The discussion in the "Carthage Triumphant" thread got me to thinking...
In OTL, the Carthaginians had an alliance with a league of Etruscan cities against the Greeks of southern Italy and Sicily during the period from roughly 500-350 BC. Etruscan and Carthaginian fleets actually cooperated in battle against the Greeks, and gave the Greeks a hard time of it. Meanwhile, the Etruscan cities were also beginning to be engaged in conflict against Rome...but Carthage was at that time signing treaties of friendship with Rome. But it didn't have to be that way.
Let's suppose that, instead, the Etruscans and the Carthaginians sign a new treaty in 450 BC which commits them to support each other against not only the Greeks, but also Rome. Rome has not, by this time, had time to establish control over more than a few nearby Latin cities, and is quite weak at this time. The Carthaginians and Etruscans defeat the tiny Roman army, capture the city, slaughter the inhabitants (or sell them all into slavery) and destroy the town itself. Later, Etruscan colonists re-settle the site, but the new town, like other Etruscan cities, is never able to form more than a temporary alliance with other Etruscan cities, and Italy never is united under one power, or if it is, it happens much later and a different culture prevails.
So with Rome removed from the picture, what happens? I see several possible outcomes...
--Will Carthage prevail in it's wars with the Greeks of southern Italy and Sicily? If so, what will be it's relationship with the Hellenistic kingdoms to the east?
--Will Pyrrhus of Epirus defeat and conquer Carthage, extending Hellenistic rule throughout the Mediterranean basin?
--Can the Etruscans eventually get their act together and unite, perhaps in response to pressure from the Celts, and become a rival to Carthage for power in the western Mediterranean?
--Would some other non-Etruscan Italian city or tribe (Samnites, for example)be able to play the role of Rome and unite Italy (and eventually, the Mediterranean world) under it's domination?
--Could the Celts eventually (in Gaul, perhaps, or in Iberia) form a unified state capable of surviving for a long period of time?
--Perhaps the Parthians re-establish control over the whole extent of the old Achaemenid Persian Empire, and even invade Europe? They pretty much spanked the Hellenistic armies they came into contact with, but Rome did a better job of resisting them (not always, of course, but enough to keep them out of Syria, Anatolia, Palestine, and Egypt most of the time, and Europe all the time).
Are there any possibilities I am leaving out?
In OTL, the Carthaginians had an alliance with a league of Etruscan cities against the Greeks of southern Italy and Sicily during the period from roughly 500-350 BC. Etruscan and Carthaginian fleets actually cooperated in battle against the Greeks, and gave the Greeks a hard time of it. Meanwhile, the Etruscan cities were also beginning to be engaged in conflict against Rome...but Carthage was at that time signing treaties of friendship with Rome. But it didn't have to be that way.
Let's suppose that, instead, the Etruscans and the Carthaginians sign a new treaty in 450 BC which commits them to support each other against not only the Greeks, but also Rome. Rome has not, by this time, had time to establish control over more than a few nearby Latin cities, and is quite weak at this time. The Carthaginians and Etruscans defeat the tiny Roman army, capture the city, slaughter the inhabitants (or sell them all into slavery) and destroy the town itself. Later, Etruscan colonists re-settle the site, but the new town, like other Etruscan cities, is never able to form more than a temporary alliance with other Etruscan cities, and Italy never is united under one power, or if it is, it happens much later and a different culture prevails.
So with Rome removed from the picture, what happens? I see several possible outcomes...
--Will Carthage prevail in it's wars with the Greeks of southern Italy and Sicily? If so, what will be it's relationship with the Hellenistic kingdoms to the east?
--Will Pyrrhus of Epirus defeat and conquer Carthage, extending Hellenistic rule throughout the Mediterranean basin?
--Can the Etruscans eventually get their act together and unite, perhaps in response to pressure from the Celts, and become a rival to Carthage for power in the western Mediterranean?
--Would some other non-Etruscan Italian city or tribe (Samnites, for example)be able to play the role of Rome and unite Italy (and eventually, the Mediterranean world) under it's domination?
--Could the Celts eventually (in Gaul, perhaps, or in Iberia) form a unified state capable of surviving for a long period of time?
--Perhaps the Parthians re-establish control over the whole extent of the old Achaemenid Persian Empire, and even invade Europe? They pretty much spanked the Hellenistic armies they came into contact with, but Rome did a better job of resisting them (not always, of course, but enough to keep them out of Syria, Anatolia, Palestine, and Egypt most of the time, and Europe all the time).
Are there any possibilities I am leaving out?