so thought, what if during the Revolution the comte de Provence (Louis XVIII) and his wife had been stopped from leaving France like the Royal Family was on the same day, now if that was the case they'd likely both have been put to death, now also in our TL during the Reign of Terror, Louis Philippe II, Duke of Orléans, a supporter of the Republic, was guillotined, and his sons (the future King Louis Philippe I, Antoine Philippe, Duke of Montpensier, and Louis Charles, Count of Beaujolais) were jailed, so what if on top of death of the comte de Provence the Orléans family was killed during the Terror as well, so at the end of the French Wars (say they go more or less OTL) in 1815 the last man standing to take a restored crown is the Comte d'Artois, Charles X, the most hard line member of the Bourbon family known for his ultra-royalist point of view who in OTL only lasted 7 years before being over thrown, would foreigners like the British support him (in OTL some French begged Wellington to put a foreign Prince on the throne, he supported the reasonable Louis XVIII, would he, or whoever do so for Charles?) and with no Orléans around would who take the throne if not Charles (or if he's thrown off) and would Europe let the French throw him over?
Charles X restored Bourbon King of France in 1815
- Thread starter black angel
- Start date
There's always the Prince of Condé, although I'm not well versed on Prince Louis-Joseph. But if you mean if there's no other Bourbons available in France, then I could see Britain trying to get a foreign prince installed.
That was the Prince of Conti. Condé didn't die out until the 1830s IIRC.
yes you are right, though do we think that the Spanish Kings would pass up a shot at one of theirs on the throne? also from what I can tell the Louis Joseph was just as much of an ultra-royalist as Charles X, so I don't see ether the European Powers or the French People overthrowing or rejecting the Comte d'Artois in favor of a Louis XVIII (or would it be XIX?) with the same outlook (who's 79 at the time with a 60 year old son and no living grandson) now I'm not really looking to keep Charles X off the throne per-say, his record is poor of course, but maybe the Europeans would keep him on the throne by force
What about a "Jacobite" King of France? I'll have to look up who the Jacobite claimant to the Scots and English throne was at the time (I believe Henry Cardinal Stuart was deceased by 1814).
the Jacobite heir in 1815 was Charles Emmanuel IV, King of Sardinia, and of course a Jacobite King is about as likely as me growing wings and flying out the window
I'm a bit rusty on the attitudes of the powers at the Congress of Vienna. From what I remember, several powers were rather irritated with the Bourbons and blamed them for the Napoleonic Wars. Murat had some supporters who were content to leave him as King of Naples, but I know Britain demanded that the Sicilian Bourbons be restored, who were just as ultra-royalist in temperament.
[resists urge to make snide wise crack about BA growing wings]
Yes of course, but it was an intriguing idea none-the-less.I don't doubt that the major players would be more than happy with a Charles X, but would they stay happy, how longer or for how many times with the UK, Prussia, Austria and Russia be willing to step in to put down an anti-Charles uprising, pretty much from day one in OTL Charles worked to turn back the clock, it was hardly 2 years in before the national guard was against him, he lasted just over 5 years, I see no reason he'd do better or get more popular love in TTL in 1815 than he did in OTL (likely less as his brother had broken in the idea of Bourbon Monarchy in OTL) now I don't see the allied powers allowing a popular French uprising to over throw a Monarchy in the first 5 years, and maybe not the first ten ether
Charles X had two sons, the Duc d'Angouleme and the Duc de Berry. Angouleme was a moderate who was married to Marie Therese Charlotte, the only survivin gchild of Louis XVI and Marie Antoinette. If the Great powers don't put the Comte d'Artois on the Throne then they would put d'Angouleme. Plus there's always de Berri, in OTL he was an ultra-royalist so idk if hes better that his father.
Did anybody look at this title and shout ASB?
Really, a literal ASB from Star Trek TOS restores the French monarchy?
REALLY???
Really, a literal ASB from Star Trek TOS restores the French monarchy?
REALLY???
I actually forgot it was the heir of Condé who Napoleon had executed, even I have a hard time keeping track of the Condé and Conti.
Being how legitimist they are, Condé would be Louis XIX, although I can see Charles X's older son being installed if Artois proves to be too much of a burden (and he probably will). The only issue with Angoulême is that he and his wife didn't really get along, and only married because Louis XVIII had convinced her that it was her parents' dying wish that she marry Angoulême, his father was very much against the marriage. Without Louis XVIII to coerce the marriage, maybe Angoulême can have a better marriage that produces children.
I actually forgot it was the heir of Condé who Napoleon had executed, even I have a hard time keeping track of the Condé and Conti.
The only issue with Angoulême is that he and his wife didn't really get along, and only married because Louis XVIII had convinced her that it was her parents' dying wish that she marry Angoulême, his father was very much against the marriage. Without Louis XVIII to coerce the marriage, maybe Angoulême can have a better marriage that produces children.
The problem with that is we don't know whos fault it was that the marriage had know children. In OTL Emperor Francis tried to get Marie Therese to marry his brother ( can't remember which one) so if it was Angouleme we could see a French house of Habsburg on the throne.
I think it was mostly Marie Therese, unhappy home life is putting it likely, though I think basically the whole Bourbon family and royalist camp would be pushing her to marry the Duke of Angoulême, even more so when he's the Dauphin, the last living member of the last King's family marrying into the new royal family, the Grand-son of Louis XVI one day being king, idk if Marie Therese could not marry him
Well Marie Therese was pregnant in either 1810 or 1811, sadly it ended in a miscarriage so we don't know who had the fertility problems. It could be either or both.
Marie-Therese was in the custody of her Habsburg relatives for 3 years so she could have decided to marry her cousin (I looked it up and it was Archduke Charles of Austria, Duke of Teschen that Emperor Francis tried to get her to marry).
the younger duc de Berri would inherit first though me thinks.
Random thought but is there any way to keep Murat as King of Naples? Say Ferdinand IV does something incredibly stupid that manages to piss the British off enough that they decide to not push the issue and acquiesce to Murat staying in Naples and Ferdinand being left as King of Sicily since they wouldn't be joined together as the Kingdom of the Two Sicilies until a short while later, or perhaps another power or powers decide to be a touch more forceful at the Congress and manage to squeeze it out of the British as a concession to go along with things and as anti-Bourbon sentiment.
Murat tried conquering Italy during the 100 days in support of Napoleon. Remove that (my TL does it by removing the 100 days, others could do it by Murat realizing that action was premature), and I think Murat's survival is likely. Certainly not guaranteed, of course, but I doubt the other Powers would support Austria in reconquering Naples. Stand aside, yes. Actively support, no.
Murat was pretty well ensconced in Naples at the time, and if the Austrians DID try to expel him they might well fail. It would certainly be very expensive.
But by supporting the 100 Days, he guaranteed that he'd be ousted.
It was my understanding that Ferdinand and his wife were not happy allies with the British. I think it would be very possible for Britain not to press their claims in the right moment.