Small OTL History Questions thread (Before 1900)

[Tocomocho]

Originally Posted by Shtudmuffin

Who was in charge of Spain after the 1869 Glorious Revolution there? And who was it immediately afterward that offered the kingship to Prince Leopold of the house of Hohenzollern?

1) De jure Francisco Serrano as regent (effectively powerless) and de facto Juan Prim as prime minister.

2) The Parliament, who voted him among a number of candidates, although he was Prim's candidate anyway, and Prim was the one that went to Prussia to meet him and made him a candidate in the first place - unless I'm remembering that wrong.

[Shtudmuffin]

Originally Posted by Tocomocho

1) De jure Francisco Serrano as regent (effectively powerless) and de facto Juan Prim as prime minister.

2) The Parliament, who voted him among a number of candidates, although he was Prim's candidate anyway, and Prim was the one that went to Prussia to meet him and made him a candidate in the first place - unless I'm remembering that wrong.

I don't think he was made a candidate; I think he denied candidacy.

Anyway, thank you, as this couldn't have answered my questions more perfectly.

[Shtudmuffin]

One more question-who was Napoleon III's heir? And if they had been able to become emperor of France after Louis' death, what might their rule have been like? Or would we not be able to know?

[Tizoc]

Originally Posted by Shtudmuffin

One more question-who was Napoleon III's heir? And if they had been able to become emperor of France after Louis' death, what might their rule have been like? Or would we not be able to know?

Napoleon,_Prince_Imperial - the sole son of Napoleon III.

[Thande]

Originally Posted by LSCatilina

In the other hand, many people emigrating in another place are called by this. Lenormand is a breton name, because the guy probably is the grandgrandson of a normand that make it to Brittany.

This is true of surnames in general. Hence why there are lots of people with surnames that are the names of little villages, but hardly anyone with a surname like London or York--because A) people were moving from the countryside to the big cities, so they would be known as "that guy who moved here from that place", and B) because there would be so many Peters in London that calling someone Peter of London would not be a useful identifier. People who took the surname Welch would not have been living in Wales, they would have been Welsh people living in England who were known as "so-and-so (the) Welch(man)" And so on.

[Grey Wolf]

Originally Posted by Thande

This is true of surnames in general. Hence why there are lots of people with surnames that are the names of little villages, but hardly anyone with a surname like London or York--because A) people were moving from the countryside to the big cities, so they would be known as "that guy who moved here from that place", and B) because there would be so many Peters in London that calling someone Peter of London would not be a useful identifier. People who took the surname Welch would not have been living in Wales, they would have been Welsh people living in England who were known as "so-and-so (the) Welch(man)" And so on.

When I was in Yorkshire, there were people with the surnames Snaith and Yeadon, small places in Yorkshire, and nobody called Mr York or Mr Doncaster

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

[Shtudmuffin]

Originally Posted by Tizoc

Napoleon,_Prince_Imperial - the sole son of Napoleon III.

Ok, that makes sense. But who would have become the regent when Napoleon III died and his son was next in line?

Also, when do monarchs usually start ruling and do not need a regent anymore?

[LSCatilina]

Originally Posted by Shtudmuffin

Also, when do monarchs usually start ruling and do not need a regent anymore?

Depends of the era, and of the place. The majority of a king is of 13/14 (the texts are ambigous and can be understood as "once 13 years completed") in medieval France while it's later in Spain.

And, of course, it depends a LOT of the political situation. Nothing oppose to have regent of a king having 20 if the political faction manage to held the power and have the king formally accepting it.

Now, if you're talking about REAL ruling and not only "he's the king"...Depends of the monarch and of the political situation totally.

[LSCatilina]

Originally Posted by Grey Wolf

When I was in Yorkshire, there were people with the surnames Snaith and Yeadon, small places in Yorkshire, and nobody called Mr York or Mr Doncaster

It would make little sense to call someone "Mr York" in York where EVERYONE is from York.

It makes sense only when you are in London when you have big odds to be one of the few coming from York.

[Shtudmuffin]

Ok, I have another question: what was the military and economic strength of the Papal States relative to the other states of the Italian peninsula in the 1770s?

[Grey Wolf]

Originally Posted by LSCatilina

It would make little sense to call someone "Mr York" in York where EVERYONE is from York.

It makes sense only when you are in London when you have big odds to be one of the few coming from York.

Sorry, I thought that was what I was saying

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

[LSCatilina]

Originally Posted by Grey Wolf

Sorry, I thought that was what I was saying

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

Oh. My bad then.

[Shtudmuffin]

Ok, I really think this thread shouldn't die, so I'll ask another question: How did the Spanish government decide to offer Prince Leopold of the House of Hohenzollern the Kingship of Spain? And how did they contact him-through a personal meeting between him and someone else, or via letter?

[Shtudmuffin]

Originally Posted by Shtudmuffin

Ok, I really think this thread shouldn't die, so I'll ask another question: How did the Spanish government decide to offer Prince Leopold of the House of Hohenzollern the Kingship of Spain? And how did they contact him-through a personal meeting between him and someone else, or via letter?

Anyone?

Please, this thread needs to live long enough so that it's stickied. And I would also like to find the answer to my questions.

[Niko Malaka]

Originally Posted by Shtudmuffin

Ok, I really think this thread shouldn't die, so I'll ask another question: How did the Spanish government decide to offer Prince Leopold of the House of Hohenzollern the Kingship of Spain? And how did they contact him-through a personal meeting between him and someone else, or via letter?

Well, in the mid 1860's it seemed evident to many people that the spanish bourbonic monarchy was going to fall sooner than latter. In this context, in certain prusian diplomatic circles (with contacts amognst the partisans of general O'Donell (Liberal Union) and other malcontents with Isabel II) the posibility of a Hohenzollern in the spanish throne once Isabel II was overthrown, in a similar way that the Hohenzollerns had a member in the romanian throne (a foot in he east and another foot in the west, was the idea) was sugested. Anyway, with Isabel II still on her throne both Bismark and Wilhem I were cautious about these manifestation. Georg von Werthern, former minister of Prussia in Madrid was the more ative and enthusiast about this possibility, to the point of trying to convince the head of the House of Hohenzollern-Sigmaringen to take actions to prepare the terrain before the fall of Isabell II. Of course, in certain political prussian milieux the idea of an anti-french alliance with Spain (as with Belgium and Italy) seemed very actrative, specially considering the support given by Isabel II to Napoleon III.

So, when the diverse anti-Isabel forces signed hat is know as "The Pact of Ostend" in 1866 to coordinate their efforts against the bourbonic regime and sparking what would be later the "Glorious Revolution" that Forced Isabel II into the exile (1868), this possibility was already been proposed, though it was hardly a prioritary option (the first names officaly propossed where Ferdinand of Portugal and the Duke of Montpensier) on their inner debates about what to do after the revolutionary victory.

Regarding the formalization of the proposal to the Hohenzollern candidate, there is some darkness in the spanish sources, probably because the international consequences embarrassed the spanish side. But it was a personal bet promoted by the then spanish Premier, General Prim (who pretty much was the most powerful figure in the spanish provisional government after the revolution) through his agent in Germany, Eusebio de Salazar, who met with the Hohenzollern-Sigmaringen House and prussian diplomatic authorities, with the parallel support of Bismarck, who liked the idea for obvious reasons. There is also the fact that not many european royals wanted to take in charge the spanish throne, considering the political inesability of Spain at the time.

Edit: Oh yes, as Tocomocho mentions, Prim in person also met with the head of the House of Hohenzollern-Sirmaringen.

Cheers.

[Shtudmuffin]

Originally Posted by Niko Malaka

Well, in the mid 1860's it seemed evident to many people that the spanish bourbonic monarchy was going to fall sooner than latter. In this context, in certain prusian diplomatic circles (with contacts amognst the partisans of general O'Donell (Liberal Union) and other malcontents with Isabel II) the posibility of a Hohenzollern in the spanish throne once Isabel II was overthrown, in a similar way that the Hohenzollerns had a member in the romanian throne (a foot in he east and another foot in the west, was the idea) was sugested. Anyway, with Isabel II still on her throne both Bismark and Wilhem I were cautious about these manifestation. Georg von Werthern, former minister of Prussia in Madrid was the more ative and enthusiast about this possibility, to the point of trying to convince the head of the House of Hohenzollern-Sigmaringen to take actions to prepare the terrain before the fall of Isabell II. Of course, in certain political prussian milieux the idea of an anti-french alliance with Spain (as with Belgium and Italy) seemed very actrative, specially considering the support given by Isabel II to Napoleon III.

So, when the diverse anti-Isabel forces signed hat is know as "The Pact of Ostend" in 1866 to coordinate their efforts against the bourbonic regime and sparking what would be later the "Glorious Revolution" that Forced Isabel II into the exile (1868), this possibility was already been proposed, though it was hardly a prioritary option (the first names officaly propossed where Ferdinand of Portugal and the Duke of Montpensier) on their inner debates about what to do after the revolutionary victory.

Regarding the formalization of the proposal to the Hohenzollern candidate, there is some darkness in the spanish sources, probably because the international consequences embarrassed the spanish side. But it was a personal bet promoted by the then spanish Premier, General Prim (who pretty much was the most powerful figure in the spanish provisional government after the revolution) through his agent in Germany, Eusebio de Salazar, who met with the Hohenzollern-Sigmaringen House and prussian diplomatic authorities, with the parallel support of Bismarck, who liked the idea for obvious reasons. There is also the fact that not many european royals wanted to take in charge the spanish throne, considering the political inesability of Spain at the time.

Edit: Oh yes, as Tocomocho mentions, Prim in person also met with the head of the House of Hohenzollern-Sirmaringen.

Cheers.

Thank you so much, this answers a lot. But as usual, I must follow up with another question: Who voted Amadeo I in as king? Was it an elected assembly, or just a popular vote?

[Niko Malaka]

Originally Posted by Shtudmuffin

Thank you so much, this answers a lot. But as usual, I must follow up with another question: Who voted Amadeo I in as king? Was it an elected assembly, or just a popular vote?

You are welcome. Amadeo I was elected by the Parliament amongst a serie of options (including Montpensier, Alfonso of Bourbon and Espartero, though the Federal Republic got more votes than any of those three).

[Velasco]

King Antiochus X Eusebes of Syria (Seleucid) joined a Queen Laodice of the Arabs fighting the Parthians c.88BC. Elsewhere I've seen her called Queen of the Gileadites, Queen of Samosata, Queen of the Calamans, or of the Samenian Arabs (Galihnw`n or Samhnw`n ). Her name would suggest a Seleucid, or at very least Greek, background, as does Antiochus' readiness to support her.

Anyone have any idea on a) who this was? b) what tribe this was?

[Grimbald]

If so when and how?

[Zuvarq]

Originally Posted by Grimbald

If so when and how?

That's straying into alternate history.

Though I think the US bought Alaska to increase chances of getting British Columbia.