AHC: Hindu-Roman syncretism
- Thread starter Zuvarq
- Start date
Would this be a problem? After all didn't early Romans consider the Greeks enfminate
Not really considering the Hellenization of the Romans. The interactions between the two would probably be the same.
Roman-Buddhists always sound interesting though I would perhaps give it a Syro-Roman twist via say, the cult of Elagabalus (the Syro-Roman god) by Emperor Marcus Aurelius Antoninus Augustus (aka Elagabalus / Heliogabalus).
Given the amount of Roman finds in Southern India and Sri Lanka, it very likely happened IOTL. From the Roman POV, it would not pose the slightest problem. I do not know how like modern Hindu theology the beliefs at the time were, but it is porobably unwise to project too much backwards in time. My assumption is that the Indians will look at the Romans as sort of weird, but impressive foreigners who honour strange Gods, and the Romans are liable to bring their own cultic practices, but also integrate the local ones. In Latin, the Hindu Gods would, of course, be identified with Roman ones. I don't think that would be a problem for anyone.
MERC(uri) AUG(usti) GANESSAE
OB NAVIG(atione) M(aris) IND(ici)
T(itus) AUR(elius) ISIDOR(us) KAPPA
V(otum) L(ibens) S(oluit)
MERC(uri) AUG(usti) GANESSAE
OB NAVIG(atione) M(aris) IND(ici)
T(itus) AUR(elius) ISIDOR(us) KAPPA
V(otum) L(ibens) S(oluit)
Yonatan
Banned
Given the amount of Roman finds in Southern India and Sri Lanka, it very likely happened IOTL. From the Roman POV, it would not pose the slightest problem. I do not know how like modern Hindu theology the beliefs at the time were, but it is porobably unwise to project too much backwards in time. My assumption is that the Indians will look at the Romans as sort of weird, but impressive foreigners who honour strange Gods, and the Romans are liable to bring their own cultic practices, but also integrate the local ones. In Latin, the Hindu Gods would, of course, be identified with Roman ones. I don't think that would be a problem for anyone.
MERC(uri) AUG(usti) GANESSAE
OB NAVIG(atione) M(aris) IND(ici)
T(itus) AUR(elius) ISIDOR(us) KAPPA
V(otum) L(ibens) S(oluit)
...
That DID happen. whenever Roman merchants would go to India, they would sign contracts in 2 languages, and under some god or gods. the name of the god would be written as the Roman version in Latin, and the corresponding god in the Hindu pantheon in the local language.
In fact, there was so much trade between the 2 that Roman silver coins were so common in the Indian economy some Indian rulers simply melted some of it into statues and decorations.
Syncretism among merchants aside, you'd probably need Roman to actually rule Indians or vice versa for syncretism on a meaningful scale.
Can't see a scenario in which the actual Roman Empire reaches India, but maybe if we posit that a)Christianity never rises, with something loosely similar to Roman polytheism remaining dominant in Western Europe; and b) that Western Europe is at some point faced with the same economic factors that historically drove mercantilism and colonialism. Granted I'm being very liberal in ignoring the butterfly effect here, but assume that the "Euro-Roman" culture proceeds to conquer much of India as the Christians did in our history. Then you'll probably see a mutual understanding among Hindus and the "Euro-Roman" culture that their gods are synonymous, and from there memetic cross-pollination* is easy.
*Yeah, I know. I felt like a pretentious cunt writing that, and probably look that way to y'all
Can't see a scenario in which the actual Roman Empire reaches India, but maybe if we posit that a)Christianity never rises, with something loosely similar to Roman polytheism remaining dominant in Western Europe; and b) that Western Europe is at some point faced with the same economic factors that historically drove mercantilism and colonialism. Granted I'm being very liberal in ignoring the butterfly effect here, but assume that the "Euro-Roman" culture proceeds to conquer much of India as the Christians did in our history. Then you'll probably see a mutual understanding among Hindus and the "Euro-Roman" culture that their gods are synonymous, and from there memetic cross-pollination* is easy.
*Yeah, I know. I felt like a pretentious cunt writing that, and probably look that way to y'all
Or maybe just Hindus?
Which of course presents its own problems, but at least allows for meeting half way (geographically that is), instead of the Romans having to go all the way to India.So far as I'm aware the only historical Hindu populations outside of India were in South East Asia, which is even harder for Romans to get to.Or maybe just Hindus?
Outside the box idea: the Romani(gypsies) are supposedly from India. Maybe if they or a group like them traveled into Europe, and retained their old Hindu religious tendencies on account of intolerant Abrahamic faiths not controlling the region, then we could such syncretism amongst them?
I meant an ahistorical population. Perhaps it would it be possible for Hindu traders to create at least a large minority of Hindus in cities around the Red Sea, the Persian Gulf and their neighboring rivers, similar to how Islam spread across the Indian Ocean? There is after all quite a lot of time to work with, unless we work from the assumption that the Roman Republics successes are very likely to be nipped in the bud by such a development.
It should be no problem if the vedic pantheon in India remains dominent. THis is because The vedic peoples ae of the same descent as greeks and romans. They are both part of PIE which later split into Proto indo iranian and the Indo Europeans, and later on into Indo aryans and Indo iranians and the hellenes and germanic tribes etc.
But the orignally vedas the dieties worshipped are virtually identical with zeus and the orignal greek gods. Dyaus Pita(Skyfather) Indra(Mars and Zeus combination) Rudra(Dionysus or apollo) the whole story about chronos-dyaus relation with Indra playing zeuses role and the devas playing the similiar role against sealing the beings similiar to titans. Etc. So syncrenim would be no problem given the stories, creation myths, etc about the deities are identical or exactly the same to thier greek counterparts. Therefore a syncrenism could easily happen if the vedic india survived. Bcause the Vedic indians had practices and rreligious texts very alike to the hellenic religion.
However the indo aryans are slightly older than the hellenes being formed sometime around 2100-1900 b.c.e when they split from the Proto indo iranians while the helleens are dated to 1900-1200 b.c.e.
But the orignally vedas the dieties worshipped are virtually identical with zeus and the orignal greek gods. Dyaus Pita(Skyfather) Indra(Mars and Zeus combination) Rudra(Dionysus or apollo) the whole story about chronos-dyaus relation with Indra playing zeuses role and the devas playing the similiar role against sealing the beings similiar to titans. Etc. So syncrenim would be no problem given the stories, creation myths, etc about the deities are identical or exactly the same to thier greek counterparts. Therefore a syncrenism could easily happen if the vedic india survived. Bcause the Vedic indians had practices and rreligious texts very alike to the hellenic religion.
However the indo aryans are slightly older than the hellenes being formed sometime around 2100-1900 b.c.e when they split from the Proto indo iranians while the helleens are dated to 1900-1200 b.c.e.
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Many of the Vedic gods were similar to the gods of Greek and Roman pantheons. Indra, the king of gods who is also the god of sky, rains, thunder and lightning is similar to Zeus and Jupiter. Varuna, the god of oceans is similar to Poseidon or Neptune, though the word Varuna resembles Uranas. Surya, the Sun-god corresponds to Appolo. Saraswati, the goddess of knowledge, letters, arts and music is like Athena. Kama, the god of love is similar to Cupid. Kama has Rati, the goddess of sex as his wife. Kama has sugrcane as his bow and flowers as his arrows. Yama is the god of death and Yamaloka, his world is similar to the Hades. I think Agni, the god of fire, Vayu, the god of winds, Kubera, the god of riches and many other Vedic deities have corresponding figures in the Greek and Roman pantheons.
Like I said this is because both are of the same descent and share similiar religion and culture. Even the germanic tribes were similiar with their pantheon to the tomans. All the germanic, hellenic, and Iranian and Vedic cultures are similiar and very alike.
However I believe dyaus pita would fit more of chronos role though his name is similiar to zeus. Oh 100 b.c.e.. well by that point unlikely given that the puranas were becoming popular and the vedic influence had receded greatly by this point. Around this time would be best to start the POD sometime around 600-500 b.c.e with some way for the puranas to be butterflied and the vedas remain dominent.