An Age of Miracles: The Revival of Rhomanion

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Adio Venice it was nice knowing you, Adio to you the Pope in Roma, when Europe hears about what the Venetians hear that's the end of them, it's not something they can ignore, if they can do that to one royal family they can do that to any royal family which basically black lists Venice now and that the Pope has condoned the invasion which this has happened is a massive strike against him...

Although I think a lot of this is going to come off on how it appears - so we might be getting carried away, at least as far as the rest of Europe is concerned.

Put it bluntly, there's a difference between Venetian soldiers rampaging out of control, and Venice deliberately targeting the Royal Family.

Still, this is going to be bad.
 
If their is a French esque revolution in the future, then I have feeling that the Eastern Roman Empire will be very anti-revolution thanks to this. When a republican soilderes does this shit to your monarchy then the Eastern Roman Empire will dispise the forces of revolution.
 
But the genoens are the Eastern Roman's allie. Have been sence the Lazkireds actually.
...I think you don't really understand Theodoros' psyche when he hears of the news. He probably just won't really care which Italians are his allies at his point. "If the Venetians are wild beasts, so must all Italians", he thinks. "Put them all down!!!"
 
...I think you don't really understand Theodoros' psyche when he hears of the news. He probably just won't really care which Italians are his allies at his point. "If the Venetians are wild beasts, so must all Italians", he thinks. "Put them all down!!!"

Since when did Theodoros become a deranged, delusional, lunatic?

Wanting to raze Venice to the ground? Makes sense. Blaming all Italians, when "Italy" is a geographic expression, and several of the Italian states are enemies of Venice?

There's mad, and then there's madness.
 
Since when did Theodoros become a deranged, delusional, lunatic?

Wanting to raze Venice to the ground? Makes sense. Blaming all Italians, when "Italy" is a geographic expression, and several of the Italian states are enemies of Venice?

There's mad, and then there's madness.
Well, I think he's about to next chapter. Won't be my fault if there's a certain genocide coming up in Europe. Ciao!
 
Well, I love/hate the representation of Medieval brutality, but more than that, I'm interested to see what this starts in Andreas. He's 10, so it's not like he has been damaged in his primary formative years, but this is one of the worst things that can be done to a person short of raping them. He is old enough to know that not all people are bad, but this will make him hate anyone who he considers responsible for this. The questions are, can he channel his rage into something useful, and, who/what does he blame this on. Obviously he blames the Venetian soldiers, but does he blame all Venetians? Does he blame the pope, and if so does he blame Pope Julius, the Roman Papacy, or all Popes in general? Does his father share in the blame for leaving him and his mother defenseless? Will he become suspicious of his father in general because of this? If he does, he might even blame Alexia simply for being the product of his father's infidelity. These are the questions that I find most relevant, since Theodoros has most likely a maximum of 10 years left, which means that Andreas, provided he's competent, will be on the throne for decades.

Very interesting questions. I guess Andreas' mind is the most important thing for the time the Rhomans will be able to strike back.

It must be said most of the time women and civilians in general didn't get a "fair treatment"(to use an understatement). The Venetians in this TL are not very likeable, but given the period they are not such monsters (to be clear their actions remain vile). Kudos to Basileus for making it the narrative so powerful and its content so outrageous.

Poor Smyrna and then Thessalonika, let's hope not Costantinople.
 
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Hopefully Thessalonica will hold the line untill help can come.

And I truly wonder what the response of the mediterranean world will be, considering the intricate trade routes ensuring a faster than normal for the time spread of the news.

Avignon won't be able to ignore this, nor can the Marinids, Al-Andalus and othjer powers
 
Hopefully Thessalonica will hold the line untill help can come.

I guess it depends also on where the Macedonian (if I got right) Tagmata is, also as soon it becomes apparent to it the final objective of the offensive it would be wiser a retrat to Costantinople to defend it, using hit and run tactics, maybe a few ambushes (especially against the Bulgarians), while avoiding pitched battles.
 
well, Venice, i hope you go straight to hell, and the devil himself will look upon the doge with disgust.

even the mongols are more civilized than them. (they pretty much gave advanced warning and a chance to surrender peacefully)
 
thekingsguard: The Venetians here are definitely acting like savages; comes from hiring a bunch of pirates to swell your armada. Although by the standards of medieval sacks, this isn't any worse than usual.

Dragos Cel Mare: Yeah, the sack here is actually fairly standard for a medieval sack which is only made special by who got caught in it. The Romans will not be so lenient.

And spot on with the cycle of vengeance.

eliphas8: Agreed. It's like 1204 all over again. Drowning the doge would be poetic justice from Theodoros' point of view. 'You killed my wife, well now I'm going to let your "wife" kill you.'

Tongera: Unlikely. Venice's site is too valuable to wreck, and it has too many people for everyone to be killed. Although the Romans will certainly try. They'd wipe out all vestiges of the Serene Republic, but keep the city. After all, it was a part of the Empire once.

rldragon: Yeah, the Middle Ages were rather gruesome at times, although every time can say that unfortunately.

The Sandman: That's the crux of the problems for the Venetians. No monarch can tolerate this precedent, even if they support this one incident.

Derekc2: The Venetians sort-of shot themselves in the foot. They hired a bunch of pirates to bolster the armada, and when they started looting and raping and killing the remainder joined in. Not all Venetians agree with what's going on, and Part 2 will show one of them.

The Romans will be anti-republican. When they hear the word 'Republic' the first thing they think of is 'Venice'. Hardly conducive to make them receptive.

bolhabela: That's the Venetian problem. Even the Holy Roman Emperor, who likes the idea of the Roman Imperial family being wiped out, won't be able to stomach this precedent. It's way, way, way, too easy for it to be turned around to bite him.

Elfwine: Agreed. Whether or not their excuses are true, not very many people are going to believe the Venetians.

The Venetians weren't specifically targeting the Imperial family. After all, having the Empress, one of the Princesses, and the Crown Prince means astronomically HUGE ransoms. But since Helena, Zoe, and Andreas weren't in garb that screamed 'I'm royal!' like purple robes, the Venetians weren't very thorough on their background checks before they started treating them like peasants in a city sack.

Evilprodigy: They were. The Venetians wouldn't expect Roman royalty to be in woolen clothing, not when they have access to both Roman and Chinese silk.

Avitus: Andreas will be getting a whole lot of attention in the coming years. The answer to your questions, at least in part, will be in Part 2.

Grouchio: Neither Andreas or Theodoros will exterminate all of Italy. Genoa, Ancona, and Urbino are all friends, while Sicily and Milan are both friendly-leaning neutrals.

Ferngolly: Yeah, the Roman response is not going to be pretty at all.

MerryPrankster: Yeah, something like this already happened once, in 1204. The Romans still haven't quite gotten over that, and now this...

Sidheach: In retrospect from the Pope's point of view, it's actually a very, very good thing he didn't call this a crusade.

General Finley: "Two hundred and fifty years ago the dogs came. They sacked our cities, slaughtered our people, and raped our mothers and sisters, even in the churches of the God they claimed to worship. Then we were too weak to strike back. And now they have done it again. But this time it is different. This time we are strong. And this time we will strike back.

"I will be a Timur to the state of Venice."

Arrix85: Agreed. By the standards of the Middle Ages, the Venetians here aren't being any worse than usual. Doesn't mean they're not disgusting, but nobody around them, including the Romans, is any better. After all, in Italy the Romans were practicing a primitive eugenics program by kidnapping 'Italian' children to be raised as Romans.

And it is the Macedonian tagma in the Balkans now, currently facing a combined Serbian-Bulgarian army that outnumbers it about three to one.

frozenpredator: The word will spread rapidly, and Avignon is definitely going to hang this over Rome's head.

Mathalamus: Before this, in Roman eyes, the Lords of Asia (Timur and Shah Rukh) were demons. Well, guess who just got added to the list.
 
And it is the Macedonian tagma in the Balkans now, currently facing a combined Serbian-Bulgarian army that outnumbers it about three to one.

That I knew, my question about its position was in relation to the city of Thessalonica, the smart thing (with lots of hindsightvium, etc...) wouldn't be to be boxed in this city by the Serbians-Bulgarians, but to retreat toward Constantinople. If they are spread out, it's gonna be difficult. Three to one wouldn't be that bad against the latter, but against the Serbians knights...
 
Mathalamus: Before this, in Roman eyes, the Lords of Asia (Timur and Shah Rukh) were demons. Well, guess who just got added to the list.

nah, demons at least have some sort of honour about them in their deals, although they usually backfire for the person makign them with em.

Venice is a disease
 
What would have happened if the pope did call a crusade? Would other potential crusaders join in, after what happened at Smyrna?
 
Arrix85: The Macedonian troops are scattered in a band of territory stretching from the Vardar river (just west of Thessalonika) to just west of Adrianople. How much and where they are able to concentrate will depend on how fast the Serbs move. The Serbians will try and push them west, and they'll be helped by the fact that the Macedonians are situated more to defend Thessalonika. The tagma responsible for covering Constantinople, the Thracian, is in the Holy Land.

frozenpredator: Good point. More specifically, Venice is a disease of boils, one cured with lancing.

Tongera: It'd be a disaster...for the pope. Besides Bavaria, the most likely crusaders are England-France and Lotharingia. The latter especially won't join now, since it's been on the receiving end of something similar, the sack of Autun by King Francis I of France 'The Butcher'. Given time and fancy words by Julius I that could change, but right after Smyrna not a chance.
 
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