantic and the New World. If they succeed the two will then be rivals.
The Empire Trebizond will take all of Crimea when Venice falls. Later Trebizond proper will finally fall to the Ottomans, with a brief successor state in Crimea. This will shortly join the ERE with the Komnenoi as autonomous vassals of the Emperor to prevent The Turks from trying to cross the sea or the Rus from seizing their lands.
The Irish will have at least one colony in the New World.
King Edmund of Ireland will try to take England after King Richard dies.
Brittany's rise as a maritime power and trading powerhouse will occur as Venice declines. Brittany will work with Portugal to try and shut Venice out of the Atlantic and the New World. If they succeed the two will then be rivals.
The Empire Trebizond will take all of Crimea when Venice falls. Later Trebizond proper will finally fall to the Ottomans, with a brief successor state in Crimea. This will shortly join the ERE with the Komnenoi as autonomous vassals of the Emperor to prevent The Turks from trying to cross the sea or the Rus from seizing their lands.
The Irish will have at least one colony in the New World.
King Edmund of Ireland will try to take England after King Richard dies.
cimon, thanks. As someone who is writing a TL as something as a practice to break into writing, it's nice to hear that my readers think I'm getting better. And yes, the TL is doing rather well in the Turtledoves, but I'll not jinx it by saying I think I'll win or anything
Herr Frage, a gentleman wouldn't tell, but I'm not feeling particularly gentlemanly, so I'll say that you definitely got some things right, but not all of them.
Tongera, sure. I'm American, but I don't let that color my politics much, as I feel we've done nothing especially wonderful with our power, and I feel more connected to my heritage and religion than my nationality. I'm a staunch Roman Catholic, and that colors allot of my politics. I would say I lean to the right, but I don't believe in pursecuting or alienating anyone.
As for hot button issues, I'm fine with homosexuality, including gay marriage, as long as the government does not require the Catholic church to perform it. Seperation of church and state should work both ways, and if the church only wants to allow heterosexual marriages then they should be allowed to stand for that, just as long as they aren't hurting or harassing anyone over it.
I'm a strict no abortion person, really with no exceptions. Again, I don't believe in pursecuting people over these things or standing outside abortion clinics with signs, but neither do I believe in taking away the life of someone without their consent. Of course for no abortions to work there would need to be more viable alternatives, but I will never believe that human life is not a net gain, so I'm for spending to make those alternatives work.
I feel that socialism and capitalism are both flawed systems, albeit it has taken capitalism longer to show the depths of its flaws, and that neither is "right". I don't think that they must be mutually exclusive, and that a happy medium could be reached if we could just get our minds out of the cold war for a while.
I favor strong monarchy over weak monarchy or democracy, though there definitely need to be at least a few immovable checks and balances in place, so I wouldn't say absolute monarchy, at least not quite. This stems from my belief that human beings have difficulty working together without a clear leader, and that when you tell them to work together as equals, that usually results in competition. Competition is all well and good, but when you are competing internationally, with other parties, and with other candidates within your party, I think it becomes too much, and the rate of competition becomes more destructive than its worth. Just imagine how much money is spent on the democrats and republicans fighting amongst themselves, then against eachother, every time there is an election. It boggles the mind of one such as me who rarely handles more than a few hundred dollars or so at a time.
Lastly, I don't support the death penalty, though admittedly I don't feel too strongly on the subject. If you havn't guessed by now, I don't much care for either major political party, and I have a feeling they don't much care for me.
I think that sums it up. Hopefully nobody finds my views too offensive to enjoy my writing. If you wan't to comment, fine, but don't flame or argue, that going for everyone, not just Tongera. I respect all views, those are just mine, and I hope not to let my views color my TL. People of all races, orientations, and religious afiliations will be given equal representation to the best of my ability (so long as it makes sence in the TL), but I make no promises that my abilities will be adequate to please everyone.
Update coming in the next day or two. Just curious, would anyone following but not posting like to sound off? I'd just like to get an idea of who's reading.
Herr Frage, a gentleman wouldn't tell, but I'm not feeling particularly gentlemanly, so I'll say that you definitely got some things right, but not all of them.
Tongera, sure. I'm American, but I don't let that color my politics much, as I feel we've done nothing especially wonderful with our power, and I feel more connected to my heritage and religion than my nationality. I'm a staunch Roman Catholic, and that colors allot of my politics. I would say I lean to the right, but I don't believe in pursecuting or alienating anyone.
As for hot button issues, I'm fine with homosexuality, including gay marriage, as long as the government does not require the Catholic church to perform it. Seperation of church and state should work both ways, and if the church only wants to allow heterosexual marriages then they should be allowed to stand for that, just as long as they aren't hurting or harassing anyone over it.
I'm a strict no abortion person, really with no exceptions. Again, I don't believe in pursecuting people over these things or standing outside abortion clinics with signs, but neither do I believe in taking away the life of someone without their consent. Of course for no abortions to work there would need to be more viable alternatives, but I will never believe that human life is not a net gain, so I'm for spending to make those alternatives work.
I feel that socialism and capitalism are both flawed systems, albeit it has taken capitalism longer to show the depths of its flaws, and that neither is "right". I don't think that they must be mutually exclusive, and that a happy medium could be reached if we could just get our minds out of the cold war for a while.
I favor strong monarchy over weak monarchy or democracy, though there definitely need to be at least a few immovable checks and balances in place, so I wouldn't say absolute monarchy, at least not quite. This stems from my belief that human beings have difficulty working together without a clear leader, and that when you tell them to work together as equals, that usually results in competition. Competition is all well and good, but when you are competing internationally, with other parties, and with other candidates within your party, I think it becomes too much, and the rate of competition becomes more destructive than its worth. Just imagine how much money is spent on the democrats and republicans fighting amongst themselves, then against eachother, every time there is an election. It boggles the mind of one such as me who rarely handles more than a few hundred dollars or so at a time.
Lastly, I don't support the death penalty, though admittedly I don't feel too strongly on the subject. If you havn't guessed by now, I don't much care for either major political party, and I have a feeling they don't much care for me
.I think that sums it up. Hopefully nobody finds my views too offensive to enjoy my writing. If you wan't to comment, fine, but don't flame or argue, that going for everyone, not just Tongera. I respect all views, those are just mine, and I hope not to let my views color my TL. People of all races, orientations, and religious afiliations will be given equal representation to the best of my ability (so long as it makes sence in the TL), but I make no promises that my abilities will be adequate to please everyone.
Update coming in the next day or two. Just curious, would anyone following but not posting like to sound off? I'd just like to get an idea of who's reading.
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