The Battle at Dawn: The first battle between the United States and Japan December 7-10, 1941

[galveston bay]

With the loss rates it almost seems that a carrier's air complement is good for one or maybe two strikes. With the hit/loss ratio of the torpedo planes I'd be tempted to leave them behind and load the carrier with 2/3rds fighters and 1/3rd dive bombers. Send half the fighters to escort the strikes and keep the other half for a CAP.

It's probably been mentioned before but replacement pilots are as much a part of the logistics stream as the airplanes are. That's why Shokaku's loss of aircrew is more damaging: the air wings of Shokaku and Zuikaku were filled out with instructor pilots.

The US Navy will be revising its air groups in the Pacific with a CAG of 36 Wildcats, 36 SBDs with the Atlantic Carriers raided to provide those and TBDs sent there (where they are just fine for ASW patrols) until the TBF is available. The Marines are going to be demanding immediate replacement of their Buffalos, or that squadrons be held at home until either Wildcats or the new Corsair is available (whichever comes first... historically it was the F4F-4 first, then Corsairs later)

The IJN will form a carrier force out of the Hiryu, Ryoho, Shoho, Zuiho, and Ryujo, the 2 undamaged BB, the Tone and Chikuma and the destroyers and light cruiser that was involved Hawaii to mind the store in the Pacific (acting as their striking and reaction force) while the heavy CV train new airgroups (and in the case of the Zuikaku undergo repairs) which means they are out of action until May at the earliest.

Conversion work of the Hiyo and Junyo (converted liners) will be made urgent, while work on the Chitose and Chiyoda will begin as soon as they can return to port. (almost 7 months earlier than OTL)

Work on the Shinano immediately comes to a halt (as it did in OTL)

 

[NHBL]

With the loss of two carriers, might Shinano be slated for conversion right away, instead of after Midway in OTL?

 

[longtimelurkerinMD]

Is Halsey dead then from injuries?

 

[galveston bay]

Is Halsey dead then from injuries?

no, he isn't dead, but he will be in the States recovering for several months

 

[galveston bay]

With the loss of two carriers, might Shinano be slated for conversion right away, instead of after Midway in OTL?

the better plan would be to scrap her and clear up space on that dock but most likely the Japanese would build her anyway as a carrier

 

[nbcman]

Will the IJN also rush some of the other merchant conversion ships such as the Taiyo, Unyo and Chuyo CVEs? They'll need the CVEs to train all the pilots they can.

EDIT: Assuming the IJN can find drydock space for all the ships that need to be repaired or rushed.

 

[galveston bay]

Will the IJN also rush some of the other merchant conversion ships such as the Taiyo, Unyo and Chuyo CVEs? They'll need the CVEs to train all the pilots they can.

The Chuyo (Nitta Maru) is taking part in the Wake Island, her two sisters are already undergoing conversion before the war started. The Argentina Maru, which in OTL was converted into the CVE Kaiyo, took 3 bomb hits and sank off Midway, as she was the largest troop transport in sight.

 

[eltf177]

What about CA Ibuki, early conversion for her too? And Chitose and Chiyoda?

 

[galveston bay]

What about CA Ibuki, early conversion for her too? And Chitose and Chiyoda?

I addressed the Chitose and Chiyoda above... the Ibuki hasn't been laid down yet (April 42). I am going to assume no panicky (and useless) conversions of battleships into bastardized half carriers

 

[sloreck]

Japanese shipbuilding capacity was quite limited. With carriers sunk earlier and needing replacement, with major units damaged ITTL but not OTL (at least at this time) this lack of capacity will begin to bite. I expect, like OTL, merchant shipping will take a construction hit as shipyard capacity will be used for IJN construction/repair.

 

[Zheng He]

Well the RYUHO probably won't get hit during the Doolittle Raid.

 

[galveston bay]

Well the RYUHO probably won't get hit during the Doolittle Raid.

I am going to assume the Saratoga takes her historic damage on January 24 as the Japanese have a lot of submarines in the area and keep them coming for a while.

As of March / April the USN has 3 Yorktown class CV in the Pacific, and the Wasp and Ranger are still in the Atlantic (Germany First is still the primary policy)

Which means a Doolittle Raid is imprudent to say the least. Someone also previously mentioned that the morale boost from it is less needed. I am going to go with Halpro try instead



Halpro
The Halverson Project



Halpro (The Halverson Project ) was planned in January 1942, within a month of the attack at Pearl Harbor. Initially, it was designed to be a SEQUEL to the most famous bombing mission of World War II, the Doolittle raid over Tokyo. The rapid movement of the Japanese offensive in China however, changed Halpro's mission and through a strange series of circumstances, the project would become the PREQUEL to what might well have been the second most famous bombing raid of the war.

In the first month after the United States entered World War II, the Air War Plans Division put forth a plan to establish a major fighting air command in Burma to turn back the Japanese' sweeping advance into China. That new command was to be designated the 10th Air Force, and in mid-January Operation Aquila was employed to begin the initial buildup necessary to establish that command.

Operation Aquila was a 5-point program designed to provide fighters, bombers, and a supply chain to the theater. The first three points established the fighter command and logistics:

• The supply requisite was to take the form of thirty-five DC-3 transports flown into the region.
  
  
• Fighters to augment Claire Chennault's AVG Flying Tigers were to be sent in the form of fifty-one P40Es to be assembled in West Africa and flown to China.
  
  
• Thirty-three factory-fresh A-20 attack planes under the command of Colonel Leo H. Dawson were to be transported to the Chinese air force under the lend-lease agreement, after which the pilots were to be assigned to the 10th Air Force.
  

The bomber element of the new 10th Air Force was to originate from two separate, highly secret projects.

• The first was a volunteer group of B-25 pilots under command of Lieutenant Colonel Jimmy Doolittle. The twenty-six medium range bombers were tasked with making a carrier-borne assault on Tokyo in what would become Doolittle's famous Tokyo Raid. Theirs was a two-part mission. After making the historic attack on the Japanese capitol, the raiders were to fly to China where pilots, crews and their B-25s were to be absorbed by the 10th Air Force. (It was the loss of all 26 bombers that distressed Doolittle to the belief that he would be court-martialed, despite the success of the first part of his mission.)
  
  
• Long-range bombing missions in the China-Burma theater would be carried out by a group of twenty-three B-24s under the command of Colonel Halvor "Hurry-up Harry" Halverson. This was the element that became known, by those few planners aware of its existence, as the Halpro Group (Halverson Project.) The group was tasked with flying EAST to reach China after completion of the Doolittle Raid. From their airfields in China, the Liberators would be within bombing range of Tokyo and able to continue the work from the west of Japan, that Doolittle's men started from an aircraft carrier east of the islands.
  

On February 12 while Doolittle was putting together his own volunteer crew, the 10th Air Force was activated at Patterson Field, Fairfield, Ohio. Five days later Colonel Harry A. Halverson was appointed the first Commanding Officer of the 10th Air Force. During March the Headquarters of the 10th was shifted from the U.S. to India after Major General Lewis H. Brereton, who had arrived in India from the Netherlands East Indies, assumed command. The move began on March 8th and was expected to take a month. At the time of the change of command the 10th had eight tactical aircraft at its disposal, all of them B-17s.

Meanwhile, Colonel Halverson began putting together his own unusual crew of airmen to pilot the twenty-three, factory-fresh B-24s to China. Only weeks after Doolittle's April 16 mission, the pilots of Halpro flew out of Florida. Their secretive sojourn to China took them south to Brazil before an eastward leg across the South Atlantic to Africa. From there the bombers flew to the Sudanese capitol of Khartoum, just beyond the range of the daily Axis raids on R.A.F. bases in Egypt.

Halpro's last leg was to have been the flight into Chekiang, China, from which they hoped to bomb Tokyo. On May 11 the Japanese launched a major offensive in Chekiang. By the time Halpro reached the Sudan the airfield in their intended area of operation had fallen. With nowhere to go Colonel Halverson put his pilots and crews into a series of training missions, while awaiting further orders.||

http://www.homeofheroes.com/wings/part2/09_ploesti.html
Those poor guys participated in Operation Tidal Wave instead, a mission that was marginally less risky

 

[Zheng He]

You're not going to keep the Halverson Detachment in Egypt where they were joined by elements of the 10th Air Force to become the 1st Provisional Bombardment Group?

 

[galveston bay]

You're not going to keep the Halverson Detachment in Egypt where they were joined by elements of the 10th Air Force to become the 1st Provisional Bombardment Group?

my logic is this... the Halpro project got cancelled because the Japanese conquered the area where it would have been based in response to the Doolittle Raid. No Doolittle Raid, then the Japanese Army remains focused on other missions.

Of course after the Halpro raid the Japanese will come hunting and slaughtering all, burning all etc

 

[StephenColbert27]

I wonder if they take even longer to execute the "Germany First" plan than OTL. Part of that strategy (IIRC) was the assumption that with the damage sustained at Pearl Harbor, the ability of the USN to mount any counter-offensive was extremely limited and therefore unwise. Here, they've already dealt some heavy counter-blows. Do Stark/King push for more resources in the Pacific even harder than OTL? With the success they've had, definitely have a chance to have some success in the war for resources.

 

[zert]

I learned something new now. I had not heard of Halvor Halverson or his group before. Getting his bombers and additional forces into China and performing some raids might be able to do a little more damage than the Doolittle Raid.

Though without OTL Raid, Doolittle might not get promoted as quickly. I look forward to seeing what the China Bombing Group might accomplish.

 

[zert]

With Saratoga being torpedoed ITTL, this will free up her air wing to help reinforce the decimated crews on the Enterprise and the Yorktown. There will still be the need for more new pilots and planes, but the replacements from the Saratoga will help to fill the gap.

 

[Zheng He]

I learned something new now. I had not heard of Halvor Halverson or his group before. Getting his bombers and additional forces into China and performing some raids might be able to do a little more damage than the Doolittle Raid.

Though without OTL Raid, Doolittle might not get promoted as quickly. I look forward to seeing what the China Bombing Group might accomplish.

OTL Halverson's bombers became the first contingent of American air units that deployed to Egypt in the summer of 1942. Ultimately the US deployed on fighter groups (P-40Fs), one medium bomber group (B-25s), and two heavy bomber groups (B-24s and B-24/B-17 mixed). They were known as US Army Middle East Air Force (USAMEAF) and were commanded by General Brereton. They fought with the Western Desert Air Force and the 8th Army in the summer and fall of 42 and eventually became the 9th Air Force.

 

[zert]

OTL Halverson's bombers became the first contingent of American air units that deployed to Egypt in the summer of 1942. Ultimately the US deployed on fighter groups (P-40Fs), one medium bomber group (B-25s), and two heavy bomber groups (B-24s and B-24/B-17 mixed). They were known as US Army Middle East Air Force (USAMEAF) and were commanded by General Brereton. They fought with the Western Desert Air Force and the 8th Army in the summer and fall of 42 and eventually became the 9th Air Force.

Thanks for the additional information. Did USAMEAF aid with El Alamein lead up and actual battle?

 

[Butchpfd]

as I reread his biography I am thinking that would make life easier ... anytime after 1935 he can be written out of history

Perhaps for something different his older Brother Captain Arthur MacArthur III (USNA 1896) could survive his appendicitis in 1923 and rise to successfully command the Pacific Fleet I the opening stages of the war, or be the Admiral Who prepared the Navy for war, 1937 -1941. Who knows since he started his career in TBD's and submarines the Navy could have gone to war with working torpedoes..