Apparently, 100,000 years ago, camels as tall as elephants roamed the deserts of Syria. What if these beasts had survived? They were apparently a form of dromedary camel, similar to the ones which were later domesticated. How would civilization have been impacted, assuming these giants could have been domesticated as their smaller cousins were?
Giant Camels survive in the Middle East
- Thread starter robertp6165
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Well... They'd be useful pack/draft animals... though not quite as dextrous as elephants for working (camels can't be trained to lift logs, they have no trunks), they'd probably be faster and have more endurance.
As war beasts, they would be rather uber. Unlike elephants, I don't believe camels are as easily spooked, plus you have the whole being faster and having more endurance thing...
To top it off, elephants are merely tamed, but these camels could probably be bred in captivity... assuming they are a lot like the camels we know. If they are not, well, that isn't a very exciting PoD.
But assuming the Arabs did figure it out, I'm guessing they would try to ride them down the Alps and into Rome...if these camels have the same 'go for many many miles without water' ability of modern camels, the freight moving capacity of those ancient ME societies just got a big boost....
Just a curious note: One of the problems that Xerxes I had in his Grecian campaign was the great number of his charging camels that were attacked and eaten by lions while he was moving trough Macedonia (there were a quite important population of lions there untill the second century b.C.). If the Persians use camels as big as elephants the animals would be invulnerable to lion packs.
That would be true if the camel-riders were stupid enough to allow the elephants to close with them. But the camels would be a lot faster and generally more nimble than the elephants. More likely they would (to quote Muhammad Ali) "float like a butterfly and sting like a bee," and never allow the elephant to close. Archers or javelin-men in a howdah on the camel's back eventually will get the shot needed to take the elephant down (assuming they themselves are not picked off by the archers in the elephant's own howdah).
Well, think about it. Really big camels. They would be slowed down quite a bit from the wee camels we all know and love. Don't discount an elephant's speed as well. They're fast, they chase down people all the time. The camels would probably have one main advantage.
There would be more of them, they'd also probably be less skittish and prone to going insane in the middle of a battle. Once rocketry develops this would mean that camels would phase elephants out as the medieval tank. They'd be a bit faster than elephants yes, but when a camel starts running it shifts its weight all over the place. So just hold on real tight I guess.
There would be more of them, they'd also probably be less skittish and prone to going insane in the middle of a battle. Once rocketry develops this would mean that camels would phase elephants out as the medieval tank. They'd be a bit faster than elephants yes, but when a camel starts running it shifts its weight all over the place. So just hold on real tight I guess.
No doubt. But Elephants are massively built with relatively short legs in proportion to their body size. The Giant Camel will be much leaner than an elephant and with longer legs. This necessarily translates into much greater speed and agility.
Being atop a charging elephant would be no picnic, either.
That's true. But elephants chasing people down is not saying much, as people don't run very fast. And, the elephants chasing people down don't have people riding on top of them. A charging elephant would not be a very good fighting platform. If the elephant has to charge to catch the camel, the fighting value of the elephant...from a human point of view...is effectively neutralized.
Agreed, that could very well be.
I mean, I'd love to see a timeline with giant camels, because I love camels. I just think that the only real advantage camels would have against the elephants would be that there are more of them.
Don't forget that elephants are really intelligent though. One properly pissed off elephant with nobody on it could do so pretty heavy damage to the camels and their riders before it's taken down.
Unless of course they have rockets.
One of the main things I see with even larger camels is increased viability of really big caravans travelling everywhere. Possibly a later discovery of the Americas as the Silk Road becomes more efficient?
Don't forget that elephants are really intelligent though. One properly pissed off elephant with nobody on it could do so pretty heavy damage to the camels and their riders before it's taken down.
Unless of course they have rockets.
One of the main things I see with even larger camels is increased viability of really big caravans travelling everywhere. Possibly a later discovery of the Americas as the Silk Road becomes more efficient?
Which is basically all the advantage you need. If you can breed them in captivity, you can breed them anywhere. No need to import elephants from Africa or India, if you can just grow your own camels, wherever you are.
Well, the camels have human riders, and they aren't so shabby on intelligence either. Besides, the more agile camels, even with humans aboard, should be able to stay out of the way of even an angry elephant, unless they are in too tight a formation. With no ranged weapon fire coming from the elephant (who is riderless) the camel riders can probably get enough projectiles lodged into the elephant to make it second guess its decision to charge a line of animals only slightly smaller than itself.
How much more efficient would they be? Is it more efficient to feed one big camel, or several small camels, and which has more carrying capacity?
The best advantages for these camels have to be there size and durability. I think the military aspect is being played up alittle too much, I see these more as pack animals, carrying the water and supplies of the army.
As time goes on these creatures could play an important role in warfare, at least from a logistical standpoint. A creature that requires little water( assuming it is like its smaller cousin), is built for the desert's hot days and freezing nights, and can hold alot of gear. Also it means less creatures to feed and hold the same amount of supplies. Let us just for the sake of argument say a large camel can hold as much as two or four regular camels so that mean less animals to care for. The Romans traverse the middle east and Africa all the faster thanks to the pack animals. The Christans in the crusades may find the one thing they need to win battles a steady stream of supplies.
As time goes on these creatures could play an important role in warfare, at least from a logistical standpoint. A creature that requires little water( assuming it is like its smaller cousin), is built for the desert's hot days and freezing nights, and can hold alot of gear. Also it means less creatures to feed and hold the same amount of supplies. Let us just for the sake of argument say a large camel can hold as much as two or four regular camels so that mean less animals to care for. The Romans traverse the middle east and Africa all the faster thanks to the pack animals. The Christans in the crusades may find the one thing they need to win battles a steady stream of supplies.
Keenir
Banned
increasing the size of a camel, means that the legs will be thicker and heavier than in the smaller camels.
Certainly, but perhaps not to the thickness of an elephant. A quick search on yahoo tells me it would have been more the size of a giraffe than an elephant. So, it is still concievable that the giant camel would be just a really big looking camel. Indeed, the bones found were all around twice the size of a regular dromedary.
The article also says they stood as tall as some African elephants are at the shoulder.