VVD0D95
Banned
Aha yes, yes I did, though knowing Charles of Valois, he's going to be getting involved as well.
Born a King; The Life and Times of John the Posthumous
- Thread starter Space Oddity
- Start date
Aha yes, yes I did, though knowing Charles of Valois, he's going to be getting involved as well.
Well, we'll just have to wait and see, because first up will be a post about the amazing Eddie Two.
I'm sorry to say that I made none of that up. There's some interesting backstory there--Philip IV, John's grandfather expelled the Jews and stole their property. Louis X, John's father, let them back in, and even assisted moneylenders in collecting outstanding debts they had left over from their prior residence. Throw in a few years of famine, and you essentially had a powderkeg that went off again and again for a few years.
More the former--you had to eat, and the Italians did the same thing, with about the same results. I think for many peasants it ran "Italians--well, at least they didn't kill Christ".
Which was of course, completely inaccurate.
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So with Philip dead, who will be the regent? I'm sure the Count of de la Marche would be brought forward as a candidate. But would the Count of Valois contest it? And did the Count of Poitiers die without any sons as he did OTL? Hopefully, he did, so his appanage would revert back to the crown.
1320-2: England
1320-2: “If I Be Cruel And Grow Tyrannous, Now Let Them Thank Themselves, And Rue Too Late.”
"By now, the situation in England was reaching a breaking point. Edward II's new regime was falling apart in a worsening cycle of violence and reprisals, one which frequently wed old rivalries to the anti-Despenser cause, such as the Mortimers' raids on their lands. Edward's response to all this was to close ranks ever further on those who told him what he didn't want to hear. Queen Isabella was among those left on the outside. Accused--not with cause--of spying for France, and seen--again, not without cause--as dangerously sympathetic to the Lords Ordainers[1], Isabella found herself first isolated in the court, and then a virtual prisoner of the Despensers, as the situation rapidly degraded...
"Matters peaked in 1321, as a series of inheritance disputes (which saw the Despensers using their influence to insure things went their way) inflamed tempers beyond bearing. Early in the year, the Earl of Lancaster, the Earl of Hereford, and the Lords Mortimer met together to plot an attack on the Despenser lands in in Wales--Edward called for the lords to meet him, first in Gloucester and then in Bristol. Their refusal saw the the beginning of the rebellion...
"Things progressed quickly, with the self-proclaimed "contrariants" seizing a great deal of territory in Wales, and soon threatening London. Efforts at negotiation stalled in mutual recriminations, accusations, and threats--the death of Queen Isabella[2] likewise produced a horde of angry rhetoric on both sides. In the end, it was only the efforts of the Earl of Pembroke that managed a truce between the two sides, with Edward agreeing to exile the Despensers. It was an imperfect truce at best, that saw both sides keeping their forces gathered, and as circumstances proved, it would not be a lasting one.
"A small party of pilgrims sent by the King to Cantebury to say a mass for the late Queen's soul proved to be the catalyst[3]--stopping at contrariant-occupied Leeds Castle along the way, they were refused entry and turned away with violence. Support for the contrariants plummeted--Edward was able to besiege Leeds with a swelling army, and once it was taken, march towards Wales to deal with the Mortimers. Facing this and a peasant uprising, the pair surrendered, leaving only Hereford and Lancaster remaining of the ringleaders. Watching his cause disintegrate around him, Lancaster proceeded to dig himself deeper by making overtures to the Scots and the French.
"The King crossed the Severn after the Battle of Burton Bridge, and engaged Lancaster's forces directly at Bouroughbridge, a confrontation where Lancaster was captured, and Hereford slain. In under a year, Edward had veered from near disaster to a total victory at home. For the first time in a long while, his power seemed secure..."
--A Magnificent Counterfeit: the Life and Reign of Edward II of England, Jason Soames 1994
--------------------------------
[1] The Lord Ordainers was the name of the nobles and barons who'd rebelled against Edward's favoritism towards Piers Gaveston, amongst other things. The group had instituted what were supposed to be reforms to the government that would constrain Edward's powers. Said reforms fell apart, partially because Edward was still the king when you got down to it, and partially the Lord Ordainers tended to be out for themselves, and thus marvelously easy to play against each other.
[2] This is is of course decades earlier than her OTL death. I will leave the cause a mystery but will note that OTL, she had her last child with Edward during this time.
[3] IOTL, it was a pilgrimage by Isabella herself.
"By now, the situation in England was reaching a breaking point. Edward II's new regime was falling apart in a worsening cycle of violence and reprisals, one which frequently wed old rivalries to the anti-Despenser cause, such as the Mortimers' raids on their lands. Edward's response to all this was to close ranks ever further on those who told him what he didn't want to hear. Queen Isabella was among those left on the outside. Accused--not with cause--of spying for France, and seen--again, not without cause--as dangerously sympathetic to the Lords Ordainers[1], Isabella found herself first isolated in the court, and then a virtual prisoner of the Despensers, as the situation rapidly degraded...
"Matters peaked in 1321, as a series of inheritance disputes (which saw the Despensers using their influence to insure things went their way) inflamed tempers beyond bearing. Early in the year, the Earl of Lancaster, the Earl of Hereford, and the Lords Mortimer met together to plot an attack on the Despenser lands in in Wales--Edward called for the lords to meet him, first in Gloucester and then in Bristol. Their refusal saw the the beginning of the rebellion...
"Things progressed quickly, with the self-proclaimed "contrariants" seizing a great deal of territory in Wales, and soon threatening London. Efforts at negotiation stalled in mutual recriminations, accusations, and threats--the death of Queen Isabella[2] likewise produced a horde of angry rhetoric on both sides. In the end, it was only the efforts of the Earl of Pembroke that managed a truce between the two sides, with Edward agreeing to exile the Despensers. It was an imperfect truce at best, that saw both sides keeping their forces gathered, and as circumstances proved, it would not be a lasting one.
"A small party of pilgrims sent by the King to Cantebury to say a mass for the late Queen's soul proved to be the catalyst[3]--stopping at contrariant-occupied Leeds Castle along the way, they were refused entry and turned away with violence. Support for the contrariants plummeted--Edward was able to besiege Leeds with a swelling army, and once it was taken, march towards Wales to deal with the Mortimers. Facing this and a peasant uprising, the pair surrendered, leaving only Hereford and Lancaster remaining of the ringleaders. Watching his cause disintegrate around him, Lancaster proceeded to dig himself deeper by making overtures to the Scots and the French.
"The King crossed the Severn after the Battle of Burton Bridge, and engaged Lancaster's forces directly at Bouroughbridge, a confrontation where Lancaster was captured, and Hereford slain. In under a year, Edward had veered from near disaster to a total victory at home. For the first time in a long while, his power seemed secure..."
--A Magnificent Counterfeit: the Life and Reign of Edward II of England, Jason Soames 1994
--------------------------------
[1] The Lord Ordainers was the name of the nobles and barons who'd rebelled against Edward's favoritism towards Piers Gaveston, amongst other things. The group had instituted what were supposed to be reforms to the government that would constrain Edward's powers. Said reforms fell apart, partially because Edward was still the king when you got down to it, and partially the Lord Ordainers tended to be out for themselves, and thus marvelously easy to play against each other.
[2] This is is of course decades earlier than her OTL death. I will leave the cause a mystery but will note that OTL, she had her last child with Edward during this time.
[3] IOTL, it was a pilgrimage by Isabella herself.
At the present--very little. They're about where they were IOTL about now.
VVD0D95
Banned
Aha true, though without the she wolf there, the mass exodus that came in 1327 might be lacking, or it might not.
I wish I knew more about the situation OTL so I could comment more thoroughly, but the early death of Isabella (I'm guessing miscarriage or poisoning) is certain to have significant after-effects...
EDIT: Oh damn, no Isabella means no Isabella-led invasion, among many other things...
EDIT: Oh damn, no Isabella means no Isabella-led invasion, among many other things...
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