WI: the Magyars stay in Ukraine

rcduggan · Jan 28, 2008

what if, in 895, in a battle between the Magyars and the Pechenegs, the Magyars are victorious and completely destroy the Pechenegs, vassalizing and gradually assimilating the survivors. Without the Pecheneg threat, the Magyars stay in Etelkuzu (east of Moldova) and do not enter Hungary.

what would the effects be on Europe? who would take the Hungarians' place on the Pannonian plain? what would happen as a result?

ninebucks · Jan 28, 2008

rcduggan said:
Who would take the Hungarians' place on the Pannonian plain? what would happen as a result?

More Yugoslavs, I would imagine.

some kind of chimp · Jan 28, 2008

possibly the Cumans could take the place of the Magyars.

seraphim74 · Jan 28, 2008

There was a similar threat a few days or a week ago; WI no Magyar invasion, or something like that. Magyars were supposed to remain far away in the steppes, IIRC.
Well, as far my contribution goes, it doesn't change much. Great Moravia survives, with relative good chance of expanding north and becoming a kind a Slavic empire in Central Europe, including today's Poland, East Germany, Czech Republic, Slovakia and Hungary - or perhaps more.

rcduggan · Jan 31, 2008

seraphim74 said:
There was a similar threat a few days or a week ago; WI no Magyar invasion, or something like that. Magyars were supposed to remain far away in the steppes, IIRC.

do you have a link to that thread?

seraphim74 · Feb 1, 2008

Here you are

https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=82358

Tyr · Feb 1, 2008

If they're left out in the Ukraine I wouldn't see the Magyars 'civilizing' so readily...There could well end up being none of them today- eventually wiped out and absorbed by the mongols or some other big, bad, horse people.

Valdemar II · Feb 1, 2008

Leej said:
If they're left out in the Ukraine I wouldn't see the Magyars 'civilizing' so readily...There could well end up being none of them today- eventually wiped out and absorbed by the mongols or some other big, bad, horse people.

It would be the most likely case.

rcduggan · Feb 1, 2008

Leej said:
If they're left out in the Ukraine I wouldn't see the Magyars 'civilizing' so readily...There could well end up being none of them today- eventually wiped out and absorbed by the mongols or some other big, bad, horse people.

but if the Magyar people stayed in Etelkuzu long enough (it would be three hundred years before the Mongols come) wouldn't they populate and attach to the area enough to survive?

Valdemar II · Feb 1, 2008

rcduggan said:
but if the Magyar people stayed in Etelkuzu long enough (it would be three hundred years before the Mongols come) wouldn't they populate and attach to the area enough to survive?

Maybe but the truth was that people replaced people fast on the Russian and Central Asian steppes, There was large enclaves of Indo-European in central asia a thousand years ago, they was replaced by Turks and today they have been replaced by Russians , which are slowly been replaced by Turks again.