Nazi Victory Views of "Slavs"

[Clandango]

Now, given the usual stereotypes about Nazis killing off everyone speaking a Slavic language in Europe, should I take it that they are all screwed? I have read many things that suggest otherwise, with Croats being looked on extremely positvely as with the Bulgarians, both of whom Hitler thought were only Slavic in language. How do you believe the Slovaks, Mongtenegrins, Czechs, Serbs, Croats, and Bulgarians would make out in a Europe dominated by the Nazis, whether or not there is some Cold War with the Japanese, Americans, British, or South Africans?

[Maponus]

Hitler believed the Czechs were ideally suited as subjects of a German Empire, and even believed that after a few generations they would come to identify with their new Nazi masters as they supposedly had with the Habsburgs.

Hitler publicly lauded the the contributions of Slovenes and Slovaks in Operation Barbarossa, too, so exterminating them would be a tad awkward but not beyond the realm of possibility for a crazy totalitarian state.

In short, Sorbs, Bulgarians and Croats are safe since they are supposedly Germans with the wrong language. The Czechs won't be given the Russo-Polish treatment, but will be excessively regulated and forced to put up with continual demographic interference from the Nazis who will be engineering a future in which they will be a minority in their own homeland.

Slovenes and Slovaks will be in an awkward position. Depends on how much this Germany has been uber-wanked, because in any normal situation, even a Nazi victory one, committing genocide against your own puppet states is going to be a very bad public relations move. Slovenes will be in more danger from Italy to be honest.

Montenegrins and Serbs are fucking doomed. Not necessarily because of the Nazis, but because they are caught between the Croats and the Bulgarians and a whole bunch of other Nazi collaborators from the former Yugoslavia, who will be happy to tear Serbia to tiny pieces between them.

[MerryPrankster]

Useful Slavs will probably have some Germanic element conveniently found in them--I think Himmler claims the Bosnian Muslims were descendants of the "True Goths" or some idiocy like that.

Other Slavs...

[Shaby]

As for South Slavs, the Nazis adopted 'Divide et impera!' policy in regards to the local population. They purposefully pitted each group against the other and happily observed the ensuing slaughter, aiding it were needed.

[Clandango]

Originally Posted by MerryPrankster

Useful Slavs will probably have some Germanic element conveniently found in them--I think Himmler claims the Bosnian Muslims were descendants of the "True Goths" or some idiocy like that.

Other Slavs...

Hitler was on record agreeing with the Croats in saying that they were Goths.

[sharlin]

What would the Germans do?

Organisation Todt welcomes our Slavic 'workers and volunteers' step this way to be worked to death in massive public works. And by step this way we mean move or we will kill you where you stand and not even bat an eyelid when we do.

[Clandango]

Originally Posted by Maponus

Hitler believed the Czechs were ideally suited as subjects of a German Empire, and even believed that after a few generations they would come to identify with their new Nazi masters as they supposedly had with the Habsburgs.

He did say that they used to be ashamed to speak Czech and were mostly Germanizable, though their honesty and industriousness was a threat.

Hitler publicly lauded the the contributions of Slovenes and Slovaks in Operation Barbarossa, too, so exterminating them would be a tad awkward but not beyond the realm of possibility for a crazy totalitarian state.

They had expelled a fair many Slovenes from areas annexed even though they later went after the Friulians and others in northeast Italy and claimed to the world that they were Germans, while telling the Friulians that they were Friulians. Always seemed a bit strange to me that the Nazis didn't try to Germanize them instead of chucking them out.

In short, Sorbs, Bulgarians and Croats are safe since they are supposedly Germans with the wrong language. The Czechs won't be given the Russo-Polish treatment, but will be excessively regulated and forced to put up with continual demographic interference from the Nazis who will be engineering a future in which they will be a minority in their own homeland.

Agreed. I believe that Hitler suggested to the Tsar that he switch his alphabet from Cyrillic to Latin. Then again he also thought that they would someday call the lettering Germanic.

Slovenes and Slovaks will be in an awkward position. Depends on how much this Germany has been uber-wanked, because in any normal situation, even a Nazi victory one, committing genocide against your own puppet states is going to be a very bad public relations move. Slovenes will be in more danger from Italy to be honest.

Montenegrins and Serbs are fucking doomed. Not necessarily because of the Nazis, but because they are caught between the Croats and the Bulgarians and a whole bunch of other Nazi collaborators from the former Yugoslavia, who will be happy to tear Serbia to tiny pieces between them.

Hitler seemed to have thought that the unification of the South Slavs was much like that of Italy or the Germanies. Never exactly tried to ally with it though. Montenegro... I do not know how the Germans viewed them, though I think that Mussolini wanted it annexed to Albania. Serbia as a whole being partitioned may have been too much for the Nazis, as Hitler spoke very poorly about the majority of Hungarians and Romanians. That and he wanted control over the Danube. Maybe trade territory about using the Serb land as collateral?

[Clandango]

Originally Posted by sharlin

What would the Germans do?

Organisation Todt welcomes our Slavic 'workers and volunteers' step this way to be worked to death in massive public works. And by step this way we mean move or we will kill you where you stand and not even bat an eyelid when we do.

Please specify which groups.

[sharlin]

I really don't know, i'm going to guess any of them would be at risk as and when the Germans deem them to be untermensch.

[Clandango]

Originally Posted by sharlin

I really don't know, i'm going to guess any of them would be at risk as and when the Germans deem them to be untermensch.

They thought the same of southern Italians, Germans living in forests, Hungarians, Romanians, and the majority of the English population.

[kasumigenx]

Actually, the Poles do have a Vandalic Element.

[Clandango]

Originally Posted by kasumigenx

Actually, the Poles do have a Vandalic Element.

Was there any specific area where they decided they would have been?

[Karelian]

The Nazi racial policies were anything but fixed in their sheer bat-extrement insanity, and several ethnic groups changed their racial status during the war. Most known examples are Goralenvolk and Kashubians in Poland.

[kalamona]

Originally Posted by Karelian

The Nazi racial policies were anything but fixed in their sheer bat-extrement insanity, and several ethnic groups changed their racial status during the war. Most known examples are Goralenvolk and Kashubians in Poland.

Ukrainans? If i remember correctly, late stages they were considered as viking heritage.

[Clandango]

Originally Posted by kalamona

Ukrainans? If i remember correctly, late stages they were considered as viking heritage.

Beecause of the Kievan Rus, I believe. They also claimed that the Crimea used to by Gothic. I do wonder how they determined the Germanicness of each country, keeping in mind that they considered themselves Deutsch and a broader group as Germanic. Anyways, they also thought of getting racially suitable women from Ukraine to act as nannies so that their mothers could have more children. That and so the father could rape the nanny. In exchange they don't die.

[Uruk]

My guess is that the Nazi Government would setup a commison to "save" the "racially valuable" and get rid of the rest in some manner

[Dementor]

Bulgaria might be in a bit of a sticky situation after the war due to not deporting the Jews or helping on the Eastern Front. Then again, I don't really see the Bulgarians being treated like the Eastern Slavs, as they were allies after all. It's possible that the Bulgarian territorial acquisitions would be reconsidered.

Originally Posted by Shaby

As for South Slavs, the Nazis adopted 'Divide et impera!' policy in regards to the local population. They purposefully pitted each group against the other and happily observed the ensuing slaughter, aiding it were needed.

No, it was just a case of permitting Croatia and Bulgaria the parts of Serbia they wanted.

[Shaby]

Originally Posted by Dementor

Bulgaria might be in a bit of a sticky situation after the war due to not deporting the Jews or helping on the Eastern Front. Then again, I don't really see the Bulgarians being treated like the Eastern Slavs, as they were allies after all. It's possible that the Bulgarian territorial acquisitions would be reconsidered.

No, it was just a case of permitting Croatia and Bulgaria the parts of Serbia they wanted.

And at the same time created Nedic government in Serbia and allowed Italians to keep cosy relations with Chetniks, whom they also partly supported and armed in exchange for partisan prisoners. The only true enemy of Germans and the other were communist partisans.

[Saladan]

Curiously I've read about how either hitler or himmler while viewing the Estonians and Latvians as Baltic and thus germanic in whatever arbitrary way they did, they nonetheless also thought of Lithuanians as being slavic and tainted with "inferior" russian and polish blood and had plans to either deport or just exterminate or any other unpleasant fate.

[MSZ]

Originally Posted by Saladan

Curiously I've read about how either hitler or himmler while viewing the Estonians and Latvians as Baltic and thus germanic in whatever arbitrary way they did, they nonetheless also thought of Lithuanians as being slavic and tainted with "inferior" russian and polish blood and had plans to either deport or just exterminate or any other unpleasant fate.

Curious. I recall Lithuanians being specifically labeled as Balts (and Germanics) and never as Slavs. And they were concidered faithful allies and accomplices, not tools meantto be used and discarded. Then again, Nazis changed their minds about these things all the time.