Bitwars: An alternative look at video games in the 1990's

nezza

C+VG Magazine October 1993

"The battle for video game supremacy has begun in earnest. The three big companies are gearing up for a huge christmas fight.

Nintendo and Sony have high hopes for their SNES Mark 2 hoping that their new Cartridge and CD combination games such as Super Mario 4 will take the crown.

Sega's Neptune system has already made its mark with its backward capability to play Master System Games as well as Megadrive and CD32 software.

Finally 3DO are aiming at mass media with the ability to play both games and movies on VCD thanks to their deal with Fox.
 

Nivek

Nice for the post here in 1900 forum, feel better and can recived more visits.

So Sony and Nintendo work together, so there was a different 1991?(or 1988? acording the legends?)m i think, Square, Enix, Konami and Capcom will be happy with that movement.

So Sega released a better SEGA-CD and a integrated console with the genesis? nice, so the CD32 is a fusion of Otl SEGA-CD and 32x? that would be nice and give leverage to compete against Nintendo and now 3DO Group

So 3DO manage to have a movie deal, the same year VCD are released(and you should add Universal to the mix, that will give rights for Star Trek Movies and shows) and maybe the system will be better priced(or justify the price tag), how will affect this Panasonic who wanted to adquire the 3DO before those goes abadon their hardware.

And what happened to NEC and Hudson? decided abandon the market?
 

nezza

Sony, Nintendo and 3DO see cd's as a way of increasing audio and visual power, increasing game complexity and providing greater challenges for the gamers.

For example Super Mario Brothers 4 is a hybrid game. It needs both cartridge and CD. The idea being that most of the game is played on the cartridge but the CD contains extra levels for those players who achieve certain goals or finish the game. ( For example if a player beats the main game then they are given access on the disc to the japanese version of SMB2). The cartridge also contains a battery backup for memory.

Sega is slightly different. If players complete Sonic 4 on the cartridge they are given access on the CD to old master system games.

3DO on the other hand go down a different route. They focus on new games as well as movies and TV with Fox (later Paramount and Universal) as well as Sky TV in the UK with a groundbreaking deal where Fox and Sky release their most popular programs on CD.

Hudson and NEC continue with the PC engine in Japan and the USA but without the strength of the "big three" they don't come to the UK or Europe.
 

Nivek

nezza said:
Sony, Nintendo and 3DO see cd's as a way of increasing audio and visual power, increasing game complexity and providing greater challenges for the gamers.

For example Super Mario Brothers 4 is a hybrid game. It needs both cartridge and CD. The idea being that most of the game is played on the cartridge but the CD contains extra levels for those players who achieve certain goals or finish the game. ( For example if a player beats the main game then they are given access on the disc to the japanese version of SMB2). The cartridge also contains a battery backup for memory.

Sega is slightly different. If players complete Sonic 4 on the cartridge they are given access on the CD to old master system games.

3DO on the other hand go down a different route. They focus on new games as well as movies and TV with Fox (later Paramount and Universal) as well as Sky TV in the UK with a groundbreaking deal where Fox and Sky release their most popular programs on CD.

Hudson and NEC continue with the PC engine in Japan and the USA but without the strength of the "big three" they don't come to the UK or Europe.
Click to expand...

Interesting, very interesting those plan of Nintendo and 3DO, Sega can do that but will focus more in FMV and Arcade port, isn't it?.

About the 'hybrid' games, i'm pretty warry, yes is possible more if the console can interact, but pretty expensive(well not so much, only 5 dollar more for the CD) make the game depend both thing when either can released or cartidge or only CD, but that is Nintendo being nintendo and maybe they will focus more on CD(Like Donkey Kong Country Being Cd exclusive)

So Sega method is similar to unlokcable, maybe here Sonic3&Knucles will be CD/Cartidge Game?

So 3DO uses sony stategy of Multimedia and collaboration with media entrepise, nice move, can help alongside the adult market.

SO NEC will goes as OTL, that is normal, maybe joining 3DO or Nintendo later?.

So any idea for game or suggestion for the TL? you can ask it.
 

Bureaucromancer

I can certainly imagine it as a gimmick, but a successful card/CD combo thing really stretches credibility in my view. Honestly the Nintendo Playstation thing really does interest me, without gaining a new CPU or controller the potential of the thing really is quite limited. Without OTL's Playstation or N64 in the wings 3DO probably is going to look a lot more attractive, as will the Saturn (assuming the changes to SegaCD and 32x don't butterfly it, and I doubt they will).

Really my thoughts right now are that this sounds good, but might actually end up hurting everyone. The Nintendo system, while it might lay the groundwork for something in future seems like a combination of all the worst features of the SNES and Playstation as well as Sony and Nintendo management without any of the things that made and of the N64, SNES or Playstation stand out. As for Sega, the marketability of the expansions has certainly been improved, but at the same time the tech of the era really does demand a new system. TBH I think everyone needs to bear in mind what CDs were actually like on existing hardware in this era; my own memories of the Sega CD are mostly of truly endless load times, a lot of (low quality) FMV and not much in the way of gamplay; 32x helps, but its still and old system running old tech on a slow drive. Ultimately even the cart/CD combos will only do so much without faster drive, more memory and better processors.
 

Nivek

Bureaucromancer said:
I can certainly imagine it as a gimmick, but a successful card/CD combo thing really stretches credibility in my view. Honestly the Nintendo Playstation thing really does interest me, without gaining a new CPU or controller the potential of the thing really is quite limited. Without OTL's Playstation or N64 in the wings 3DO probably is going to look a lot more attractive, as will the Saturn (assuming the changes to SegaCD and 32x don't butterfly it, and I doubt they will).

Really my thoughts right now are that this sounds good, but might actually end up hurting everyone. The Nintendo system, while it might lay the groundwork for something in future seems like a combination of all the worst features of the SNES and Playstation as well as Sony and Nintendo management without any of the things that made and of the N64, SNES or Playstation stand out. As for Sega, the marketability of the expansions has certainly been improved, but at the same time the tech of the era really does demand a new system. TBH I think everyone needs to bear in mind what CDs were actually like on existing hardware in this era; my own memories of the Sega CD are mostly of truly endless load times, a lot of (low quality) FMV and not much in the way of gamplay; 32x helps, but its still and old system running old tech on a slow drive. Ultimately even the cart/CD combos will only do so much without faster drive, more memory and better processors.
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We've to give Nezza doubt benefit, the Timeline have only started and we don't know how thing will unfold, and IIRC the SNES-CD/Playstation was Intednded to have a second processor attached to the cartidge port for using both CD and their game, much like OTL Mega-CD have his own Motorola 68K for that process(PC-engine did not because was intended for CD since begin and processor was good enough, but have cards who add more RAM to the sysytem) and as mention, we don't know what Nezza is planning

And what you say this good...in hindsight, we're still in the nineties and CD start to become a boom in music, soon in movies and videogames, plus True 3D is still to come and advance 2D/Proto 3D games will be more that enough for a lot of people.

And don't comply about load time, every shooter have that, GTA take two minutes to start and a long etc.
 

nezza

I think its worth pointing out here that during the early 1990's the video game market in the UK (apologies for elsewhere, my knowledge of video game history outside the UK is non-existent) was awash with new ideas. The likes of 3DO and to a lesser extent Philips with their CD-I format were pushing CD based games as the future.

Now as we all know in the OTL it didn't work out quite like that although the disc based versions of games has grown with the like of Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo now using that as the main way of game playing.

In my ATL Nintendo and Sega have more stringent competition and realise they have to branch out to survive.
 

Nivek

nezza said:
I think its worth pointing out here that during the early 1990's the video game market in the UK (apologies for elsewhere, my knowledge of video game history outside the UK is non-existent) was awash with new ideas. The likes of 3DO and to a lesser extent Philips with their CD-I format were pushing CD based games as the future.

Now as we all know in the OTL it didn't work out quite like that although the disc based versions of games has grown with the like of Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo now using that as the main way of game playing.

In my ATL Nintendo and Sega have more stringent competition and realise they have to branch out to survive.
Click to expand...

Yes and that was the same in the US(in that regard US and UK are mirrors in that regard, much of the trend and tendencies were similar and the same games and genre are played, only change is the football,XD) and much like that, the early fourth generation was one of the CD-boom and the multimedia craze, that not one know to manage, here butterflies can help 3DO and Nintendo and Sony will have plans and Sega Too.

Maybe the POD would be Nintendo and Sony work more honestly and openly, thus the people knew about their plans and the companies act acordly? that would made sega delay the mega-cd to compete better with SNES-CD(who was intended be 32-bit and basic 3d, think like Starfox and early racing games like Crash n Burn) and that will make 3DO to compete better via price or multimedia(as inteded otl).
 

nezza

"Gamesmaster Magazine Special Issue December 1993

"...There can be no doubt that this year christmas market has resulted in forces amassing.

Nintendo and Sony's creation looks on paper at least the most mouth watering yet many insiders feel that the alliance is shaky because of both sides lack of understanding of each other. It seems to be a case of Nintendo saying to Sony "we'll do the games and you'll do the hardware and we'll see what happens.

Such a lack of cross-format co-operation could be a thorn in the side of the alliance. It could cost both sides dear...

Sega seems to be focused purely on games. We have made no secret of the facts that we believe the 32x and Sega-CD as add ons to be ill thought out and poorly marketed

The Neptune has come along in the nick of time. The newly redesigned console looks a damn sight better than the Frankenstein monster of before.

Perhaps with a closer integration of hardware the New Neptune games may be able to utilise the full power of both cartridge and CD...

The dark horse is 3DO. Trip Hawkins is taking one hell of a risk by starting a new machine from scratch. Teaming up with Panasonic and Fox is a great start but there are a huge bunch of egos there.

Yet it's saving grace could be the VCD option. The ability to play games, movies and music on one system could be the game changer.

Let battle commence
 

Nivek

nezza said:
"Gamesmaster Magazine Special Issue December 1993

"...There can be no doubt that this year christmas market has resulted in forces amassing.

Nintendo and Sony's creation looks on paper at least the most mouth watering yet many insiders feel that the alliance is shaky because of both sides lack of understanding of each other. It seems to be a case of Nintendo saying to Sony "we'll do the games and you'll do the hardware and we'll see what happens.

Such a lack of cross-format co-operation could be a thorn in the side of the alliance. It could cost both sides dear...

Sega seems to be focused purely on games. We have made no secret of the facts that we believe the 32x and Sega-CD as add ons to be ill thought out and poorly marketed

The Neptune has come along in the nick of time. The newly redesigned console looks a damn sight better than the Frankenstein monster of before.

Perhaps with a closer integration of hardware the New Neptune games may be able to utilise the full power of both cartridge and CD...

The dark horse is 3DO. Trip Hawkins is taking one hell of a risk by starting a new machine from scratch. Teaming up with Panasonic and Fox is a great start but there are a huge bunch of egos there.

Yet it's saving grace could be the VCD option. The ability to play games, movies and music on one system could be the game changer.

Let battle commence
Click to expand...

Let's analyze by parts:

How Nintendo and Sony will unfold depend, Nintendo know how to make software with the hardware strenght and weakness, Mario is coming, Zelda wiill come, Mario Kart will Come, Donkey Kong Country can be dual cartidge-CD, Killer Instict Either Dual or CD only, but an advantage will be third party support, Capcom will come with Street Figther and Megaman, Konami With Castlevania and PC engine ports, Square will Come with RPG, Enix Will come with RPG, Atlus ditto, heck they have good support in japan.

For me if Nintendo Side become powerful sony will simple give tech to nintendo, if Sony become powerful, will try to adquire Nintendo to obtain their IP and Software teams.

That is 1993, the Sega 32X is 1994 OTL, thus Sega will save itself of the shame of the 32x unless they want to released anyway, Sega is like that. But with enough raw power, the will port more arcades games and their early 3d game as Virtua Figther and Racing, and they've a lot of American and Western support.

The 3DO is the new player, and with better deal with Panasonic and pushing VCD as their Killer Function can help them, maybe for good, like microsoft with the OG Xbox

Some more new things? game or release things?
 

nezza

The initial packages are as follows

SNES Mk2

2 controllers, Super Mario IV (Cartridge/CD Hybrid) and Streetfighter 3 £249.99

Neptune

2 Controllers, Sonic Adventure (CD only) and Mortal Kombat Quest (Cartridge) £199.99

3DO

2 Controllers, Road Rash, John Madden 94 and Comptons Interactive Encyclopedia £249.99
 

Nivek

nezza said:
The initial packages are as follows

SNES Mk2

2 controllers, Super Mario IV (Cartridge/CD Hybrid) and Streetfighter 3 £249.99

Neptune

2 Controllers, Sonic Adventure (CD only) and Mortal Kombat Quest (Cartridge) £199.99

3DO

2 Controllers, Road Rash, John Madden 94 and Comptons Interactive Encyclopedia £249.99
Click to expand...

You can give us price in Dollars for us the people in the other side of the pond?(that would help, mostly because Pound Dollar conversion is tricky sometimes).

Street Figther 3 that early? you should have confuse with Steet Figther II Turbo, who came OTL 3DO and is possible in the Mark2/Proto PS.

Nice so far, maybe more thing of the TL? the TL have potential you should add more when you can(when is the next update?)
 

nezza

Nivek said:
You can give us price in Dollars for us the people in the other side of the pond?(that would help, mostly because Pound Dollar conversion is tricky sometimes).

Street Figther 3 that early? you should have confuse with Steet Figther II Turbo, who came OTL 3DO and is possible in the Mark2/Proto PS.

Nice so far, maybe more thing of the TL? the TL have potential you should add more when you can(when is the next update?)
Click to expand...

Right now :):)

NB
£250-$403
£200-$322


In a huge marketing blitz. Nintendo and Sony rename the SNES Mark II to the Nintendo Playstation. This is to avoid confusion with the mark 1 (SNES/Super Famicom)
 

Nivek

nezza said:
Right now :):)

NB
£250-$403
£200-$322


In a huge marketing blitz. Nintendo and Sony rename the SNES Mark II to the Nintendo Playstation. This is to avoid confusion with the mark 1 (SNES/Super Famicom)
Click to expand...

That is pretty price(yes the tech and game worth it, and there two pack-in games per system) but the 3DO is more price competitive now(and can make it for the lack of First Party games unlike Nintendo or Sega) and would be a Darkhorse for the holiday season.

Yes, maybe in japan there would be less confusion, but in the west, so we could expect Square RPG being more prominent in both side of the Pond? Sega would have better chance in europe but again being second best to Nintendo worldwide.
 

nezza

The capacity for more intense RPG games is certainly there. With all three systems having backup capabilities (Battery backup for Playstation and Neptune and a 500 MB HDD for 3DO) the likes of Zelda, Final Fantasy etc will be major games.
 

Nivek

nezza said:
The capacity for more intense RPG games is certainly there. With all three systems having backup capabilities (Battery backup for Playstation and Neptune and a 500 MB HDD for 3DO) the likes of Zelda, Final Fantasy etc will be major games.
Click to expand...

Umm Interesting, how is that Battery Backup? Internal? so there will not be memory cards?(OTL sony used it because they have patent for flash and make good money with it, those were predecessor of MemoryStick/Flash and SD memories) or like OTL Saturn, a Memory Backup Cartidge?(who was a flash cartidge)

Interesting the Hardrrive of the 3DO, so will be able to save pc data?(and 500MB is much, 100MB is more reasonable via price).

So other details before update or will update soon?
 

nezza

The battery backups are in the cartridges themselves so no memory cards are needed

With the 3DO 500 mb are needed because of the complexity of the games.

NB. Updates are few because I work most of the week and haven't got much time to update the thread :)
 

Nivek

nezza said:
The battery backups are in the cartridges themselves so no memory cards are needed

With the 3DO 500 mb are needed because of the complexity of the games.

NB. Updates are few because I work most of the week and haven't got much time to update the thread :)
Click to expand...

So used it like Saturn(with a memory cartidge?) well that is good enough.

Well yes and when more PC esque games come more space will be need it

Well, but you keep they bye bye harold, don't ignore us,XD-
 

nezza

I won't. In fact I'm getting more feedback on this thread than with the other one.

On we go.

3DO's advertising campaign makes it clear that they are aiming at both games and movies. A tv ad showing two "worlds" one showing game clips the other movie clips merge into a single "0" and the letters "3D appearing before it making "3D0"

The tagline is:

The best of all worlds.
 

Nivek

nezza said:
I won't. In fact I'm getting more feedback on this thread than with the other one.

On we go.

3DO's advertising campaign makes it clear that they are aiming at both games and movies. A tv ad showing two "worlds" one showing game clips the other movie clips merge into a single "0" and the letters "3D appearing before it making "3D0"

The tagline is:

The best of all worlds.
Click to expand...

jejeje nice, mostly because more people know of the topic(or know better, british politic is pretty complicated)

Nice 3DO commercial, rather bashing competition(like sega and other OTL), focusing in the multimedia and the VCD playback would make it attractive to people who want or can afford the console, very nice made there.

How will be Sega and Nintendo ones? nintendo will have to take change the name change and other

Keep going the TL is pretty Interesting.
 
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