ACH: Largest Possible Mexico

This is just an idea that has been going though my head for a few days.

The title is self explanatory; I'm just curious on how big could Mexico could have potentially gotten, with any POD between the 17th century and 1820.

This alternate Mexico would become a "continent sprawling super power" much like OTL United States. It can contain any combination, or all of, the territory's mentioned bellow.

  • -Alaska (with a POD involving the Spanish expedition to the region during the mid 18th century)
  • -Oregon Territory
  • -Spanish Louisiana
  • -Spanish Caribbean colonies (Cuba for example)
  • -Hawaii (long after Mexico's rise as a superpower i'd imagine)

I think this is a really interesting idea with allot of potential, although I probably won't write anything about this soon since I'm kinda busy.

Anyway, I would love to hear your guys ideas. I have some ideas to, but more on that latter. ;)
 

Nietzsche

Banned
Holding onto Cali, getting Louisiana and the Spanish Caribbean are the furthest Mexico could probably get in North America. Going east of the Mississippi won't end well, because then you start running into rather heavily populated areas that are very much not Spanish.
 
This is just an idea that has been going though my head for a few days.

The title is self explanatory; I'm just curious on how big could Mexico could have potentially gotten, with any POD between the 17th century and 1820.

This alternate Mexico would become a "continent sprawling super power" much like OTL United States. It can contain any combination, or all of, the territory's mentioned bellow.

  • -Alaska (with a POD involving the Spanish expedition to the region during the mid 18th century)
  • -Oregon Territory
  • -Spanish Louisiana
  • -Spanish Caribbean colonies (Cuba for example)
  • -Hawaii (long after Mexico's rise as a superpower i'd imagine)

I think this is a really interesting idea with allot of potential, although I probably won't write anything about this soon since I'm kinda busy.

Anyway, I would love to hear your guys ideas. I have some ideas to, but more on that latter. ;)
Alaska - Not gonna happen, well if mexico goes on a string of success and prosperity like the US then sure, but why would mexico want alaska?
Oregon Territoy - This one is a must but impossible unless the spanish colonize american california before mexican independence. Then they can likely take and colonize it before america even gets Louisiana.
Spanish Louisianna - Harder with America so close, tho if Mexico acheives independents around the same time as the US (with as mentioned earlier much more spaniards in new mexico and california) then i could see mexico having better logistical cappabilities then the US at the time.
Spanish Carribean Colonies - Easy, just have mexico do better in the war for independents (which as i said earlier needs to happen much earlier.)
Hawai'i - Probably the easiest, even in say the 1860s if Mexico sends expiditions their they probably end up owning it.
 
So...does that mean the 'reconquest' of Las Filipinas is plausible?
by the 20th century, assuming the mexicans beat back the americans and can curb their expansion, then all those pascific ports the us used to capture it become mexican, so ja.

at the same time, i think what happens to Amerika would be interesting in this TL, considering unlike mexico it is surrounded by wealthy nations (canada and mexico is at least a superpower so they got money.
 
Maybe discover gold in California much pretty much immediately after independence? I can really happen at any random time, that gives an impetus to get people north and immigration that can be assimilated easier than Americans in Texas.
 
Maybe discover gold in California much pretty much immediately after independence? I can really happen at any random time, that gives an impetus to get people north and immigration that can be assimilated easier than Americans in Texas.
what about before independents? this gets people from all over the spanish empire coming their for gold, then a few years when they revolt the people who've made a fortune and settled down are told to give up their money and leave, or become a citizen.
 
It's really not much territories compared to the north, but surely, Mexico could have kept or took territories SOUTH, in Mesoamerica. Not if to modern Panama, but...
 
It's really not much territories compared to the north, but surely, Mexico could have kept or took territories SOUTH, in Mesoamerica. Not if to modern Panama, but...
easily, especially a superpowered mexico. But would it want them, with the northern territories don't they already have enough on their hands?
 
yeah i know theres short term wealth there, but in the long run the north is much more richer, and benefits them more economically and population wise.

The north is easier to hold onto then Central America because of its small population. Provided the United States doesn't encroach too quickly, it wouldn't need to worry about Alta California and Nuevo Mexico provinces, just Texas and Central America. More wealth taken from the south in the short term means you can take that money and invest in the north long-term.
 
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yeah i know theres short term wealth there, but in the long run the north is much more richer, and benefits them more economically and population wise.

Plantations are not quick gains.. you have to keep them working and producing.

Honestly, I think it may be actually BETTER than parts of the nowaday american southwest - it was deserts, badlands, etc... there is reasons why Mexico didn 't actually fight that much.

As the guy up me said.
 
Plantations are not quick gains.. you have to keep them working and producing.

Honestly, I think it may be actually BETTER than parts of the nowaday american southwest - it was deserts, badlands, etc... there is reasons why Mexico didn 't actually fight that much.

As the guy up me said.

Girl, but apparently we're not on the internet ;)

It could be interesting if an alt-Mexico sold the aforementioned provinces to the United States and used that money to fund consolidation over its southern territories before they broke free. The pay off would be extensive by 1900.
 
Girl, but apparently we're not on the internet ;)

It could be interesting if an alt-Mexico sold the aforementioned provinces to the United States and used that money to fund consolidation over its southern territories before they broke free. The pay off would be extensive by 1900.

Apparently, the southwest of America took time to take off economically, it remained poor for a good while... It took the Gold Rush and the 'selling of dreams' for California, and the invention of climatisation helped apparently the cities like Phoenix.. so...
 
Apparently, the southwest of America took time to take off economically, it remained poor for a good while... It took the Gold Rush and the 'selling of dreams' for California, and the invention of climatisation helped apparently the cities like Phoenix.. so...

The slave states would definitely want to expand at the expense of Mexico, so if Mexico sells those provinces to the United States, any Mexican government could conceivably play it off as a necessary evil to lose Mexican territory to make other Mexican provinces more profitable for the whole nation.
 
The largest possible Mexico I can see is one containing all of Central America, the Southwest, the Oregon Country and perhaps most of the Louisiana Territory though it would require a very early POD and maybe balkanizing the United States into several weaker, independent countries. It's not easy but it's not impossible for Mexico to become a large and powerful nation.
 
The slave states would definitely want to expand at the expense of Mexico, so if Mexico sells those provinces to the United States, any Mexican government could conceivably play it off as a necessary evil to lose Mexican territory to make other Mexican provinces more profitable for the whole nation.

It's probable that to keep much of it would be undefendable, stretching too much forces and all.
 
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